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Hybridizers: Does hot 90+ degrees prevent daylilies from setting pods?

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blomma

blomma
Wyoming, WY
(Zone 4a)

July 19, 2011
11:53 PM

Post #8703014

I have tried to cross daylilies (tetras) without success. About the time my new daylilies began to bloom our temp reached 90 degrees and more for a whole week. Still hot. Last year I had no problems with other daylilies (dips) setting pods.

Are tets more difficult to cross, or is it the heat, or combination of the two? I am new at crossing tets since I recently began to purchase them. I am saving pollen incase the weather cools.

Any advise would be appreciated.

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IndaShade
Kylertown, PA
(Zone 5b)

July 20, 2011
11:27 AM

Post #8703987

Yes, the heat is playing havoc with daylily hybridizing this year. I am losing just about half of all of my morning efforts, and it doesn't seem to matter how early you get out in the beds.

Some years are just like that. :-(

This message was edited Jul 20, 2011 1:28 PM

blomma

blomma
Wyoming, WY
(Zone 4a)

July 20, 2011
1:13 PM

Post #8704216

IndaShade,
Thanks for answering. Darn, I was afraid of that. And I have so many new tets that are starting to bloom. It is still hot here. Was out early this morning crossing them. I collected pollen just incase our weather cools. Purchased those small tubes from a seller on LA. They work great for storing pollen.

You are ahead of me. So far not one bod. I have both tets and dips and neither have set buds. Last year before new tets bloomed, I had so many dip pods.

All I can do is continue and hope for the best.
nhuntley
Holladay, UT
(Zone 5a)

July 21, 2011
12:09 AM

Post #8705298

blomma, it's been really hot here too the last three or four weeks, which is when I've finally had some blooms opening, and I've got at least 15 pods on my tets! The only days that I've been able to get it to work though were early mornings when it was very cloudy. Half of my daylilies are in full sun, and the other half are in part sun. I had almost no success last year with getting seed pods on the tets that are in full sun, but I've had much better luck this year. Like I said though, I've only had luck on the cloudy days, even if it ended up being a really hot day.

Now that I've got lots of blooms ready to open, I need to make something to shade the plants that are in the full sun bed, at least until I can get all of the crosses made. My neighbor had a very large cherry tree cut down a couple of months ago that gave the flowers a little bit of shade in the morning. Now the sun hits that bed as soon as it comes up over the mountains, and the flowers aren't really opening up until they get some sun on them. I don't know why this is happening, because the other bed gets no morning sun, but the flowers are opening up just fine!

Natalie

blomma

blomma
Wyoming, WY
(Zone 4a)

July 21, 2011
5:02 PM

Post #8707098

Natalie, I don't have one pod, or even the start of one on my tets so far. Likewise on my dips. Here I thought wow to cross all my new tet daylilies. What a letdown.

I'm saving pollen just incase it cools off and I have better luck. 100 degrees in the sun today and that is where my daylilies are growing. I was out early this morning so hope that works.

My dayliles just started to bloom about 2 weeks ago and I still have plenty of buds to go. It can't stay hot forever----can it? This is WY. No problem with the buds opening but I noticed that by late afternoon they don't look fresh around the edges and some look like they have bleached spots on them, especially red ones.

Lilly
nhuntley
Holladay, UT
(Zone 5a)

July 21, 2011
10:20 PM

Post #8707753

Lilly, I had the same problem last year. It took me forever to get a pod on a tet, and this year, all the pods are on tets, but it's only because I haven't crossed any dips yet. I'm sure I'll have better luck with the dips, but the ones I want to cross haven't started blooming well yet. I've had some failures too, so it's not like I've got a perfect record! I'm out there before the sun can hit them, when they are barely opening, and I think that has something to do with it. The ones that are in the shade in the morning have been pretty easy so far. It's the ones that are in the full sun bed that I've had more failures with. But, it's working occasionally, so I'm happy if I get a few pods. Tets are harder to cross, so I keep that in mind when it doesn't work, and then I don't feel so bad!

I really do believe that if you could make something to shade them while you are doing the crosses, and leave it up for a while afterwards, it would be a big help. I still haven't made myself something, but I really need to do that. Even an old sheet would work if you could make something to hang it off of. I keep thinking I'll make something fancy, but it doesn't need to be fancy! It just needs to keep the sun off of them for a while! I think just a long piece of rebar stuck in the ground, a few feet apart, with a sheet hung between the two pieces would be enough. Not fancy, and certainly not expensive! I'd rather spend my money on plants!

Another suggestion would be to look the plants up on Tinkers and see if the ones you are trying to cross have any offspring that have been registered. I always look at the pod and pollen count to see if one number is higher, if there are a lot of offspring. If most or all of the offspring are registered as being from the pollen of the flower, it's a pretty safe bet that it won't set seed, no matter how hard you try!

Let me know how it goes! I'll be cheering for you!

Natalie
IndaShade
Kylertown, PA
(Zone 5b)

July 22, 2011
6:58 AM

Post #8708233

In the southern areas of the country, they do their hem hybridizing in greenhouses or under shade cloth and it does make a difference. Unfortunately, those of us in the north don't always do that. I have very little shade in my yard yet--everything is in full sun.

blomma

blomma
Wyoming, WY
(Zone 4a)

July 22, 2011
11:58 PM

Post #8710078

Natalie,
I'm surprised that some of your dip hems haven't started to bloom yet. You are in a warmer zone than I am. Mine started with Stella de Oro about 2 weeks ago. Last year I had plenty of dip pods. We had some hot weather but not for so long a stretch as this year. Thanks for advise.

My dips are in a seperate bed on the west side of my house. It is shady there most of the morning. So far that has not helped getting pods. My tets new for me this year are in full sun in a different bed. Likewise no pods. Not all are blooming since most got planted end of May. I am surprised that the new ones are even blooming.

I could hang a sheet from the 4ft fence to give them shade. Trouble is the wind. The sheet would probably sail to my neighbors yard. Saturday will be a few degrees cooler so will get out early to cross.

Lilly
nhuntley
Holladay, UT
(Zone 5a)

July 23, 2011
9:53 AM

Post #8710710

Lilly, I've been surprised at the lack of blooms on some of my dips. They were blooming away last year, and everything was blooming at once. Making crosses was super hectic! This year has been totally different! The dips have just now started opening up, and the tets started on July 4th. Tomorrow will be hectic because it looks like some of everything will be blooming! I guess I'll be up before the sun!

Natalie

blomma

blomma
Wyoming, WY
(Zone 4a)

July 24, 2011
10:33 PM

Post #8713458

Natalie, strangely my tets began to bloom before my dips. However, I have only had tets as of last season. Ordered more that I planted end of May and quite a few of those are now blooming. They started about 2 weeks ago but since they are newly planted, not so may blooms. The dips are now really putting on a show and when I checked today, I am getting some pods growing. Only one pod growing on my tets so far (CHINESE CHARIOT). Newer dawned on me that heat would play a role on daylilies forming pods.

I am out early in the morning also and cross tets eventhough the blooms may not be fully open. If I need to, I use pollen that I have saved. No clouds here except late in the afternoon when we do get it. About the time the tets began to really bloom, we had rain in the late afternoon every day for a week. I don't suppose that helped my crosses any.

How long does the pollen have to be on the pistil before rain would not undo the cross?

Lilly
nhuntley
Holladay, UT
(Zone 5a)

July 25, 2011
8:42 AM

Post #8714050

Lilly, Congratulations on getting a pod on a tet! I was so excited when I got that first one last year, after many failures! I have way more tets this year, and my success rate is way higher this year, but I think a lot of it has to do with the huge amount of cloud cover we had when they were first blooming for the season. Today would have been the perfect morning to be making crosses because it's cooler and cloudy, but sadly, half the state was up all night setting off fireworks, so I got no sleep. It was Pioneer Day here in Utah yesterday (a state holiday), so I'll drag myself out of bed tomorrow before the sun comes up!

I've had really good luck with saved pollen. I've had to use a lot of it this year because I had so many new flowers that bloomed before my older ones have. I was really worried about that, but it's gone really well.

Good question about how long the pollen needs to be on before the rain can undo the cross. I don't have an answer, so I hope someone else will know the answer. I know I've got a few pods that set on days that it rained, but I can't remember how long it was after I dabbed on the pollen that the rain started. One morning we weren't expecting rain, and I was out there for a couple of hours making crosses, and then there was a downpour. I was so disappointed! No pods that day as it was a serious downpour!

Natalie

blomma

blomma
Wyoming, WY
(Zone 4a)

July 25, 2011
8:02 PM

Post #8715393

Natalie, another hot day---95 degrees. I was out this morning crossing. Discovered a few more mainly dips. It seems that bugs/bees are smarter than me since I have some pods that I didn't cross. There are no labels or black marker on the flower stems. I'll take them anyway.

