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Aroids: My "monster" Konjack SHRUNK!

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tommyr2006
Poughkeepsie, NY

October 15, 2010
8:09 AM

Post #8157241

Well I dug up my 11 1/2"across, 13 pound Konjac I planted this past spring yesterday. She SHRUNK! She's now 8" across and 4 pounds. She produced no babies either. Since she did bloom this past spring I guess I attribute the shrinkage to that.

Anyone experience this? I suppose it is normal.

tropicbreeze
noonamah
Australia

October 15, 2010
5:41 PM

Post #8158108

I don't know if it's normal, but it is logical. Flowering and fruiting take a lot of energy and nutrient which would have taken out most of the old tuber. Wouldn't have been a lot left for a leaf which in turn wouldn't have been able to produce a very large tuber.
tommyr2006
Poughkeepsie, NY

October 15, 2010
6:05 PM

Post #8158144

She produced a normal leaf this year but I guess the flowering did take a lot out of her.
Lesson learned! Adds more info to my brain!

Brains are pink, wonder why they call it "gray matter"?
ExoticRainforest
Siloam Springs, AR

October 16, 2010
8:18 AM

Post #8158864

The process is normal. The starch stored in the tuber provides a source of energy for the production of the inflorescence. This can be reversed to some degree by the use of fertilizer during the growth period. Most of my friends that are Amorphophallus growers use either 10-15-10 or 20-30-20 on a regular basis.

Steve

ExoticRainforest
Siloam Springs, AR

October 16, 2010
8:29 AM

Post #8158885

I just looked over an article by Dr. Wilbert Hetterscheid who is the world authority on the genus that may be helpful:

http://www.aroid.org/genera/amorphophallus/amcult.php

Steve

tommyr2006
Poughkeepsie, NY

October 16, 2010
9:06 AM

Post #8158936

Thanks much for the info Steve!

I use a 1/4 strength orchid feed on mine at every watering.

ExoticRainforest
Siloam Springs, AR

October 16, 2010
4:18 PM

Post #8159561

That should work. I prefer the pellet type which I use every couple of months. I am most concerned about the growth of my A. titanum and "over feed" it just a bit.

Steve

tropicalnut777
Provo, UT
(Zone 5a)

February 28, 2012
5:13 PM

Post #9023851

my konjac corms are 1/2 original size.. corms are firm so im hoping when the flower
stalk slufs off eventually.. and i get potted up.. i can get the corm to put on some size for
next yr..
?? does konjac flower every year?? if corms gets good sized again...
i understand the titanum doesnt..or is not predictable..that is after the corm is of size
where it will/can flower...
tropicbreeze
noonamah
Australia

February 28, 2012
8:12 PM

Post #9024051

You have to remember that the tuber is "swallowed up" entirely each year. It's a new one that developed during the growing season. Ideally you should pot up the tuber when it first starts growing, whether it's a flower or a leaf. When it's in soil it will put out roots and start to draw in nutrients. If you leave it out the only nutrients it can get are in the tuber, so it will be depleted sooner. This means a flower will do well but the following leaf will be a bit starved, not grow as big and consequently slow down the new tuber growth. It will make a difference if you get the roots happening as early as possible. I don't know whether konjac flowers each year but the paeoniifolius doesn't, the bulbifer does. With the galbra I haven't been able to tell yet.
tommyr2006
Poughkeepsie, NY

February 29, 2012
3:49 AM

Post #9024226

Ahhh, makes sense. Thanks! I have a flower stalk 34" tall right now, growing about 2 inches per day!
tropicbreeze
noonamah
Australia

February 29, 2012
12:16 PM

Post #9024721

That's one of the amazing things about Amorphs, you can sit there and almost see them grow.
tropicalnut777
Provo, UT
(Zone 5a)

February 29, 2012
2:54 PM

Post #9024921

much thanks tropic !! i'll get mine potted up right away.. i would love to get corms i
have to get to a BIGGIE corm..in couple yrs.. :)
tommyr2006
Poughkeepsie, NY

March 3, 2012
1:48 PM

Post #9028504

One Konjac about to open!

