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We started this discussion in my thread requesting info about backyard permaculture. It was suggested that I use my little hot tub for a fish pond, since we're not using it as a hot tub.
So, here's the idea.
I have a little square hot tub. I checked, and it's about 5X5 feet, with a 2X2 or so deep section that's maybe four feet deep, and the rest being about two feet deep. I'm including pictures.
The suggestion was that, instead of having an energy-devouring, heated hot tub (which we don't use, breeds mosquitos, and is generally a pain in my rear), we try putting little fish into it and make it into a part of our backyard ecosystem. We're going for permaculture ideas - a yard we don't have to maintain other than a few prunings or chop-and-drop mulchings and so on, and a place that makes lots of food for the family.
I don't even know where to start, although I'm learning. Here's the hot tub picture.
Here's a picture of the water that's in it. It's rainwater. It's gross. We've bailed it out a lot, and we're tired of bailing out bucket after bucket of icky green water with mosquitoes!
The gray soft cover we have is simply not sufficient - rainwater weighs it down and slips in anyway.
In short, we know very little about this tub, it's in the condition it came to us in (neglected), and we haven't been able to maintain it. We want a better way - until we pulled the fuse, we were paying to heat it in the winter!
So... now that you've seen the tub... do folks still think we could harvest edible fish from it? What kinds? How do we do it? If no edible fish, is there any way we could turn it into something that _would_ produce some sort of edibles? What sort of electric / plumbing work would we have to do? Dig things out of it? Change it drastically?
The man was surprisingly happy about the idea. Apparently, the tub has been weighing on his mind as well, and the very idea of standing outside on a summer day and going "Who wants grilled fish?" and going to _get_ one, right there...
I don't have much advice on converting it to a pond but it seems like it could work . . . you could probably even use the hot tubs jets as a pump? Of course, some of those jets are pretty powerful, I can just imagine the poor little goldfish being launched from side to side by the force of the water.
Have you considered selling the hot tub though? That way you could just get rid of the headache and make a few dollars in the process and then use that money to buy some of the food-producing plants you want. Or you could use the proceeds to start up a more traditional pond.
You get 7.4 gallons per cubic foot. If we assume that the 5x5 is 2 feet deep and the 2x2 is an additional 2 feet that gives you 68 cubic feet which is 503 gallons. This is a goodly amount for a starter pond. Lets say you want to raise catfish and eat them at 8 inches. I would suggest 3 gallons per inch of fish. That means that you could raise 20 eight inch catfish in that pond the all natural way. When you add the fingerlings, they will only be about two inches long so if you expect to lose some, you could add 40 fingerlings. That is 12 gallons per fish which is way more than enough but remember how fast they grow. I suspect that if you dont lose any you will have to start eating them at six inches. If you want to raise them to a large size such as 12-14 inches, you can only have about 12 in there. Of course, you can start eating them at 6 inches and let the rest grow bigger.
I would probably but a pond pump/filter. If you want to try a natural approach, try the pond pump/filter, 8 inches of sand blasting gravel in the 2x2 area and add plants. Whatever you do, dont take out that green water you have in there now. It is full of all the bacteria you want. Fill the hot tube up with water 8 inches every five days with dechlorinator until it is full. That way you arent killing the bacteria.
Good luck and dont add fish for at least 4 weeks minimum.
Gardensox has a good point. You can build one very easy with landscaping timbers and pond liner. I dug mine about 2.5 feet deep and about 1.5 feet above ground for a total of 4 feet. I did it for about 125.00. I am guess-timating.
It's embedded in that big slab of cement you see in the pictures. Digging it out and getting to the plumbing would probably be so much work, people wouldn't want to buy it for a price that would pay for the work.
The man really likes catfish. Are there any others that would work in a pond that size?
I'm glad the water is good - it looks ugly as heck.
I don't _have_ to fill it, honestly. The rain we get (all year) is sufficient that, if I don't touch it, we eventually get a full tub. The cup runneth over, so to speak - we have to bail water out to keep it from overflowing. *laugh*
If rainwater works well enough, then I won't have to worry about dechlorinator or anything else - it fills up just fine without me.