What is a pain is that I have to hand water so the crosses don't get wet. Sure wish we had some cloud cover here. At least all my iris pods are growing. No problem there. Had 81, not down to 79 due to a clumsy foot---mine. Stuck the stem in water and hope the seeds mature anyway.

How do you save your pollen? Any special tricks?

Lilly

irisMA

irisMA
South Hamilton, MA

July 25, 2011
8:19 PM

Post #8715428

Re iris pods. You can stick the stem into a potato until pod matures.
nhuntley
Holladay, UT
(Zone 5a)

July 25, 2011
9:17 PM

Post #8715577

irisMA, That is very interesting! Are you the one who thought to do this? If it was you, what made you think to try it? It cracked me up, but I'm glad to know that it works! I've never hybridized iris before, but I keep promising myself that I'll try it!

Lilly, I save my pollen in a folded 3 X 6 Post-It note. I got the idea from this article:
http://www.tinkersgardens.com/?doc=Daylilies&subdoc=Hybridizing_Daylilies

I have very busy bees at my house too. Last year it was a serious race to see who could get to the flowers first, but this year has been a little better. I think it's just a lot hotter this year, and maybe the bees are sleeping in longer than I am. I didn't do any hybridizing this morning, due to my lack of sleep last night, but I did enjoy watching a huge black bumble-bee of some sort go from flower to flower this morning. His whole belly was covered in pollen and he could barely lift off! Afterwards, I noticed a lot of stigmas with pollen on them! Sometimes the bees are better at it than I am, so I'll take what I can get! I had several crosses made by bees last year, and I'm just as anxious to see what they did as I am to see what I did!

It was nice and cloudy today, so I wish I had been able to drag myself out of bed earlier. It's been pouring down raining this evening, so maybe it's okay that I slept in. I just hope that the flowers open okay in the morning. Sometimes it seems that they get waterlogged when it rains the night before. And I hear you on the hand watering! I have to do the same thing. Sometimes I love it, but most times I don't!

Natalie

irisMA

irisMA
South Hamilton, MA

July 26, 2011
4:35 AM

Post #8715766

I didn't invent the potato method, information was passed along. Then Barry Blyth of Australia just sticks the stems into the ground. I may have to try that this yr. as I have to dig some of the plants with bee pods. I don't know if any of the 2 methods works with daylilies.

blomma

blomma
Wyoming, WY
(Zone 4a)

July 26, 2011
10:15 PM

Post #8717665

irisMa,
Thanks for the tip. Unfortunately, I don't own one potato. I don't use them. But will keep it in mind since my daughter uses them.

Anyway, I did read somewhere on Daves that a known hybridizer sticks iris stems in water that were knocked over, the reason I am doing that. I change the water and recut the stem daily.

Natalie, wow, I read the whole article found with your link. Very interesting and informative. He did mention heat being one reason why daylilies don't set pods. I bookmarked that article for future use. Thanks for posting it.

Hmm...I got those little tubes from LA for pollen. They work good but there is something I can't figure out. Everyone, inluding you, use stored pollen successfully. I found that not all pollen will stay loose and fluffy. Only those stamens that produce thick fluffy pollen. Those that produce small anther (or is it antler?) with pollen that never gets fluffy and stays unopened. They stay dried. Even scraping with fingernail don't help. Yet still others, are thick and fluffy but dries hard in storage even though I have allowed them to dry first. I have stored pollen in glassine envelopes before I got the tubes. No different result. It worked for Iris pollen.

What am I missing?

Today nice and cloudy so I hybridized this morning. Son of a gun, you can't win for lose---we had a rainstorm with thunder and lightning. I mean it rained hard. So no way do I know if the pollen remained on the pistils.

I think the pollinators are ants, more than bees here. I now pull off all stamens after I crossed the flower to prevent nature to do its thing. Sometimes I use them on another bloom. Or else store them.

My first ruffled edged, fancy Daylily SPACECOAST KRINKLES (Kinnebrew 1999). Love it!

Edited to add that this Daylily purchased from Blueridge and planted end May 2011, It is its first flower. You bet it has been crossed, both as a pod parent and pollen parent. Notice the lovely thick and fluffy pollen it produced.

This message was edited Jul 26, 2011 10:23 PM

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nhuntley
Holladay, UT
(Zone 5a)

July 27, 2011
9:07 AM

Post #8718449

Lilly, The only way I've ever stored pollen is in folded Post-It notes, and I've used it successfully, so I don't know if it can all be stored that way or not. It's just the stuff I have collected and used has been very good. I do have a lot of stored pollen that I haven't used though, so maybe it isn't all good. But, what I've used has been really fluffy, right out of the freezer.

I really don't have the patience to scrape the pollen off the anther. I just pull the anther off and stick it in the Post-It note. I've used a Q-tip to dip in the pollen and then dab it on the flower, and that has worked well. This year though, I bought some of those scissor type tweezers, and just grab an anther out of the post-it, and dab that on the flower. Seems to works really well that way too. I'm surprised that the anther isn't affected by freezing! It's nice and soft, and the pollen is just like it was when I put it in there.

I've got a few flowers that have had those little, somewhat hard anthers, and they had me stumped. I cut one off and was dabbing it on another flower, and there was nothing! I rubbed it on my finger, and again, nothing! So I set it down for about 5 or 10 minutes and went on to something else. When I checked again, it was a little more fluffy and I was able to use it. I can't remember if I got a seed pod or not because it was a hectic morning of making crosses, but it did get fluffy. Seems like I just got to it before it was ready. It still looked the same, but the pollen was much better.

I love that flower!

Natalie

irisMA

irisMA
South Hamilton, MA

July 27, 2011
2:06 PM

Post #8719140

This is iris pollen. We store the anthers in the frig in coin envelopes. The ae in a jar with drying material so that the pollen is not moist. We have a couple DL seedlings--thank you bees.

blomma

blomma
Wyoming, WY
(Zone 4a)

July 27, 2011
10:58 PM

Post #8720260

Natalie, thanks for the explanation. But I am still stumped. The pollen is fluffy when I pick it but becomes hard when drying on a paper plate. Oh well, I will figure it out just about the time my daylilies have finished blooming. That's what happened when I started crossing irises. Now, I am an old hand at it. (grin). Funny but I had no problems crossing dips last summer.

Emailed Bob from Blueridge with a question I posted here. He wrote that if the pollen is on the pistil for 15 minutes before it rains, it may still grow pods. However, he stated that 1 hour is best. So, I am in the clear since I crossed in the morning and it rained late afternoon.

Likewise today. It has been so hot that the drizzle felt good . I was out in my garden weeding when it started and was not going to run into the house. I don't melt. LOL!

I tried folding a Post it note according to direction on that website. Shameful to admit but it lost me after I folded it into a tube.

One of my seelings from 2009 that is in my coldframe will open its buds any day now. I got the seed from a Daves member. The cross is FORSYTHE WRINKLES x CRINKLE. Will post photo when it is open. Another did bloom but it was a small yellow flower with faded eye. Think it got bee crossed with Blackeyed Stella. Will give it to my daughter.

Lilly
nhuntley
Holladay, UT
(Zone 5a)

July 28, 2011
8:09 AM

Post #8720738

Lilly,

Thanks for the info from Bob! That's so good to know! Looks like I'm safe on some of my crosses too! It's been raining like crazy in the late afternoons, but I do all my crosses early in the morning. Yesterday we had two hail storms that pounded everything half to death, including me! I don't melt either, but I never stay out if there is lightening. All of our summer storms usually have lots of lightening!

I just fold the Post-It in half, not into a tube. It's really easy! Also, I checked, and it's a 3 X 5, not a 3 X 6. The only place I've been able to find them is Office Depot. I hated buying them from there because they were expensive, but they work, and you get 1,000 of them! That should last me a few years! Just stick the sticky stuff to itself along the top, and then you can open it up and cut off the anthers right into it. I then fold up the side and bottom edge. It's super low-tech, and works perfectly. If I've confused you, I'd be happy to send pictures!

I can't wait to see the picture of your seedling from 2009! I've got another year to wait to see my seedlings bloom. It's been a long year so far, and the next one will be longer! I'm sure that I won't have anything fantastic, because the daylilies I had to use weren't the best, but I'll still be excited when they open. This years crosses are so much better because I've got way better daylilies this year!

Natalie

blomma

blomma
Wyoming, WY
(Zone 4a)

July 28, 2011
10:35 PM

Post #8722331

Natalie, you are welcome. It is good to know the timing of pollen on pistils.

Yes, I would love for you to send me photos of the Post it Note. I am still stumped. Must be my age LOL. We have a OD here too.