Thumbnail by tommyr2006
Click the image for an enlarged view.

tommyr2006
Poughkeepsie, NY

March 3, 2012
1:49 PM

Post #9028505

I potted her this afternoon:

Thumbnail by tommyr2006
Click the image for an enlarged view.

tropicbreeze
noonamah
Australia

March 3, 2012
8:12 PM

Post #9028970

That inflorescence looks way out of proportion to the tuber. My bulbifer produced an inflorescence quicker than I'd expected so it got potted not long before the spathe opened. But it was smaller in relation to the tuber than what your konjac is.
tropicalnut777
Provo, UT
(Zone 5a)

March 4, 2012
8:40 AM

Post #9029408

great pics tommy !!.. i hope my biggest konjac corms put on some size for next yr..
whether they bloom or not..
sure grateful for good practical postings here.. i was going to leave my
corms out of soil till flower spike withered..and new vegy spike started to grow..
hope ya get a HUGE flower tommy !!!
ive seen a few titanum corms up on auction on ebay.. havent bid on one yet.. i dont
know that these corms are really as big as i want.. im thinking a 6-8# corm is several yrs
away from flowering..??? do u all think same??? that is with a titanum...
in summer my yard is full of tropicals anymore.. why do i live in utah??? LOL i can
see potted up amorphs being added to my collection now.. :)
good stuff...
tropicalnut777
Provo, UT
(Zone 5a)

March 4, 2012
12:51 PM

Post #9029668

heres pic of my 3 biggest konjac .. finally got pic posted here..
they finished flowering from 2 weeks ago to just last week..
??? how often does everyone water them.. right now.. ??
pic is just after i potted them up.. so i watered them good..
how about until vegetative growth starts..and then when they do
have vegy growth going??
much thanks...

Thumbnail by tropicalnut777
Click the image for an enlarged view.

tommyr2006
Poughkeepsie, NY

March 4, 2012
5:56 PM

Post #9030024

After mine bloom I don't water again until I see the leaf stalk coming up through the top of the soil. It could take 3-4 weeks. Then I start watering with a 1/4 - 1/2 strength fertilizer mix. Orchid food is what I normally use but Miracle grow is o.k. too or any 10-10-10 food.
tommyr2006
Poughkeepsie, NY

March 11, 2012
8:57 AM

Post #9037966

She has begun her 2-3 day stinkfest!

Thumbnail by tommyr2006
Click the image for an enlarged view.

tropicalnut777
Provo, UT
(Zone 5a)

March 11, 2012
9:07 AM

Post #9037982

lol tommy.. :) great flower ya got there !!
of the 3 corms i have potted up.. the flower stalks are staying firm?? is that normal??
they began to shrivel up while bareroot..but now potted up..they are firm..
im guessing they are absorbing moisture from the little in the soil.. im thinking??
that this is good..that more moisture is going into the corm as well.. i dont want to disturb
the pot and check the corm out..i dont take this as a negative thing..???
anyone else think so too??
ive been taking them outside on sunny warm days lately..
yea!! weve actually had some 60F days lately..
spring at last !!!!!
tommyr2006
Poughkeepsie, NY

March 11, 2012
9:18 AM

Post #9038005

When the flower stalk flops over just cut it off about an inch or two from the soil surface. Shortly after you'll be able to gently pull it off. The Leaf will be under it and should start up in about a month.
tropicalnut777
Provo, UT
(Zone 5a)

March 11, 2012
9:57 AM

Post #9038059

thanks tommy !! i was suprised that the flower stalk firmed up again..it had started to wither..
im looking foward to see the vegetative groth of my konjac's.
and bigger corms next yr.. !!!!
?? how tall is your flower now tommy?? how big of a pot is that too??
i understand its important to give lots of room for the roots..so ya end up with even
larger corm for next season...
couple more days of stinky huh..hehehehehhee :)
tommyr2006
Poughkeepsie, NY

March 11, 2012
11:11 AM

Post #9038151

The pot is 12" across. I probably should have went a bit bigger actually. The flower itself from top tip to the base of the flower is 26". I have 2 4-5 inch diameter corms to plant yet.
tropicalnut777
Provo, UT
(Zone 5a)

