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Bromeliads for novices and addicts, August 2011

Queensland, Australia

Hi Everyone,
this is the new thread for August for Bromeliads for novices and addicts. We came from
http://davesgarden.com/community/forums/t/1193617/
Post all your bromeliad pictures here, drop in for a chat, or ask questions, even if you think they are silly. We're all here to advise and admire all things bromeliad.
Ok welcome to August everyone.... and I remembered a photo this time.... hopefully I have redeemed myself over last months thread with no photo.
Tash

Thumbnail by springer99
shellharbour, Australia

Hi everyone,
Sue Ė I was told a while back about that ďhorse linimentĒ by a friend and Iíve been meaning to try it but it slipped my mind. The only trouble is that the way things are at the moment, Iíd probably have to bathe in it to get to all various aches and pains.

Karen Ė It is possible to buy a lot of these Tillandsia species and hybrids in Australia if you just contact someone who specialises in ďTilliesĒ. I donít know who they are as I donít grow Tillies but I imagine someone here can tell you. Getting them from America (or any other country for that matter) is usually possible, but they have to go through Aust Quarantine and this requires gassing with Methyl bromide which usually kills a good percentage of them. If they get through this, they have to be quarantined in a registered quarantine house for about six months before they are released. Add to this all the various Govt. Import Fees. Permit Fees, Inspection Fees, Gassing Fees, Quarantine Fees and any others that Julia can think up at the time. All of that plus the fact they are often roughly handled by people who donít care or understand bromeliads (not nice and gently by brom lovers) and are often damaged in transit due to rough handling (Iíve seen picís of this). These are the reasons I would never import any type of brom. Read the AQIS (Aust Quarantine Inspection Service) regulations on line, all hundreds of pages of them. They just make it so hard itís no wonder people try to bring stuff in illegally.

Bree Ė I really like your Red Chestnut cross. Itís a pity you canít read the tag any more. This seems to be a common problem when people buy plants written on a faded old tag. Itís always a good idea to write new tag when you get the plant and the name is still legible, cause once itís gone, itís gone for good unless you know the grower and they can identify the plant for you.

Sue Ė Thanks for that recipe, the only trouble is that pineapples arenít always easy to get down here and when they are theyíre pretty pricey. As for the Ae. Weilbachii, I have a few different ones and a couple of them are pendulous (the last two I think). Thereís weilbachii var weilbachii, weilbachii var April Showers, weilbachii var April Storm, weilbachii var. Pendula, weilbachii var viridesepala.

Jen Ė Youíve done a good job of growing your weilbachii. Down here itís often one of those plants that seems to attract a bit of leaf tip die back, but I donít see any on yours. Whatís the cultural secret?

Good on you Tash, itís just as well everyoneís not waiting on me to start a new thread or youíd have a long wait.

Wendy Ė You asked for a pic of my Rosy Morn x Gee Whiz babies, well here they are. Still very small but Iím hoping theyíll really take off when spring arrives.

All the best, Nev.

Thumbnail by splinter1804
shellharbour, Australia

Hi everyone,

I've stufffed up yet again! I just posted a pic of an unusual Ae. weilbachii pendula, and it's come up on last months page ????????????????

All the best, Nev.

Brisbane, Australia

Hi again. Thanks for the responses regarding importing tills. I know we have to protect our country from foreign diseases etc. but it just seems to me they ban anything that grows, then charge like wounded bulls for those things they'll let in. I am so fascinated with the tills and broms too, but tills because of their size and they don't need as much space, well, many of them don't.

Went to the markets on Sunday but nothing exciting there, in fact, there were a lot less stalls there. Maybe the cold?

Nev, that flowering Ae. is quite spectacular. Must've clicked on the wrong thread?

Karen

Red Ribbons is turning into something of a tree climber..........