Maybe tomorrow that seedling will bloom. I can see red shading shining through. The plant has 3 buds and it better bloom because I'm heading to Nebraska on Saturday. My granddaughter's birthday on Sunday. Will be back Tuesday. Will do some crosses tomorrow then have my water timer set to water on Saturday night and Monday for 1 hr.

I can't wait until next year either since all my new seedling are much better than those I started in 2009. A few are mine, most I bought on LA, others I got from a Dave member. Those are all in my new coldframe and doing great Most are tets.

I just bought $22 worth of ROUNDUP today. I am going on a killing spree when I get back home. I have plenty of other weedkiller but nothing beats Roundup. I am tired of waiting weeks before weeds die. I sprayed 1 week ago with Spectracide, which is usually pretty good. However weeds got ahead of me this year due to surgery I had end of May. Still have to be careful. Anyway, the weeds I sprayed are still green and in a "bowing" position. I am redoing some beds to add more irises and Daylilies and there are just too many weeds to pull. My 18 year grandson who is a big help just went off to Army bootcamp on July 22. I'm sure going to miss him but we are all so proud of him.

Lilly
nhuntley
Holladay, UT
(Zone 5a)

July 29, 2011
10:49 AM

Post #8723193

Lilly, Please thank your grandson for me for his service. My husband retired from the Navy 9 years ago, so I know all too well what a sacrifice this truly is. I hope he survives boot camp! It's tough to get through! My husband was a navigator in the Navy, but his last job was at the Navy boot camp north of Chicago. He was a drill instructor there for a short time, then ran the department that sets the kids back in training when they got into trouble. He had his hands full!

Enjoy your few days away! I sure could use a quick trip out of town myself, but I've got dips blooming like crazy now, so I don't dare go anywhere!

Here's my high-tech method of folding the Post-It notes for storing pollen in the freezer. I hope this makes sense!

Natalie

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nhuntley
Holladay, UT
(Zone 5a)

July 29, 2011
10:50 AM

Post #8723194

Second picture, with it folded along top

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nhuntley
Holladay, UT
(Zone 5a)

July 29, 2011
10:50 AM

Post #8723195

Folded in on the edges

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nhuntley
Holladay, UT
(Zone 5a)

July 29, 2011
10:52 AM

Post #8723199

This is how I mark mine. After putting the pollen inside (next picture), I put the post-it in a plastic bag, and then in a container in the freezer. I have a container for dip pollen, and another for tet pollen.

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nhuntley
Holladay, UT
(Zone 5a)

July 29, 2011
10:54 AM

Post #8723204

Here is a picture of the pollen inside one of the opened up post-it notes. I never open the fold along the top where the sticky part is. It makes a nice little "holder" for grabbing some pollen when needed. I took this picture right after removing it from the freezer, and you can hopefully see that the pollen is loose and fluffy.

I hope this helps!

Natalie

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blomma

blomma
Wyoming, WY
(Zone 4a)

July 29, 2011
6:35 PM

Post #8724175

Natalie, Thanks for taking the time to post the photos. You bet it helped. Now I get it. Will have to go to OD to see if I can get some of those Post it Notes. Those I have are much smaller. Yes I see the pollen.

No bloom opened yet on my seedling. Hope tomorrow before I leave. Below is how it looks now.

We tried to talk my grandson in to joining the Navy as most of the guys in our family did. For some reason he wanted the Army. He is in S. Carolina. Ohhh...the heat there. He is doing good he wrote. His Dad warned him how hard it is. He was in the Navy but it is more or less the same in boot camp.

I sort of hate to leave my daylilies also but most of my new ones are done. Those that aren't have more buds for me to cross when I get back. My dips are still blooming strongly and they have many buds yet since they are well established.

Lilly

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nhuntley
Holladay, UT
(Zone 5a)

July 29, 2011
7:40 PM

Post #8724322

I think I'd have to dig up that seedling and take it with me! It's been a long wait, so I'd hate to miss it!

Have a good trip, and I'm glad the photos helped!

Natalie

blomma

blomma
Wyoming, WY
(Zone 4a)

July 29, 2011
8:49 PM

Post #8724472

Natalie there are 2 more buds as you can see so incase I miss this one. I think it will be pretty for I tried to sneak a peak and it is dark red inside. Didn't want to force opening it to far for fear of ruining it. Just a slit. LOL!

While looking at the other seedlings today, I noticed a bud deep in the center of another seedling. I missed the first set of blooms since I was in Nebraska after surgery end of May. It was an early blooming one. Evidently it just may be one that is a rebloomer. It will be awhile before that one blooms. It came from the same pod that the one we are waiting to bloom.

I am amazed over how different blooms are coming from the same pod. The one about to bloom is strong growing and taller with a thick scape. The other just setting buds is only about 10" tall and the scape is much slimmer. That present a problem for me. I don't have room in my gardens to grow every seed to adulthood since I am also crossing irises. What's an hem addict to do? Oh well, my daughter will benefit.

Lilly
nhuntley
Holladay, UT
(Zone 5a)

July 29, 2011
9:19 PM

Post #8724530

Good thing you've got a daughter that is willing to help out with spare room! I've got neighbors to help me out! My Mom only lives two blocks away, but I'd hate to go that far and camp out waiting for something to bloom!

I am also amazed at how different the blooms can be from the same pod. That's why I've really enjoyed seeing sibling photos!

Is there a registration thing for Iris like there is for Daylilies? If there is, have you registered any? I used to be so obsessed with them, but the hems have replaced them. I still have some and love them, but I've had to thin them way back to make more room.

I did harvest three iris seeds (thanks to a bee!) this morning, but don't have the slightest idea of what to do with them! I remember your info on putting them in a box on the north side of the house for the winter, but what do I do with them until then?

Natalie

blomma

blomma
Wyoming, WY
(Zone 4a)

July 29, 2011
11:48 PM

Post #8724675

nhuntley wrote:Good thing you've got a daughter that is willing to help out with spare room! I've got neighbors to help me out! My Mom only lives two blocks away, but I'd hate to go that far and camp out waiting for something to bloom!


LOL!! Yes, if you camped out there, you would miss your own Daylily flowers. Think of the excersize (sp?) you would get runnig back and forth.(grin)

As far as your iris seeds, remove the seeds from the pod and place them on a paper plate to cure. They will look something like raisins when dry. Then store your iris seeds in fridge crisper until you are ready to sow them. I usually sow them in Oct-November.

There is a society for Irises just as with Daylilies. It is the American Iris Society (AIS) I am a member of that too. Cost the same as Daves and you get a beautiful 66 or so page magazine of irises and information 4 times/per year, or 3, can't remember.
I have 187 hybrid irises purchased over the years from Schreiner. I am just as addicted to them as I am with Daylilies.

I had to retype the above as my text disappeared when I hit the qoute link. If the photo is still there, it is of my iris pods. More pods in the front of my house. One pod measured 4" from top to bottom. That is a lot of seeds.

Lilly

blomma

blomma
Wyoming, WY
(Zone 4a)

July 29, 2011
11:49 PM

Post #8724676

Darn, the photo is gone too. Here it is again.

Forgot to add, no I have not registered any Iris yet but working on it. LOL! All the pods are crosses with name varieties. I beat the bees to it.

This message was edited Jul 29, 2011 11:51 PM

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nhuntley
Holladay, UT
(Zone 5a)

July 30, 2011
7:49 AM

Post #8725046

Wow! You have a lot of pods on the iris! Good thing they are blooming before the daylilies! You would be ragged! I was going to give iris hybridizing a try this year, but I honestly couldn't figure it out! I was picking and pulling on the iris, and couldn't figure out where to dab the pollen at! I took it as a sign that I should let the bees do it for now! Not that they are any good at it at my house because I only had one pod on about 100 iris (not 100 different varieties of iris)! Oh well, there is always next year, and Mom has a few pods on the iris I've planted at her house that I'm waiting on.

Thanks for the info on the iris seeds. Sounds super easy, and right now, I like super easy!

I had to duel with a big black bumblebee again this morning, and it was a tie. That guy has his radar set on my house, and he gets here earlier every morning! I got up at 6:00 am and he wasn't here yet so I was happy. By 6:30, the race was on! I was hoping to collect more pollen for storage this morning before he got to it, and I was pretty successful, but he beat me to a couple of blooms! Oh well, I saved the ones for last that I already have some of, so I let him have it without pouting too much! It's nice and cloudy this morning, so it was almost relaxing! Some mornings I'm racing as fast as I can, trying to beat the sun before it pops up over the mountains!

Natalie

irisMA

irisMA
South Hamilton, MA

July 31, 2011
9:08 AM

Post #8727268

Iris anthers are under the style arms in the center of the flower. The pollen goes on the stigmatic lip at the end of the styles. AIS web site is http://www.irises.org.
nhuntley
Holladay, UT
(Zone 5a)

July 31, 2011
9:32 AM

Post #8727334

irisMA, thanks for the info, but I still couldn't find it when searching last year! I'm just not familiar enough with the parts of the iris. I'll work on my technique next year!