April 26, 2012
8:30 PM

Post #9099446

tommy..??hows your konjac doing?? did you try to pollinate it?
ive asked friends that hit yard sales to buy up any BIG black plastic pots for me..:)
im sure going to need them next yr.. i hate spending $30 for a big sturdy pot at homedepot when
ya can get a used one for $5 :)
my konjac that have berries are doing well still..YEA.. berries are plumping up a bit more..
im guessing in couple months they will turn..and ripen.. then its.. planting them.. :)
i think my neighbors are going to hate me..nest yr.. LOL
tropicbreeze
noonamah
Australia

April 26, 2012
9:45 PM

Post #9099513

Neighbours? More likely the whole district, the way you're going, LOL. The last 2 of my konjacs are finally turning it in. They started off the size of peas at the beginning of the season. Looking forward to seeing how much they've grown. They've had a good 6 months of growth.
tommyr2006
Poughkeepsie, NY

April 27, 2012
6:36 PM

Post #9100600

I never try to pollinate or wait for seeds. The main corms produces enough baby corms in the fall to keep me in supply.
tropicalnut777
Provo, UT
(Zone 5a)

April 27, 2012
7:26 PM

Post #9100657

i think its the challenge for me..LOL if i havent tried it. hey..
why not try it..:)
?? tommyr..how big do your corms have to be to get baby corms??
tommyr2006
Poughkeepsie, NY

April 28, 2012
5:37 AM

Post #9100930

Not that big at all. Softball sized or so.
tropicalnut777
Provo, UT
(Zone 5a)

April 28, 2012
2:13 PM

Post #9101457

very nice tommyr... i guess i'll be getting baby corms too then..
yea!!! lol
couple of my larger konjac that i didnt polinate are sending up vegy spike now
i put them in ok pots..about 4" space on each side .. i guess the more room the better>>>???
to accomodate the roots and give plenty of room for them to grow out..??
with last ones ive bought..im going to try them right in ground..but im going to do as recommended
here.. make a raised bed.. filled with same good loamy,well draining soil.. bed should warm up nicely..
and stay that way thru oct.. so ..hopefully a good long growing season for them... hopefully.. never
know what mother nature throws our way..

tommyr2006
Poughkeepsie, NY

April 29, 2012
8:18 AM

Post #9102398

Four inches a side sounds good to me, as long as it has real good drainage.
tropicalnut777
Provo, UT
(Zone 5a)

June 15, 2012
8:45 PM

Post #9167116

tommyr.. hows your konjac's doing?? are you going to try to
get your biggest one back up to HUGE size for blooming next spring??
one of my average corms that bloomed..but i didnt pollinate.. and now in leaf is doing pretty
good..
one thing ive noticed is the stalk has grown in girth the last couple weeks.. im guessing thats good..???
heres a pic of it

Thumbnail by tropicalnut777
Click the image for an enlarged view.

tommyr2006
Poughkeepsie, NY

June 16, 2012
6:06 AM

Post #9167321

My larger ones are throwing up the leaf spikes. One is about 8 inches tall so far, the others are just breaking the soil surface. Yours looks great!

Pics once my leafs open up.
tropicalnut777
Provo, UT
(Zone 5a)

June 23, 2012
7:49 PM

Post #9177802

how are your leaf spikes comming along tommy? hope good.. :)
we are having such hot weather..for mid june.. whew..
ive moved leafed out amorphs to place where they get semi shade after 2pm.. leaves look good
so i guess the full hot sun isnt doing any harm..ive sure had to water more though.. the pots get light
after just 2 days.. im anxious to see how big my largest corms get after this growing season..
i hope ive done what they need to replentish energy..
stalk on largest konjac has gotten to a real nice size in girth..at widest its just shy of 5 "
i think next yr i will put many of the bigger ones in even bigger pots..
tommy?? what fertilizer do you use on your amorphs?
im using a 3/4 full strength 20:6:6 right now.. twice a week..i was advised by lari ann to
go to a even 14:14:14 mid summer..followed by a higher P fertilizer last 6 weeks before they come
in..
love these amorphs !!! addictive arent they.. :)
tommyr2006
Poughkeepsie, NY

June 24, 2012
10:16 AM

Post #9178536

My largest one is about to open it's leaf. The 2 slightly smaller ones are getting there but a little behind. My baby corms (dime to quarter size) are not showing yet. Photos to come shortly once they open!