This message was edited Aug 1, 2011 2:33 PM

Thumbnail by DawnSong
Queensland, Australia

Good morning everyone,
it's a sunny bit windy day here which is making it feel cold at the moment.
Wendy that vr honolulu beauty is a beautiful brom, very nice, I might have to add that one to my list too, gee my list is getting longer all the time.
And Bree your chestnut X is beautiful too, I love these foliage type Vrieseas a lot.
Love the seedlings Nev, nice to see pics of little seedlings :) I can't wait for mine to grow and watch all the changes they make.
Well not much going on here, haven't received anything new as yet, I don't think.... get myself confused already and I don't even have that many, lol.
My Vriesea seeds are starting to sprout, it's very exciting. Not all have sprouted, but a lot of them now are.
At what stage would any of you start using a liquid fertiliser on your tiny seedlings?
My little Neo ones are coming along nicely outside in their little plastic house, I open and close it each day unless it's a cold day, then I leave it shut. It gets a little bit of afternoon sun hitting it through the shade cloth, but nothing to heat it up too much yet, but as summer approaches I will need to keep and eye on it and make sure the sun doesn't move and end up cooking my babies. Other wise, I'll have to move their little house :)
Tash

Brisbane, Australia

Tash, well done on starting a new thread. I'm with Nev. Happy to leave it to you and Sue to keep us rolling. What's the name of the Neo in the middle of your top photo? It looks very much like one of my favourites called Cherry Delight in the photo below. Nev, just love that Ae. photo. Very spectacular. They seem to be very easy to grow up here. I only remember to look at it when it's flowering. Jen

Thumbnail by brombirdie
Queensland, Australia

Hi Jen,
love your pic, so that's a Neo Cherry Delight, love the colours. The one in the middle of my pic is a Neo Fool's Gold.
They were some we brought last month, but it was a nice photo I thought for the new thread since I forgot to add one last month, lol.
Here is a photo of my Quesnelia starting to flower, no one has been too sure which one it is, but I am thinking it is a Quesnelia quesneliana rubra. Could I be right?
Tash

Thumbnail by springer99
Brisbane, Australia

Tash, that's a lovely Quesnelia but I don't know enough about them to tell you the difference. I've only got one that looks very similar to yours. In the shade the leaves are very green but grown in the sun the leaves are quite red with bands underneath. Jen

Queensland, Australia

Hi Jen, it sounds like they are the same, here is another pic of the same one about 2 weeks ago with it's pup in front of it, the pup is green, mum is red and yes with the banding under the leaves :) Everyone told me the flower would be quite stunning and they are right so far :)
Tash

Thumbnail by springer99

tash this is our quesnelia arvensis when it flowered last year. We have about 4 just about to flower. They are all closed up and you can just see the colour down in the middle of the closed plant. I know we have ques arvensis, rubra, testudo, tim plowman.

Wendy

Thumbnail by perke_patch
Brisbane, Australia

Oh, more mouth watering pics. Jen what a beauty that Cherry Delight is. I really love that every day brings a brom I've never seen before. Could never tire of them.

This is a mini called Vulcan, showing some nice colour now. Looking forward to seeing some pups start forming on my minis.

Karen

Thumbnail by DawnSong
north coast nsw, Australia

wonder if mines that also. Its a mini.

Thumbnail by breeindy
Queensland, Australia

Good morning,
Nice mini Karen, I love the colours in it. Yours too Bree, very nice :) Ohh I can't wait for some of the mini's I have been given to flower as well. I have all these single mini's, can't wait until I have mini's spreading all over the place, lol.

Thanks Wendy, well I wonder if mine is an arvensis? I read somewhere that they are hard to tell apart, not sure how correct that is, but that three of them, testudo, arvensis and quesneliana all have similar looks in the plant and the flower and can be near impossible to tell which is which.
But as we all know, you can't trust everything you read on the internet, so that could all be a load of rubbish. I'll have to look up some info again and re read since it is now flowering and now would be the best time to work out which one it is :)
I put this photo on Facebook last night, so any of you on there would have seen it already, but I thought I'd share it in here too.

Thumbnail by springer99
Brisbane, Australia

First spots, then stripes. This is a NOID mini. I love my minis.