Natalie

blomma

blomma
Wyoming, WY
(Zone 4a)

August 4, 2011
5:54 PM

Post #8737380

Natalie, hi I am back home and here is that seedling. I love it. It is a orange-red self with greenish yellow center and star-shaped. Height 16" blooms are 6" wide. Lightly ruffled.

Thumbnail by blomma
Click the image for an enlarged view.

blomma

blomma
Wyoming, WY
(Zone 4a)

August 4, 2011
5:57 PM

Post #8737391

Natalie, here is where you place the pollen on iris, called the lip

Thumbnail by blomma
Click the image for an enlarged view.

blomma

blomma
Wyoming, WY
(Zone 4a)

August 4, 2011
5:58 PM

Post #8737395

Lip with pollen

Thumbnail by blomma
Click the image for an enlarged view.

irisMA

irisMA
South Hamilton, MA

August 4, 2011
8:50 PM

Post #8737810

You really should have 3 hands to do the work. I find that 2 are not as workable as they used to b. Of course, I work with the small irises not TBs.
nhuntley
Holladay, UT
(Zone 5a)

August 4, 2011
9:03 PM

Post #8737823

Thanks Lilly! I don't even remember seeing a lip on the iris (or two) that I took apart. I'll be sure to check this again next Spring when it's time, and I'm sure I'll ask for help too!

Pretty flower! You must have been so excited! Is this one of your crosses? I can't wait to see my first bloom next year!

How was your trip?

Natalie

blomma

blomma
Wyoming, WY
(Zone 4a)

August 4, 2011
9:51 PM

Post #8737876

Natalie, There is sort of a hood above the lip. In the last photo you can make out my fingers holding the lip up to expose the lip more easily.You can also see the pollen I put there.

From what I have experienced this year with daylilies, I think crossing irises successfully is far easier than crossing daylilies. Still best done in the morning but the weather is much cooler when they bloom.

Below is the lip, and stamen with pollen. The lip is located in the photo between the "hood" and the stamen with pollen. You have to grab and hold the hood back to expose the lip's surface where the pollen goes.

Had a good trip. Everything is fine.

Lilly

This message was edited Aug 4, 2011 9:54 PM

Thumbnail by blomma
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nhuntley
Holladay, UT
(Zone 5a)

August 4, 2011
9:58 PM

Post #8737892

Okay, this looks familiar! I think the lip was stuck to the hood on the ones I was looking at, or maybe I just missed it.

Not only is it cooler when Iris bloom, but the sun also isn't up as early! Do you need to put the pollen on there as soon as they open? We know with Daylilies that you only get one day, and it better be as soon as it opens to give you the best chance, but is it the same with Iris?

Natalie

blomma

blomma
Wyoming, WY
(Zone 4a)

August 4, 2011
10:02 PM

Post #8737893

The cross is pod parent, FORSYTHE WRINKLES AND CRINKLE, and not mine. Don't know the pollen parent. Got seeds from a Dave member who had too many seeds and willing to give them for postage. So far it is a keeper.

Today I saw another seedling that will bloom. Can't wait.

Lilly

blomma

blomma
Wyoming, WY
(Zone 4a)

August 4, 2011
10:42 PM

Post #8737939

Natalie the flower need to be fully opened when crossed. It is then that the pollen is fluffy. I have even crossed successfully during the afternoon without problems. Iris blooms lasts a bit longer than daylilies. However, I would cross the first day the bloom is open. Actually, you have all day to cross when it is sunny.

Probably you missed the lip. It isn't stuck, it is just hidden under the hood until you bend the hood backwards. Also the lip have only about 1/4" of surface space to put the pollen. Like daylilies, it becomes sticky when ready to accept and hold pollen. I use the stamen as a handle and just brush the pollen on to the top surface of the lip.

There are 3 of everything on an iris. I always put pollen on all 3 lips to assure success.

Below is a template of iris parts.

Thumbnail by blomma
Click the image for an enlarged view.

irisMA

irisMA
South Hamilton, MA

August 5, 2011
4:31 AM

Post #8738141

Great diagram. I use locking forcepts to do crosses. Stops me from dropping the anther.

blomma

blomma
Wyoming, WY
(Zone 4a)

August 5, 2011
8:40 AM

Post #8738499

irisMa,
Thanks. I know what you mean about dropping the anther. Most often I just brush the pollen between 2 fingers.

Lilly

blomma

blomma
Wyoming, WY
(Zone 4a)

August 10, 2011
11:45 PM

Post #8749821

Hurrah, I am finally beginning to get some pods on both tets and dips.
nhuntley
Holladay, UT
(Zone 5a)

August 11, 2011
9:36 AM

Post #8750296

Great news! Has it cooled down there some? It was a little cooler here for a week or so, but it's back up into the 90s again.

I'm to the point where I have so many pods that I'm not making any more crosses! Not only have I been very successful, but the bees have done an outstanding job this year too! I've got a few daylilies that I'm getting rid of because I don't want to use them for hybridizing, and almost every flower has ended up with a pod. I hate to cut them off, so for now, I'll see if I have room for more seedlings after I harvest the seeds from my own crosses. I wish I had been this lucky last year!

Natalie

blomma

blomma
Wyoming, WY
(Zone 4a)

August 11, 2011
10:31 AM

Post #8750373

So glad for you Natalie, since you didn't have many pods last season.

I wouldn't say I'm up to my ears in pods so still crossing. It has cooled down here to the 80's. The tets are beginning to run out of buds. I am using stored pollen for those still blooming. I have more problems with tets than dips. Even the bees have not been cooperation. Maybe it is just as well since I am limited on room.

I replanted my iris seedling from the coldframe so will have some room there. Daylilies are still in there as I am waiting for 2 more seedlings to bloom.

Lilly

irisMA

irisMA
South Hamilton, MA

August 11, 2011
11:09 AM

Post #8750417

Daylillies setting pods on their own. I shall cut the stems. We do have a few DL seedlings, their own idea but I like things as they are.
nhuntley
Holladay, UT
(Zone 5a)

August 11, 2011
12:38 PM

Post #8750563

irisMA, they don't exactly set pods on their own, but you can remove the pods if you don't want the seeds. It's easy to see when they are forming. They look a lot like iris seed pods. That way you can still have blooms, if you have buds left. I'd never remove the scape (stem) if I still had buds! And just because you have a bud, it doesn't mean that you'll get a seed pod. Even if you put pollen on it, it doesn't always set seeds. Too bad for that too, because I wish I was getting seeds every time I dabbed on some pollen! Also, sometimes a seed pod will start to form but then it will turn brown pretty quickly and fall off. Those won't have viable seeds in them.

Lilly, I think everyone has a harder time getting seeds on tets. They are just harder to cross. I've done much better with them this year than I did last year, and the bees even made a few tet crosses for me, but maybe it's because I have some this year that are easier pod parents. I did get some new daylilies last fall, and I think that may be part of why I got lucky on some of them.

Most all of my tets are done blooming too, but I still have some dips that haven't started to bloom yet, but they have buds. This year has been so different from last year!

Natalie

blomma

blomma
Wyoming, WY
(Zone 4a)

August 18, 2011
3:37 PM

Post #8763530

I am pissed. I am going to curse and screeeeam and wish for a gun.

This morning I noticed I had antelope in my yard. Saw tracks. Then I noticed that the seeds and flowers on my white dip, and my 2 new red tets are missing seeds. Can't find the plastic labels so I hope the darn animals choked on them. Grrrr...!

You would figure that the darn critters would have enough food on the mountain and stay out of town. At least my iris pods are still on the plants. My property is surrounded with a 4ft link fence. If I could afford it, it would make it 7 or 8 feet high.

irisMA

irisMA
South Hamilton, MA

August 18, 2011
4:04 PM

Post #8763564

Sorry. We have trouble with regular deer. Are they prong horns?

blomma

blomma
Wyoming, WY
(Zone 4a)

August 18, 2011
9:08 PM

Post #8763983

Don't know. They sneak in during night time or real early in the morning so I don't get to see them.
nhuntley
Holladay, UT
(Zone 5a)

August 18, 2011
10:12 PM

Post #8764041

I was telling someone the other day about how we never have deer at our house. I spoke too soon. Yesterday morning, a deer was eating on the lawn across the street. Luckily my daylilies are in the backyard and the deer took off as soon as someone came out of their house. I can't figure out why a deer would be here because we're three miles from the base of the mountain! The mountains are still green too, so it makes no sense!

Sorry you lost some pods and flowers. I've never kept the good stuff in the front yard because it's not fenced. It's packed full of flowers, but I can't see that the deer had a snack over here before munching on the grass across the street.