I'll look into the price of a pond pump. You're right, the jets are pretty powerful for little fishies. Do pumps just sort of hang over the edge? Do they plug in? Are there solar ones?
Where do I buy sand blasting gravel?
Do I have to worry about it freezing in the winter?
Woo, this is exciting! Turning that ugly monstrosity into something useful and natural and lovely is an invigorating project. :)
You could rig a "hang on" pond pump/filter or one that sits on the side. I think you will probably want one with a filter on it since you are a beginner. Dont use the pumps on the hot tub. You can get sand blasting gravel at larger fish stores or at Home Depots. It is just like pea gravel but smaller. It is about the size of a BB. You will definitely have to worry about it freezing in your area. You will probably have to cover it with plastic with some small holes and a 200w heater minimum. You could also look at the solar pond heaters if you get lots of sun in the winter. Catfish are pretty cold tolerant but since that is above ground it will get much colder than an in ground pond. The 200W heater is just to keep it from icing. You might be able to get away with a 100W with the plastic but I imagine the water will still be around 35 degrees when it gets real cold.
Rain water rocks. Use rainwater as much as you can. If this rainwater is coming directly off a shingle roof then there might be issues.
Ok, will check the price at Home Depot. Do you recommend a particular heater? I know nothing about keeping fish, I've never done it. Not even indoors. :)
What kind of plastic? We have a plastic cover for it, but it's gray, solid, and really heavy. I hate the thing. I'm using it to kill grass in the yard currently. :P
The tub, because of where it is, has almost constant sun all year round. As long as it's not raining.
Oh, and the rainfall issue... the amount of water in there has just about doubled since those pictures. Another couple of weeks and it'll be full. Seriously. I don't have to add anything. :)
And there's no roof nearby - this is just the rain falling into the tub itself.
You know, I didn't realize it, but we get a LOT of rain. 0.o
Just a cheap stick on heater. Really, all you are trying to do is keep the water from freezing. 100-200 watts heater will be in a tube about 14 inches long. Call around for pricing. I think you will do better at Walmart or a local pet store than Home Depot.
Use a thick clear plastic in the winter. This you can get at Home Depot. It will retain the heat in the tub but needs to let sunlight in for the plants and fishy. You will have to put holes in the plastic for ventilation and oxygen or tape three sides of the plastic and leave a gap on the fourth side.. You will lose some heat that way, but that's okay. Dont put the plastic on until it is consistently cold because it can really heat up in there when the sun hits it. Dont forget the filter for water movement and filtration. Water movement is what gives water oxygen. When people put bubblers in aquariums, it isnt the bubbles giving the water oxygen. When the bubbles come to the top of the water they create movement that mixes oxygen on the surface of the water. If you have a filter, it releases the water back into the tank on the surface. Certain fish, such as goldfish and catfish, can breathe air directly as well as from the water and that is why some fish dont require pumps. However, I wouldnt try that your first time around.
Some people in Florida have been growing tilapia in back yard man-made ponds or converted hot tubs. One friend who does so, also harvests crayfish from his at times. Down here we have to have some plants that cover part of the surface so it doesn't get too hot, plus the plants will take up the CO2 and contribute some oxygen. And they can provide an additional food source for the fish.
Rainwater is excellent, but you might still consider draining off or bailing some water a few times a year. Dissolved minerals from the gravel and from whatever else is in the air or on the plants will eventually mess with the chemistry of your fish farm. Evaporation just concentrates that stuff. Bailing or draining some and replacing with good water just slows that down. If you really do get enough rain, you might simply bail some water before a major storm.
A really good method of this is using the pond water to water your yard plants since it is full of wonderful nutrients from the fish that your plants will love.
The crawfish farm sounds like an excellent idea. I bet you could get higher yields than with catfish.
I dont have any experience with Tilapia but I dont think it would work for her unless she had more water movement and lots of more heat. I think they are sub-tropical fish.