Bree, your mini has more rounded leaves, I think. It is a lovely one, clearly tipped red.

Karen

Thumbnail by DawnSong
shellharbour, Australia

Good morning everyone,

Gee you girls have outdone yourselves with all the pic's, it really makes the foum well worth a visit and maybe we'll get some new members, who knows.

I'd just like to comment on Quesnelias; the name of Tash's plant I'm just not sure about as this was discussed in some detail on another forum last year and the general opinion was that the "Rubra" part of the name was just an "add on". It seemed pretty common in the past that if a plant had darker leaves with a reddish tinge to them it was just tagged with "rubra" which I think from memory is Latin for red (but don't hold me to this as the memory ain't what it used to be)

My personal view is that it is probably another form of Arvensis and the colour varies according to the amount of light under which it is grown. As an experiment, if anyone has two of three of these plants; try growing them in different degree of light, it will only take a couple of months to see the change in foliage colour, and then post the results with pic's, it will be very interesting.

Anyhow, Tash, whatever it's called, it's a nice plant, as are Ques. arvensis and Ques. testudo (all very similar) and they all have those beautiful cerise coloured crepe paper type flowers which makes them well worth growing, but beware of the prickles!

All the best, Nev.

Queensland, Australia

Hey Nev, thanks heaps for that, I will keep an eye on it as the flowers comes out properly. Prickles, what prickles, do you mean the leaves of the plant or are there prickles on the flower as well??
Yeah I seem to see rubra tagged on the ends of things and wondered what that was all about, interesting these names.
It has rained a little over night here which is nice, the ground is so dry and dead at the moment, but it's amazing what a little bit of rain can do for the place.
Tash

Coffs Harbour, Australia

Well done Tash! The pic is great! I'm glad I can count on you to get in and have a go!
Jen, your 'Cherry delight' is gorgeous!
Nev, I loved the Aechmea weilbachii pic on the previous thread. Thanks for keeping us up on all the info you glean from other places, that we might otherwise not learn.
Karen, nice piccies too. i love A. 'Red Ribbons'. I have mine in a cone shaped wall basket and the flower hangs down over the side. I didn't think of climbing it up a tree. Your minis are looking colourful too.
I have Quesnelia 'Farro' (a variegated Q. testudo) which has yet to flower (has anyone seen one flower?) and Q. marmorata, Q. 'Curly Tops' and Q. 'Tim Plowman'. I have Q. liboniana, but I threw most of them out as the foliage is always a bit tatty. I'd like to get Q. indecora, as I like its delicate pink flowers, Q. sedeliana with its blue flowers and Q.edmundoi with its yellow flowerhead! Guess I'll put them on the wish list!
Heres a pic of a flowering Q. marmorata, and you can see some tatty Q. liboniana leaves in the background
Sue

Thumbnail by weed_woman

Hi. Nev we have ques arvensis and rubra and we put them together in one very large tub to see what the difference was when they flowered. I will take a pic tomorrow but growing in the same light etc the rubra appears to be a bigger plant with a more darker red tinged colour to the leaves. I am now waiting for the lower to compare the two. Both are now coming into flower. I can just see the colour starting to show down the centre. woohoo.

I always thought ques testudo was a variegated quesnelia. We have one of those out the front coming into flower at the moment. Both the plant and the flower are so much bigger than the other versions and with the yellow stripes (can't remember if it is albo or simply variegated).

We grow the quesnelias behind the green shadehouse up the back in full sun. When we see the tops starting to close up we know that means the flowers are developing so we bring them out again to make a show.

Wendy

shellharbour, Australia

Good morning everyone,

Karen and Sue - I have never seen the Red Ribbons down in our area ad the closest we have is one called Foster's Favourite Favourite but it has burgundy coloured leaves. If anyone has a spare pup of Red Ribbons theywnt to swap I'm interested.