Natalie

blomma

blomma
Wyoming, WY
(Zone 4a)

August 19, 2011
7:24 PM

Post #8765593

Natalie, My daylilies are all in the back and fenced in. Funny that they only chewed my white ones and 2 reddish. Not the leaves, just the flowers and pods. I too live a good distance from the mountains. Probably 4 or more miles. I'm sure there is food still up there. You're right it makes no sense. Knock on wood, they left my iris pods alone.

I never had any problem with anterlope or deer until 3 years ago. A drunk took part of my fence down in the front, and clipped the corner of my neighbors house. This is 3 am. With nothing stopping them, they walked right into the backyard. The fence is only 4ft so they could easily jump it but never bothered.

It is still hot but getting some tet pods. Have plenty of dip pods. I had 4 of my own bee pollinated seeds in the coldframe. Two bloomed. One was tiny yellow. The other the blooms half opened and the plant was only 6" tall. I think the bee visited stella de oro. In either case I disposed of them. I have plenty of seedlings that aren't bee pollinated from last year sowing. I am keeping that one that is orange red posted above. It is about to open another bud. Will tranplant it to the garden after it finished blooming.

Digging up another border for the iris and daylily seedlings that have to be moved out of my second coldframe next spring. Fun, Fun, ohhh...my aching back!!

Lilly
nhuntley
Holladay, UT
(Zone 5a)

August 19, 2011
9:22 PM

Post #8765709

Lilly, I have all of my flower beds in the back yard fenced in with rabbit fence so that the puppy won't get in them. I think it's only 3 feet tall, and I can step over it. Not that she can't jump it, because she can, but she's only done it once and it was on accident. She was chasing a ball that bounced over it, and kind of had a shocked look on her face, and couldn't figure out how to get back out! It was so funny! She can easily jump into the back of the truck which is much higher. Anyway, rabbit fence isn't all that expensive, and it comes much taller than what I bought. Maybe you could get some to fill in where the drunk knocked down your fence? That way, maybe the antelope will see it and decide to head on down the road instead of jumping. I think I'd do anything possible to deter them!

Or, how about some of those spinning toy things? I think they are called pinwheels. My neighbor has a bunch of them in her yard, and it looks super tacky, but I doubt that the deer stepped in her yard because of them. The ones she has look like big flowers and they spin in the wind. I know they deter some animals, and I would think that they would scare off antelope! My Mom bought some last year for my niece at the dollar store, and she got three for a dollar!

Someone else on here woke up and found that all of their seedlings that were getting ready to bloom for the first time had been eaten by deer. I think I'd die if that happened to me!

I'm still working on getting my seedlings out of their pots and into the ground, but it's taking forever. I've been waiting until early evening to do it because of the heat, but I'm only half done. I'm also just about out of room. On top of it, I bought a truck load of mulch a couple of days ago, so my back is killing me! I've only got 1/2 of the load spread in the beds, and I don't want to think about doing the rest! It's been in the mid 90s this week, and it's too hot to do anything, but stuff has to be done!

Natalie

blomma

blomma
Wyoming, WY
(Zone 4a)

August 19, 2011
10:53 PM

Post #8765784

Yes stuff have to be done, heat or no heat.

I'm sorry I should have added that the drunk's insurance company paid for a new fence so it was replaced. Still don't stop the wildlife when they get in a habit. It is spring and late summer that they pay a visit.

I think I will consider those spinning things. Can't hurt. We have a $ store here also. I will check it out. Will tell my daughter also. Her and son-in-law own 80 acres out on the prairie. My problem is small compared to theirs. My daughter is a gardener and they had to put a real high fence around their home to keep her plants safe. Thanks for the tip on the spinners.

I am so sick of hot days. It just drains me, but as you said, things have to be done. Waiting for all my iris seeds to mature. Got most picked but some are 4" tall. I can't believe it. I make my rounds every morning. The DL seeds are far from mature yet.

While I am thinking of it, I did figure out about the post it notes from your photos. I dry the pollen on paper plates, using 1/4th for each cultivar. See below. I bought from LA 100 small microcentrifuge tubes to store pollen in. There is one on the plante. They work good because you can tilt the tube up against your finger to get the pollen and still leave more in there. It was only $7.50, including shipping. I intend to use them to freeze pollen to use next year.

Time to rest my weary bones.~~Lilly

Thumbnail by blomma
Click the image for an enlarged view.

irisMA

irisMA
South Hamilton, MA

August 20, 2011
7:53 AM

Post #8766100

We have not seen many deer this yr. (watch them come now.) We have a 6 ft livestock fence that was up when we had the ponies. DH has to put netting on top of that which get pushed down by heavy snow etc. Of course that doesn't stop them from walking down the driveway.

Harvested a BB iris pod with 35 seeds in it. One of my made crosses of a too tall seedling cross for borders onto a very short one. Hope that it works for good plants.
nhuntley
Holladay, UT
(Zone 5a)

August 20, 2011
9:18 AM

Post #8766201

irisMA, you better be on the lookout! I had never seen a deer in my area until I mentioned it on another post on here! My Dad lives in Oregon, and has a 6 foot high fence all around his 5 acres, and it has electric wire running along the top. The deer figured out that they could jump over the gates without getting zapped! He spends a fortune on spray to keep the deer from eating all of his plants, but he'd rather do that than to lose them all to the deer. He has thousands of acres of BLM land behind his property, so there is no way to keep the deer away, but he has been able to keep them from eating everything.

Which reminds me... I saw a recipe on Tinker's site for home-made deer repellent, which I sent to Dad. Lilly, you should see if you can find that. I'm sure it would work on antelope too.

I've never put the pollen on a plate to dry. I just put it in the post-it notes, and I've never had a problem with it. Maybe I'm just plucking it off the plants after it's already dry? I usually collect all of the pollen, putting it in the folded post-it notes, and leave them on the table outside until I'm done hybridizing. Then I put them into the freezer. Maybe if they weren't dry when I gathered them, they were by the time I put them in the freezer. Either way, that removes one step doing it that way, and the easier things are the better!

Natalie

blomma

blomma
Wyoming, WY
(Zone 4a)

August 20, 2011
10:39 AM

Post #8766361

I leave the pollen on the paper plate to fluff up. When I pick the stamen the pollen isn't fluffy to use yet. This way I can see and easily check.. My orange seedling opened up for the last time this morning. I was at there at 6am. I picked the pollen and used it. Also pollinated the seedling. Didn't work the first time.

I shouldn't have done it----visit Blue Ridge. It took self control and ordered only 4. One is Party Pinafore, DOR/DIP. I ordered a dip since I have several and wanted a fancy one to use as parent both ways. The other I bid on for $9.99 are:

Soft Summer Night
Regal Braid
Daughter of Magic

I'm digging a new spot and will put my dips there. I want to keep all my tet in one place.

irisMA

irisMA
South Hamilton, MA

August 20, 2011
11:18 AM

Post #8766408

Our iris pollen goes into coin envelopes & the frig with 'Flower Dry'. It can go infor a while & comes out fluffy. I think that drying can lower its power. Don't know anything about crossing DL. Some of those make their own crosses.

blomma

blomma
Wyoming, WY
(Zone 4a)

August 20, 2011
11:34 AM

Post #8766528

irisMa,
Not really. Daylilies are pollinated by bees or other insects, not by themselves. I don't save iris pollen. I have 79 iris pods now of crosses I have made.Some of the pods are 4" tall.

Below are some of them. More in the front of my house.

Thumbnail by blomma
Click the image for an enlarged view.

irisMA

irisMA
South Hamilton, MA

August 20, 2011
1:31 PM

Post #8766749

My pods are not that large because I am working with the smaller irises. Actually some of our largest pods are from I.aphylla. Idea: if you are drying it on plates rather than plant to plant, you are 'saving' it. Since the medians grow through several time periods, I have to hang onto it for a bit. Crossing MDBs to BBs for example covers several weeks of time.
nhuntley
Holladay, UT
(Zone 5a)

August 20, 2011
1:53 PM

Post #8766771

Lilly, those are all really pretty!

When I was buying daylilies two years ago, I was obsessed with only getting tets. Then I realized that there are some stunning dips, and I shouldn't be passing them up just because they are dips. Besides that, they are easier to cross, and I didn't want to be a total failure! To me, one of the most beautiful daylilies is Fairy Tale Pink, and it's a dip. Sure, it could use some ruffles, but it's so beautiful that I can't see sticking ruffles on it!

irisMA, the picture of the pollen on the paper plate is from daylilies, not iris. You really have to save daylily pollen because they bloom at all different times. Some bloom very early, and others very late, and since each flower is only open for one day, you can't really hybridize without saving the pollen. I've made lots of crosses on flowers that are blooming on the same day, but more often than not, the ones I want to cross aren't blooming at the same time, and sometimes not even in the same month.