Mine get very early Sun only and shade the rest of the day.

I'm feeding 20-20-20 at full strength once a week or every 2 weeks.

Thanks!
tropicalnut777
Provo, UT
(Zone 5a)

June 24, 2012
5:26 PM

Post #9179066

is this about normal time for your konjac to open up? its such a weird season everywhere..
we hit 100F again today.. whew..
they..weather people.. say were to "cool off" into next week.. yea..cool off.. mid 90Fs.. LOL
?? so tommy..do you think im giving my konjacs to much sun?? they look good..no burning of
leaves..or wilting..?? this is my 1st vegetative season..so.. i am a rookie..LOL :)
tropicbreeze
noonamah
Australia

June 24, 2012
6:02 PM

Post #9179135

Bright light but not too much direct sun is best for them. Mine grew in shade all day but it was still quite bright. There was a mixed reaction from the different plants to the growing season. Although there wasn't much difference in the size of the leaves there was a huge difference in the size of the tubers. They all started off about the same size.
tropicalnut777
Provo, UT
(Zone 5a)

June 24, 2012
6:26 PM

Post #9179174

hi tropic!! :)
so the more bright light (not hot direct light) you found the corms were much
larger? probably from leaves taking in all that light..and putting energy into the corms??
i think i am giving mine a bit on the strong side of light.. probably later in the summer when
the sun isnt directly overhead..i can move them futher into more "direct light"..
i have several places i can move pots where they'll get good light..just not as direct..
ones i have in the soil..i think i should rig up a shade cloth.. they get direct light..all
day.. they look good..but..thats all day..direct light..
i guess if is hear a cracking noise..and the sides of pots with amorphs in them.. explode..
i'll know the corms are gettin pretty big...?? LOL
tropicbreeze
noonamah
Australia

June 24, 2012
6:39 PM

Post #9179187

With the wild growing paeoniifolius you find them in all sorts of situations. But all the ones growing in predominantely grasslands, and thus more direct sun, are usually much shorter than the ones growing under tree canopy. I'd guess konjac would probably respond the same.
Vestia
San Francisco, CA

June 25, 2012
9:45 AM

Post #9180069

I know it sounds counter-intuitive, but several papers in Japan and China showed that A. konjac and paeoniifolius grew bigger tubers under 75% shade cloth; even better than ones grown under 50% shade. All data showed weights that were significantly higher when heavily shaded versus if grown in the direct sun. Just made me scratch my head, so I thought I would share.

This message was edited Jun 26, 2012 2:03 AM
tropicalnut777
Provo, UT
(Zone 5a)

June 25, 2012
10:05 AM

Post #9180111

vestia..interesting.. can you post those sources..id love to read their research..
it does sound counter to leaves taking in more energy..from more sun.. but maybe its
the corm is put under stress from the direct sun?? but i would love to learn more..
i want to grow some HUGE corms..if i can.. :)
thanks for info..hope you will post sources.. much thanks !!!! :)
tropicbreeze
noonamah
Australia

June 25, 2012
5:07 PM

Post #9180779

You have to remember that for photosysthesis to take place every thing has to line up. Plants can take differing amounts of heat/sun. When they get too much or they start to dry out too much they start to close their stomata. Then it's sort of like a truck stopped in the middle of the road, the rest of the traffic gets backed up behind and stops. So with the plant, water stops passing up from the roots, nutrients stop moving up through the plant, there's no exchange of carbon dioxide and oxygen with the atmosphere so photosynthesis ceases. IE. no growth.
tropicalnut777
Provo, UT
(Zone 5a)