We're definitely not sub-tropical. We haven't been having the crack freezes I was used to in New England, but it does get reasonably cold here. I have no idea if it gets bad enough to freeze the hot tub solid - but there'd definitely be surface freeze if we weren't careful, and that would make the water pretty cold.
I thought of freshwater cod or trout, but I think they get way too big. What other sorts of fish would be good to try?
You probably want to stay away from fish that require lots of water movement. I will check out some sites and see if I can find some fish other than catfish. You might also look into snails. They grow very very fast and you can probably get more bang for your buck. Some freshwater snails get bigger than golf balls.
lizzymahonney, I've been following this thread and am a few miles up the A1A corridor from you. Tailpia and crawfish, my mouth is watering and I have a pond, Where do you get the fingerlings, (baby tailpia ?) and the crayfish/crawfish ? I'd love to do this if it's possible. And how big does the pond have to be, and what water plants do I need. Look at my pond, am attaching pictures, and this pond is approx. 3 foot deep, I'd say around 8 ft in circumference. Even if it's only possible to do a few at a time , as needed, there's only 2 of us in the home, and it's be wonderful to go out back and get your dinner, my salad, potatos, and fish for the evening. Talk about sustainable living, I'm on it! lol
I don't know where my Orlando friends got their tilapia starts, but I know the one guy met a fellow at Kellyco in Longwood. They're the artificial pond and metal detecting company.
One guy was using a hot tub set up which I didn't see. The other used a pond liner and railroad ties. The pondliner guy was the one with the crayfish in addition to tilapia. I know he got them from local waterways, which is how I've gotten a few. My crayfish were in an indoor tank, about 30 gallons, the former hospital tank for my several aquaria. I was growing some aquatic weed and snails I'd scooped in a paper cup, and somehow got crayfish and other stuff. (Hydra were annoying, but a few gold fish took care of them.) Pondliner guy did some scouting instruction on water ecology, and crayfish were a happy accident for him, too. Neither of us ever had enough apple snails to harvest them, though.
I'd read what the above folks have to say about it. You might find someone on Craigslist who has been raising tilapia that will have a few to start you off, or this guy apparently will provide you with fingerlings if his breeding stock is too expensive for now.
I lost the tilapia friends in a divorce. Sorta kidding, but only a little.
thanks for the info, I'm going to look into a couple of ideas that have been posted here. We want "something " in the pond, and it wouldn't have to be edible, but help the pond stay clean end eco friendly, I guess that would be the right phrase, As it is, I have no plants or fish, but am getting plenty of frogs!! Hmm, you can eat frog legs, But, I wouldn't eat these guys, their more like family since I see and hear them every day.lol As we go into the fall months I guess you also have to think about the weather, even here in Florida, and we do get some cold air in the winters, sometimes even a freeze or two. So I will have to put some thought into this adventure.
My pool is officially full enough to go, but I'm at a loss still for filters. We simply haven't had any money to put into it. The pond filters I've seen have all been upwards of 200 dollars - and we're lucky to pull together a tenth of that.
Anyone have any ideas?
I think I have a nice thick sheet of plastic that would work as a cover, if I weight the edges and poke holes into it... it used to be a tablecloth cover.
Pond filters are going to be very expensive. You can always try plants and just a powerhead with a sponge. I bet you can find a really cheap one on EBAY.
There are cheaper pond filters there as well. MAKE SURE THEY COME WITH A PUMP if you get one.
If you wanted to, you could get a hangon aquarium filter for a 100 gallon and modify it to work on your pond. Those are available for real cheap.
Craigslist always has pond stuff on sale for cheap.
The main thing you want to do now is get it cycled. Go get a dozen feeder goldfish for 12 cents a piece at Petsmart or a local pet store. If you are going to do plants, add the 6 inches of sand blasting gravel now so a good healthy bed forms.
Clean the gravel before adding. If you add dirt now, the whole thing will get cloudy for weeks without a filter. Just some goldfish, gravel and cold tolerant water plants in pots will do fine.