Natalie

irisMA

irisMA
South Hamilton, MA

August 20, 2011
4:12 PM

Post #8766970

Same problem with irises.

blomma

blomma
Wyoming, WY
(Zone 4a)

August 20, 2011
6:47 PM

Post #8767521

Thanks Natalie. Never occurred to me that the pollen on the plate was taken as iris seeds. LOL!

I just ordered 6 new daylilies from Blueridge. I intended to get only 2 but you know how that goes. I wanted some new genes for my common dips. I found 2, then 4 tets.

Funny I thought the opposite of you, sort of. I was never crazy about daylilies. I have quite a few noids from walmart. Never knew until 2 years ago what I was missing. I thought you had to live in the south to have those with the lace and teeth, etc. Then I found Blue Ridge on Ebay. Someone mentioned here on Daves that they had a sale on Ebay. The rest is history. Now I am almost finished with the new border. I can't decide which I like best, iris or daylilies. Yes there are stunning dips. I wasn't going to get more but I want to cross my common ones with something great.

Here is the link to the dip daylily

http://www.ebay.com/itm/290600749910?ssPageName=STRK:MEWNX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1439.l2649

Lilly

blomma

blomma
Wyoming, WY
(Zone 4a)

August 20, 2011
7:38 PM

Post #8767603

Hej Natalie, I went to Walmart today and bought all their spinning thingy they had. Five for 50 cents each. They are now at their spot keeping guard. They better earn their keep.

IrisMa,
now since I got the hang of saving daylily pollen, I will do the same with irises. Never even thought about doing that Dah! I have some early blooming irises that aren't blooming when the later blooming cultivars are.

irisMA

irisMA
South Hamilton, MA

August 20, 2011
8:14 PM

Post #8767674

Right!
nhuntley
Holladay, UT
(Zone 5a)

August 20, 2011
8:47 PM

Post #8767735

At least if those pinwheels don't work, you didn't waste a bunch. I bet they work though! My old dog adores my neighbor, and loves going to her house, but those spinning things freak her out! If she sees them, she runs back home! She's not afraid of much, so if they scare her, they are bound to scare the antelope. Besides that, they are something new there, and that alone will probably scare them off. I think you are the only person I know who has had antelope eating their plants!

I moved back into my house 9 years ago, and my renter had planted some daylilies in the front. He was a landscape architect, so the yard looked amazing! I just wasn't thrilled with them at all though, and I gave almost all of them away! I did keep a few, and they are beautiful to me now, but I really didn't like them back then! I don't know what happened to me the year before last, but all of a sudden, they were the most awesome plant ever! I think it was because I took a really good look at the ones in the front, instead of just walking past them and thinking that they were pretty. I then went on the internet to see if I could find some pictures, and I was blown away by all of the beautiful pictures that I saw! I love iris too, but not quite as much as daylilies. I'll always have iris, and can't imagine my yard without them, but it's not an obsession - at least not at this point!

All of my iris seems to bloom at almost the same time, so I never thought about having to save pollen for later. I guess I'll pay more attention next year when I'm trying to make a cross between two of them. It will be my luck that they all bloom at different times, and I just never really noticed! If I'm really lucky, I won't get any seed pods on them. I know I'm in trouble already for next year when I have to make room for all the seedlings that I'll have. I have way too many seed pods!

Natalie

blomma

blomma
Wyoming, WY
(Zone 4a)

August 20, 2011
10:41 PM

Post #8767900

nhuntley wrote:I know I'm in trouble already for next year when I have to make room for all the seedlings that I'll have. I have way too many seed pods! Natalie


Ha! Consider my 79 iris pods, then adding whatever daylily pods I will have, and they are mounting up. And you think you're in trouble?

There is no way that I will be able to sow all and raise them to adulthood. What to do, what to do. The problem is that sowing just a few out of each pod (my original intent) can make me miss that one seed that will bring richness to my pocketbook. (grin). The example of the 3 iris seedlings that bloomed this year--- which were bee pollinated---shows just how different seedlings from the same pod can be. That blows me away. I think that I will just sow the pods from my tets. I will have to be picky regarding which iris cutivar cross I will sow. Decisions, decisions. Luckily, neither iris or daylily seeds will loose fertillity when stored properly. So I may just save some to sow next year instead of crossing more.

You know, I think some plants, like food, have to "grow" on us. Heck, I didn't get deep into irises until I discovered Schreiner, then Cooley. Likewise daylilies with Blue Ridge and others, not to mention LA. Do you think it may be due to the great number of cultivers available coupled with an inborn trait of collecting. I think it is in the genes. My mom collected recipes. My grandmother collected plants. Ha, there you go! It's all her fault!

Lilly

irisMA

irisMA
South Hamilton, MA

August 21, 2011
6:34 AM

Post #8768285

I blame my husband's grandmother for our median irises. Like many people I only knew TBs. But his grandmother grew the old dwarf species before the modern TB X I. pumila SDBs. So when he saw a Melrose garden ad, he said 'oh, they have the little ones' & off we went.
nhuntley
Holladay, UT
(Zone 5a)

August 21, 2011
10:33 AM

Post #8768666

Lilly, You hit the nail on the head when it comes to not growing all of the seeds. I was so excited to see all of the "sibling" photos that everyone was posting on the Daylily forum. I had no idea that the flowers could turn out so different when the seeds came from the same pod. I know for sure that with my luck, I'd grow the ugly ones and give away the beauties! Had I not seen all of those photos, I wouldn't have hesitated to give away some of the seeds. Now I'm worried about it!

I've probably got an equal amount, or maybe even more, crosses that were made by bees. Last year, I had very few crosses made by bees. I'll grow all of the tet crosses, whether I made them or the bees made them, because I adore all of my tets. With the dips, I plan on planting all of the seeds from my own crosses because I was very picky about those crosses, and if I have any room, I'll plant some bee crosses too. Then I'll sit here and scratch my head, trying to figure out what to do with the rest of the seeds. I've probably got enough room to start all of them, but planting them in the ground the second year is going to be the problem. I've actually got room, but it's in the form of lawn, and I have two dogs! The old dog will be 9 in November, and has bad hips, so she doesn't care about the lawn. However, the 10 month old lab puppy can spend all day running, so I hate to remove part of her playground!

My Mom lives two blocks from me, and has lots of room, so if I make any iris crosses, I think I'll plant them at her house. I've already moved a huge amount of my iris over there, and I can still enjoy them there because they bloom so much longer than the daylilies do. At least that problem is taken care of! If I have some daylily seedlings that bloom next year that are good, and I want to watch them a couple more years, I can move those to her house also. I just want to have them at my house when they bloom for the first time! My only problem right now is that I have way more seed pods this year than I did last year! I guess I need to remember that some of the seedlings will be really ugly when they bloom, and I can get rid of them! Problem solved? I doubt it!

I made a big mistake by not planting all of my tets in one bed and my dips in the other. At the time, I thought if I mixed them up more, I'd have less chance of bees making the crosses instead of me. Well, that was a stupid thought! I really want to move all of my tets to the bed on the west side of my house that is in the morning shade, since I have much better luck getting seeds to set on those plants, but I'm not sure that I should be moving them yet. I bought most of my good plants in October of last year, and I'm sure that they aren't totally settled in yet. I think I'll copy and paste this onto the Daylily forum, and see what everyone says about moving them after only one year in the ground. I can't do anything just yet, because there are pods everywhere, and it was 98 out yesterday, which makes it too hot to do anything outside anyway. It's supposed to be hot all week too, but I still can't be moving plants with pods on them.

I never really thought about gathering plants being a family trait, but you are both right, and I come by it honestly! My Mom's Mother was a hoarder, though she didn't start out that way. She and Grandpa collected antiques, and their house was stunning. It was always spotless, and the furniture was gorgeous. Grandma ended up with dementia, and started filling the house up with junk. When she died, it was a nightmare trying to clean it out! We found about 200 afghans that she had bought at the thrift store, and that was just the tip of the iceberg. We had to try and clean it out some because Grandpa was still living, but it never got finished. When he died 11 months later, it took us months to get the house emptied. My Dad's parents never collected anything, and were always so tidy. If they hadn't used something in 6 months, they got rid of it. I'm hoping that I'm somewhere in the middle!

Natalie

blomma

blomma
Wyoming, WY
(Zone 4a)

August 21, 2011
9:36 PM

Post #8769895

nhuntley wrote: I was so excited to see all of the "sibling" photos that everyone was posting on the Daylily forum. I had no idea that the flowers could turn out so different when the seeds came from the same pod. Natalie


Guess what, I also though the difference would be minor until I saw the 3 irises bloom that I grew from seeds that came from the same pod. If you didn't see it let me know and I will repost it. I was going to sow 2 seeds from each pod both irises and daylilies. I will instead choose which cross, sow more, and save the rest for following year instead of doing crosses of irises. One 4" high iris pod had 71 seeds in it that I crossed. Sure can't do them all.