June 25, 2012
5:30 PM

Post #9180810

yeppers.. tropic.. i was trying to make sense of my amorphs..and how they're doing..
which is great!! :) they may be "shorter" than if they were in somewhat shaded area ..for more of
the day.. but..if the corms get huge .. i dont care.. :)
?? for konjac..what should i expect a "normal" height of the vegetative stalk?
my pre flowering corms of 9 #s are now 34" tall above soil level.. with widest girth of stalk
shy of 5 "..?? what do u all think??
?? i guess theres no way to tell about the corm until i take them out of soil/ or pots..
the leaves are great..the vegetative stalks have all grown in girth..
im thinking this is a good sign..??
it is a balance.. soil..soil type,drainage,lack of drainage,fertilizer,sun,how much sun..
im always on the hunt for new/better info on how to make my plants HAPPY CAMPERS !!
:)
much thanks.. love these amorphs!!!!
Vestia
San Francisco, CA

June 26, 2012
2:34 AM

Post #9181357

Sorry, I was looking for the pdf. so I could just send it, but I can't seem to lay hands on it.

Here's a brief synopsis of one of the papers
http://agris.fao.org/agris-search/search/display.do?f=1989/KR/KR89005.xml;KR8835822

Here's one brief reference to it in NZ:
http://www.actahort.org/books/670/670_20.htm

also see:
http://agris.fao.org/agris-search/search/display.do?f=1985/JP/JP85033.xml;JP8502371
http://agris.fao.org/agris-search/search/display.do?f=1986/JP/JP86024.xml;JP8505370

The other odd bit of data was on pot sizes and numbers of tubers per pot - yeilds were higher with more than one tuber per pot - I'll see if I can find it later...
... here's the pdf: http://202.124.205.111/index.php/jurnalagronomi/article/viewFile/3074/2038
Cheers


This message was edited Jun 26, 2012 2:03 AM
tommyr2006
Poughkeepsie, NY

June 30, 2012
6:41 AM

Post #9187245

Alrighty, My largest Konjac is open! 2 smaller ones getting there next to it.

Thumbnail by tommyr2006
Click the image for an enlarged view.

tropicalnut777
Provo, UT
(Zone 5a)

June 30, 2012
4:52 PM

Post #9187975

looks really good tommy!! :) arent they facinating plants..
from a big lumpy corm,sending out a stinky weird flower,then their
beautiful fern/palm like leaves..
hows your weather in poughkeepsie? were having a HOTTTTTT spell..
im saying spell..hoping that we'll get some relief.. sigh..
tommyr2006
Poughkeepsie, NY

June 30, 2012
6:59 PM

Post #9188152

Having a heat wave here. 94 today, hotter yesterday. The second heat wave of the season.

Highest according to my Davis Vantage Vue weather station so far this year is is 99.
tropicalnut777
Provo, UT
(Zone 5a)

June 30, 2012
7:40 PM

Post #9188215

again much thanks vestia..
my take on the 2010 indonesia study on A.muelleri..
1. water limitations affect muelleri going into an early dormancy
2. available rooting material - soil.. limited soil probable connection
to limiting available water..and causing stress to roots..therefore limiting the growth
of the leafing,and corm..
i thought it was also a good observation reference to the Hetterscheid & ittenbotch
study.. the two groupings of amorphs and their respective ecological origins.. and the climate/wet/dry
seasons of those areas..
its like being in college again... love it!! :)
the more i learn about these beauties..hopefully the better i am at keeping them.
good stuff !!!
Vestia
San Francisco, CA

July 3, 2012
7:44 AM

Post #9191109

you're welcome.

In response to what I've read, I'm trying out very large self-watering pots to see if that will reduce any drought-stress.

Also, several of the pots are planted with two tubers per pot.

Will report here if I can observe any differences from previous years.
tropicalnut777
Provo, UT
(Zone 5a)

July 3, 2012
2:56 PM

Post #9191709

thanks vestia..ive been thinking of trying some of the pots developed by aroids.org..
if i understand correctly..they are a meshlike ..all sides porus..
i dont have problem as yet with any of my amorphs..but i was thinking with titanum,hewitti..and if i can
get gigus,and decus-silvae.. those type "porus" pots might be helpful to avoid having to wet a soil..
but then otherside of it is.. im sure i'll have to water more often.. LOL
good luck to you..and hope to see how youre doing !! :)

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