Sue it's a good collection of Quesnelias you're getting together there and it's very interesting to see the one in the pic which I've never seen before. It seems to have a similar flower and spike habit to liboniana, both of which I think look a bit like billbergias. Do the flowers last very long or are they short lived like the flowers on the Bill's. Considering the likeness between some of these Ques types and Billbergias, I wouldn't be surprisd to see the taxonomists eventually put them into the Billbergia family as they are also quite different to some of the other Quesnelias as well.

Wendy, youe trial with the different Quesnelias should finally sort ou if they are the same plantor not and from what you say, they seem to be different plants. (looks like another one for the wish list)

Regarding Testudo, there are two types, one is just plain with simiklar foliage to arvensis but ther is also a variegated one as well, so it seems you have the good one (looks like another for the list) - any chance of a picture of the variegated foliage?

With all these pictures lately it sems like I had better start pulling my weight as well and so I'll attach a picture of "an oldie but a goodie". It's very common vriesea called carinata and has been around for "yonks" but still looks good when allowed to grow into a clump.

All the best, Nev.






shellharbour, Australia

Hi again,

Ooops! Sorry I forgot to attach the pic, so here it is now.

It had 12 spikes last year and I was going to divide it after flowering and never got around to it. This year, big surprise, 21 spikes.

All the best, Nev.

Thumbnail by splinter1804
Queensland, Australia

Hi everyone,
it's cold and wet and windy here today, not too common up here in the tropics, but it is today.
Sounds like you have a few Quesnelias Sue, and yes I see what you mean Nev about some looking like Bills, and the flower too. the colour reminds me of my Neo Marmorata, is that what it's named after?
I had to go and look them up on FCBS and I'll have to show Jason (hubby) cause he has been pointing out broms with the curled leaves like the Tim Plowman and marmorata has and asking what are they, I didn't know. I thought all Quesnelias would look some what like mine. Guess not! LOL
I like the look of Farro on fcbs.
Wendy, it will be good to see your photos of the two together.
Must say I am loving all the pics too.
Nev that photo is awesome, 21 spikes, how cool is that? It looks amazing as a clump. It must of had lots of pups last year to almost double it's number of spikes, thanks for sharing it.
Tash

Hi all
Nev that clump of carinata looks amazing. I hope you don't mind if I save the pic and print it out. I'm going to save one of our pots to allow it to clump up in a hanging basket.

When we went up north Qld last year I bought a tim plowman x lieboniana which was a single small tube. Now I have 3 pots with 3 tubes in each and each one with a flower. Unfortunately it doesn't have a curled over top like tim plowman but it does look nice with the red flowers. I wish I had sold at least one of them last weekend when someone wanted one. Ah well next time it flowers perhaps I will be ready to let some go.

This is a quesnelia flowering at my brothers today. I wonder if it is the same as mine? If not I know where I can get one heheheh.

Wendy

Thumbnail by perke_patch

this is a pic of a pot we stumbled onto down the backyard last week. Johnny cleaned it up potted it into a bigger pot and put it in a display pot out the front. Everyone loved it. Don't have a name but it looks spectacular in flower. I guess the variegated plant looks all right too or we wouldn't have kept the clump.

Wendy

Thumbnail by perke_patch
shellharbour, Australia

Hi everyone,

Tash - That's not cold, wet and windy; you're just spoilt with nice warm weather all the time and it seems that way. What we had a few weeks back when the wind was blowing up from the snow fields with icy cold rain was "COLD wet and windy"; in fact it was bloody freezing!

The problem with my Vr. carinata now is what to do with it? Do I divide it when the flowers finish or move it up to a larger pot and hope for thirty spikes next year? decisions, decisions, decisions.

Wendy - I don't mind what you or anyone else does with any pictures I post, I post them to share with everyone and if someone can get some enjoyment from them, then I've achieved my aim. I just wish I had cleaned it up before I took the pic as it was a spur of the moment thing. With you all posting pic's I thought I had better do something, and forgot to take off the dead leaves and give it a good clean.

Your Ques.Tim Plowman x lieboniana cross sounds very interesting, do you have any pic's of it, either in or out of flower? I'm always on the lookout for something a bit unusual so if you have a pup to swap, please let me know.