I am sure those daylilies of yours are settled in after a year. You plant seedling don't you when the weather is warm enough. I will be moving my dips to the new border as soon as I have finished the border. Just 2 more feet to dig. Went to HD to get stuff to amend my soil with. Also need to get horse manure from my daughter. They have 6 horses. Darn, I forgot. Got to wait to move them until all the pods are ready to harvest. Darn, I may have to move them in the spring. Likewise my new tet. I won't move either when they have pods maturing. By the time the pods are ripe, it will be too late to move any plant here in WY. At least the border will be done and settled by spring. I will move them in April to give them time to still bloom.

I tossed some of my daylily seedlings. One bloomed yellow with small flowers. Looks like a stella. Another daylily of the same seed pod I though was a rebloomer. Well, the blooms never opened and the plant was 12" tall. Tossed that one and 4 more. They were all dips from original Walmart NOID specials.

I found I am getting picky. Never before could I toss away a plant. I'm using "tough love" for I need the room.

It is still too hot here. But I had to finish moving and dividing some irises that were pod-less. Most I have picked just got stragglers now. I don't like to move irises too late in the season. They need time to establish before winter and that can come early in WY.

I had to chuckle when I read about your grandma becoming a hoarder. But sad that she came down with dementia. Hoarder is what my daughter calls me. I do save things. You never know when you need it, or want to use it. Mainly it is cross stitch patterns and craft paraphenelia (sp?), empty plant pots, etc. l I used to have time to cross stitch and sew. My daughter thinks I should have a yard sale. I had them too years ago. I don't want people trampling on my plants, which I have a strong memory of. All the work, it isn't worth it. Beside I may not be able to garden when I get older so at least I can go back to sewing, crafting, and cross stitching. Makes sense to me. My daughter is one that hates clutter and never saves anything if not used within a certain amount of time.

You are lucky to have your Mom live so close who has room. My daughter lives about 1/2 hours from me but in the boonies "where the deer and the antelope play". She has a high fence but once in awhile they find a way to get in. Would not trust my seedlings up there. I give her what I am not concerned over. Actually, she has some of my iris seedlings. Gave her those before I knew how different they are from the same pod. Will have to keep that in mind. She will tell me when they bloom.

I'm surprised at your statement about irises bloom longer than daylilies. I don't know about yours, but my daylilies began blooming early July in variety and are still blooming in variety. Mostly dips. Irises for me at least begin end of May, to end of June. I have 179 cultivars of irises. That is the reason I started with daylilies since they came in bloom when irises stopped.

Lilly

blomma

blomma
Wyoming, WY
(Zone 4a)

August 21, 2011
9:45 PM

Post #8769910

irisMA wrote:Like many people I only knew TBs. But his grandmother grew the old dwarf species before the modern TB X I. pumila SDBs. So when he saw a Melrose garden ad, he said 'oh, they have the little ones' & off we went.


"the little ones" Lol, I like that

Have you any idea why some pods set a few seeds, yet others set many? One of my pods grew 4" high and contained 71 seeds by count. This is a TB iris pod. Last year I had a large pod with 50 seeds and thought that was plenty.

Lilly
nhuntley
Holladay, UT
(Zone 5a)

August 21, 2011
10:33 PM

Post #8770002

Lilly, I meant that the iris flowers stay open longer than the daylily flowers. The plant itself may not bloom as long, since each daylily plant can have many blooms, and the most I've ever had on a TB iris is 5, but each flower is open a long time. Does that make sense? If a daylily seedling doesn't have a lot of blooms on it, I could easily miss the flower if it isn't at my house. But, with the iris, I think I'd have a much better chance of seeing them since I could go the second or third day after it opens, and it would still be blooming.

It was really sad what happened to my grandmother and her hoarding. She had dementia for over 20 years, but collecting EVERYTHING made her happy. Grandpa was a serious enabler, since he'd take her to the thrift store every day, or even twice a day, if that is what she wanted to do. She just got to where she wouldn't throw away anything, including garbage. Luckily all of the good stuff, like the antiques, had a good protective layer of "stuff" on them, so nothing got damaged when she was piling things to the ceiling.

I love doing crafts, and used to do cross stitch every day! I haven't done any cross stich in years though, as I just don't have time. My most recent crafty obsession has been making beaded jewelry. I don't even wear jewelry, but my Mom is a jewelry addict, so it works out good for both of us! I haven't made even one piece of jewelry in two years though, because I'm too busy with the flower gardening! I guess I just got burned out. It was a great thing to do in the winter, and I may have to drag the beads back out when the snow starts flying!

Natalie

irisMA

irisMA
South Hamilton, MA

August 22, 2011
7:43 AM

Post #8770569

blomma The # of seeds per pod is usually a result of timing. When all (pollen & conditions of the sigmatic lip) is at peak readiness more seeds result. that is often why bee pods produce more. Then of course some plans are more fertile than others. I had heard from iris people that TB 'Purgatory' was impossible to pod. One day I was walking past it with an envelope of SDB pollen in my pocket. 'Why not try" I thought . I had a take with a fair # of seeds result, but only 4 germinated. 3 plants with gold flowers resulted (poor growers so discarded) & one with tan S & red F which grows well & is still in our garden. It is the only 'Purgatory' child of which I know.

Take care of the plant which produced a large * of seeds & make sure to try the pollen from plants that you really like to use.
nhuntley
Holladay, UT
(Zone 5a)

August 22, 2011
11:10 AM

Post #8771048

irisMA, do you have a picture of the iris with tan S & red F? A man down the street has some that I would describe as looking like this, but his falls are a little more of a burgundy shade. He has a huge clump of them, and a couple of years ago, I noticed them for the first time. I could have sworn that they were a different color the year before, so I asked him about it. He said it's the same clump, but it came up with this new color that year. I've never heard of such a thing happening! He's legally blind (macular degeneration), so I don't know what to think. I know he can see some things, but I think he just forgot that he put in a new clump of flowers and moved the old ones!

Lilly, I didn't see the pictures of the three iris from the same pod. I'd love to see them!

Natalie

irisMA

irisMA
South Hamilton, MA

August 22, 2011
12:36 PM

Post #8771209

Our pictures are on slides & our printer won't scan those. I have to figure how to get a lot of pictures into the computer. Those would be mainly our seedlings, making it easier to study them.

The friend's iris may have 'red falls'. Irises don't have spectrum red, or the fire engine shades. Hybridizers keep trying for it, but the burgundy shades are can appear more red in some soils or with some plants, so the gentleman is probably right. Arazi has a brownish tint to the burgundy so would be more red.

blomma

blomma
Wyoming, WY
(Zone 4a)

August 22, 2011
12:37 PM

Post #8771213

Natalie, here are the first 2 of the 3 iris

Thumbnail by blomma
Click the image for an enlarged view.

blomma

blomma
Wyoming, WY
(Zone 4a)

August 22, 2011
12:39 PM

Post #8771214

And the 3, whichi similiar to one above.

Thumbnail by blomma
Click the image for an enlarged view.

blomma

blomma
Wyoming, WY
(Zone 4a)

August 22, 2011
12:44 PM

Post #8771221

And the mama pod. Bee pollinated. I think the bee visited Gay Parason first since I have it groing a few fee t away.

This is Buffawn (Andrews 1940)

Notice the hafts on one is similar to buffawn.

Thumbnail by blomma
Click the image for an enlarged view.

blomma

blomma
Wyoming, WY
(Zone 4a)

August 22, 2011
12:47 PM

Post #8771223

Here is the photo of the seedling that shown the hafts.

Sorry hem lovers. I know it is a forum for daylilies but had to fill a request.

Thumbnail by blomma
Click the image for an enlarged view.

blomma

blomma
Wyoming, WY
(Zone 4a)

August 22, 2011
12:53 PM

Post #8771232

irisMA wrote:Our pictures are on slides & our printer won't scan those. I have to figure how to get a lot of pictures into the computer. Those would be mainly our seedlings, making it easier to study them. .


I was in the same situation before digital camera. Had a canon and also used Kodachrome 64. What I did was take slides and negatives to Walmart and they put it on a cd which I was able to download to my computer. Walgreen may be abel to do it also.

Acording to Schreiner, no iris can change color.

irisMA

irisMA
South Hamilton, MA

August 22, 2011
12:58 PM

Post #8771235

I don't have a cd for that one, pic before computer. I have a couple others but have to figure out the windows 7 pathway to follow. I am so computer illeterate than EVERYTHING in a step to do must be written down. As you know just diescribing iris re as red can cover different shades. The shades of the same plant as well. the picture on the computer of my SDB amoena is more purple than it looks to the eye. As this shows:

Thumbnail by irisMA
Click the image for an enlarged view.

irisMA

irisMA
South Hamilton, MA

August 22, 2011
1:01 PM

Post #8771241

A picture of one of its seedlings:

Thumbnail by irisMA
Click the image for an enlarged view.

irisMA

irisMA
South Hamilton, MA

August 22, 2011
1:03 PM

Post #8771246

The ;Arazi' red is between the 2 colors.

Even our daylilies are different shades. Does plant files have the older daylilies? We grow 'Regal Aire' which is a deep burgundy type red & 'Chipper Cherry' which is much more of a 'true' red shade.
nhuntley
Holladay, UT
(Zone 5a)

August 22, 2011
1:08 PM

Post #8771259

Wow Lilly! They are beautiful! And it is amazing how different they are from the parent, and from each other! I've got to give this a try! No need to worry about posting the photos here. You started this thread on the hybridizer forum, not the daylily forum, so it's the perfect place!

I've never heard of an iris changing color before (I'm no expert though!), so I'm sure he's mistaken about that. It's sad that he started losing his eye sight so young, in his late 40s, and I think he may only be about 59 or 60 now. He's got a good attitude about it though. He got into gardening a few years ago, and his yard is stunning, especially for someone who can only see like they are looking through a key hole. I'm just positive that someone gave him a big clump of iris and he moved the ones that were in the same place to another spot.

irisMA, I was looking online the other day for a microfilm scanner, and found one on Amazon.com for under $50 used, and about $90 new. It said that is also scans slides, so maybe it's worth looking into if you have a lot of slides.

Natalie

nhuntley
Holladay, UT
(Zone 5a)

August 22, 2011
1:12 PM

Post #8771270

I'll have to take a picture of the neighbors iris next spring. I've never seen anything like them, and wasn't crazy about them at first, but I like them now. I think they got prettier the next year.

The only iris that I've ever bought that actually had the correct name on it was Before The Storm. It looks almost totally black when I'm looking at it, but looks dark purple in every picture. I wish it had bloomed this year!

Natalie

irisMA

irisMA
South Hamilton, MA

August 22, 2011
1:24 PM

Post #8771287

All black iris flowers are a form of dark purple. Before the Storm has one of the deppest color. Very hardy as well. I have Foeign Storm now which is more ruffled but not as deep a color. Same hybridizer, Sterling Innerst.
nhuntley
Holladay, UT
(Zone 5a)

August 22, 2011
9:03 PM

Post #8772166

irisMA, those are very pretty! I knew that the "black" iris were actually purple, but Before The Storm looks so much more black in person. It's funny how it shows up really purple in the picture.

Natalie

Thumbnail by nhuntley
Click the image for an enlarged view.

blomma

blomma
Wyoming, WY
(Zone 4a)

August 22, 2011
9:34 PM

Post #8772198

irisMa,
What I meant is for you to take your slides to Walmart and they will copy the photos on to a cd. Likewise any photos and negs. You can upload to your computer by putting the cd in your cd reader for the photos to come on your desktop then save them to a folder on your computer.

Natalie,
I have a scanner that does both slides and negatives. I paid $180 for it new from HP and even then I have to do a lot of photo editing for color. They are not worth buying used for they don't have a long life if you used them oftern Also, you get what you pay for when it comes to electronics.
nhuntley
Holladay, UT
(Zone 5a)

August 23, 2011
10:45 AM

Post #8772971

Lilly,

I was looking at an HP one too. I found it online for about $150 at a few stores, but found the same one at Amazon.com for about $90 new. I wouldn't buy a used one, but was just putting the price out there for irisMA to see. My other obsession is family history research, and I have a lot of records on microfilm. I also maintain two very large web sites for two counties in TN, that are for family history research, and I'd love to be able to make jpg files of the records on microfilm to put on the sites. I have a reader, but no way to print! Which scanner do you have? Are you happy with it? I don't know anyone else who has one!

Natalie

irisMA

irisMA
South Hamilton, MA

August 23, 2011
11:08 AM

Post #8773019

I have some cds. Have not worked with them as yet, not a cd with Arazi as yet. Wall Mart has been frozen out here. Have to go quite a distance with real ugh traffic to get to one.

In the daytime I am too busy & I was just told how to do it & night I am too tired. Tough being an 'old lady'.

blomma

blomma
Wyoming, WY
(Zone 4a)

August 23, 2011
11:23 AM

Post #8773048

Natalie, the scanner I have is HP Scanjet 4890. It is a flatbed. I have had it for a few years so don't think HP sells it anymore. It is hooked up to my XP. Won't work with Vista.

I like it and bought it to put all my slides of plants, and negatives and photos of my kids as they grew so I can put it on a cd for them.

Anytime I buy a new gadeget I check it out with HP's website. Also I buy online because usually the store don't carry all that HP has. I never buy electronics from Walmart or other discount stores.

Hp online has quite a few neg and slide scanners that I have looked at. It has to state that in the overview.
nhuntley
Holladay, UT
(Zone 5a)

August 23, 2011
12:24 PM

Post #8773169

My son is going to college for computer engineering, so he knows what to get and where to get it. He's been building computers for years! I'm one lucky Mom!

Natalie

irisMA

irisMA
South Hamilton, MA

August 23, 2011
2:03 PM

Post #8773319

I have a HP computer. Had to have windows 7 put in as Vista could be repaired, but would not stay repaired so still learning this system.

blomma

blomma
Wyoming, WY
(Zone 4a)

August 23, 2011
6:57 PM

Post #8773785

I have xp and love it. My laptop is Window 7 and I hate it. Both are HP. The only reason I bought a laptop is that I had surgery last year and stayed at my son's for 5 weeks. I had to do something or I would go nuts.
RIRISH
Bonne Terre, MO

November 16, 2011
12:00 PM

Post #8892966

Enjoyed reading all the threads From july? up until this point about growing your seedlings etc.
.
About iris...I have grown them too for 20 years hybridized quite afew too ...not like Schreiners but on a tiny scale...Wanted to say you can get a head start on your iris seedlings too by putting the seeds in the fridge for a month or 2 in damp not wet sand in a ziplock baggie just as you do daylilies.
Then take out and plant in dirt inside during the winter under a florescent light
.In spring plant outside and the next year you will get some flowers
.Not all of them bloom but some will.You save about 5 or 6 months anyway growing inside
.This process was in the Iris societies booklet one year
All the talk of seedling about to bloom i also am anxious to see what you post next year now!

I have started my first "bought" DL seeds from Ebay .Wish i was Rip V. winkle and could wake up tomorrow 2 years from now!! !See what i have blooming.

Love to see what you get from your thick edged daylily.
Got out of growing DL's for 6 years but these wonderful thick edges ( are they called pie crusted?)ones have brought me back... Big Time.LOVE them
. Also I have grown the TB's, SDB's and Ib's Siberian's too. I also had a huge amount of iris for 18 years or more150-200 and this last summer something came thru and i have just a handful left unles there are some in mytfield whick are form my old house..My in- yard store
.When something blooms out there I go see if its in the yard too!If not it comes in. .
.Dont know what go thje irs this ysummer... the heat?,weeds?shade? my big dogs,contributed or bugs...most likely a hord of borers but they have dissappeared as if they never were there .in every spot in my yard .GONE!
Too bad i just got back into gardening this fall so didnt see the demise during summer or what did it
.Not even a crust of rizome left .Its weird.
So started with new ones from Shcreiners my go to iris place too!!Bought !Mostly pinks as my favoriite of all in my yard was a lacey ruffled pink called Alice Goodman a Rodrick iris.
So looking for Alice again I bought
Kitty Kay,
Designer Labe
l and and another i cant think of and
Orange King
.a new start...
Hope they all are as pretty as the photos .sometimes they arent!!
!Better to see in person but i got enthusiastic and bought anyway..
Also bought daylilies to cross 2012 summer..
. Lisa Renee for the edge.
.Cherrystone and
Wild Mustange aLL lpink from Roycorft.
Have to look at the place you all mentioned Blue Ridge?
Thanks for the enjoyable afternoon of reading about the wonderful flowers iN your yards.

AND BLOOMA...I THINK YOU TOLD ME HOW TO PL ANT MY DAYLILYS SEEDS INDOORS...I HAVE SOME SEEDLING JUST STARTED TODAY!!..
i AM SO EXCITED ITS CHRISTMAS FOR ME!!!!

irisMA

irisMA
South Hamilton, MA

November 16, 2011
1:47 PM

Post #8893115

Our iris seeds are planted outside for the winter. they were done too late last yr so no germination. Hope to see a lot germinating in the spring. These are median irises, not TBs.

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