That picture of the Ques. at your brotherís house, is the colour a true indication of the colour of the flower? It's just that red is a very difficult colour to capture accurately with a camera and the colour in the flower and the pic never seem to be the same. I know I've nearly gone "round the twist" trying to get an accurate pic (colour wise) of a red Neo., I tried every adjustment I could make on the camera and still "no joy".

As for the pot you "stumbled onto" in the back yard, I have one as well and as you say it's quite spectacular when it flowers. The foliage can be quite variable and even sometimes it will throw up a plain yellowish sport, however with no chlorophyll, once removed from the mother plant they quickly die. Oh and I nearly forgot, the name is Billbergia Foster's Striate.

All the best, Nev.

Aechmea nudicaulis 'Costa Rica'

Thumbnail by splinter1804
Queensland, Australia

morning :)
Well it's not so miserable here today, he he he. I know I am spoilt up here aren't I Nev, lol, mind you summer it not so nice with the rotten humidity, heat I can handle, it's the humidity that is the killer in Summer for us. I hope my broms go ok in summer, they are doing great in winter, but I haven't done a summer with them yet. All my Neo Cockabells are in full sun at the moment, but I am wondering if summer might fry them?? Saw photos the other day of what happens when the water in the cup reflects and burns the leaves, so I'm a bit worried that might happen to mine. Might have to move them. Or give them some little shade umbrellas, lol. Hubby has this idea of making some halo type looking frames and sticking shade cloth on there and just stabbing it into the pot, lol. he has some crazy and interesting ideas. But I must say, some of his ideas are gold.
Love the photos. I will have to try and get a photo today of my quesnelia flower, it's up more now.
I can't wait to "stumble onto" some nice brom tucked away in the back somewhere, lol, I don't have enough yet to lose any in the back ....yet ;)
sorry no photo to attach, I'll have to have a wander and take the camera and see what I can find :)
Tash

barmera, Australia

Love the pics and info everyone. Yes I'm still lurking in the background. Thought that you might like to see my trolley of broms that I've just got. More treasures. Colleen

Thumbnail by ctmorris
shellharbour, Australia

Hi everyone,

Colleen - Seems like you'll soon have the brom's taking over everything.

What's the variegated one in the trolley at the top, is it a Nidularium? It just looks a bit like a Nidularium I have called Nid. Innocentii lineatum.

All the best, Nev.

Thumbnail by splinter1804
barmera, Australia

Hi Nev. Yes that's it. The post is slack isn't it? Colleen

Merino, Australia

Hello all. Just been checking my brom pics and found pics of some of the old ones that came in the load of epis back in 2006 .
Dear old bill. 'Gerda' . I remember when I first saw the pots of her . Huge pots of all these dead things. I didnt know about broms then but I saw a bit of green in one so it came home. I took the green bit and planted it in a pot then tossed all the rest of the dead things against an old tree stump. The bits are still there and would you believe, still putting out pups.
I really like Gerda for hardiness. No weather bothers her. She gets full of rain in winter and rather dry in summer when I forget to water.

I found this pic of one I would like to know the name of. It will grow outside in all weather too. I did take a pup from it a few years ago which has pups of its own now. The mother plant flowered back in 2009 . I asked a while ago but now there are new faces on the brom thread, you may know what I have.
I thought at first it was Ae 'Inca', but the whole plant is different .
I was told it may be Ae 'Mary Brett'. The flower does look like that also the plant with its spiky leaves.
My older plant is about 16"tall and as wide.
I didnt get very good pics at the time and havent had another flower since .
The flower was a lot brighter red at first with small red leaves/petals which faded away leaving this cone of yellowy blue flowers.
I looked on the bromeliad cultivar list and it says there is a "Mary Brett"clone with yellowish blue flowers.
I bought a small plant of what is supposed to be "Mary Brett" so I could compare, but am still waiting for it to grow and flower.

Excuse the white on the plant, The magpies like to perch over the shadehouse.
Jean.

Thumbnail by 77sunset
Merino, Australia

Closer pic of the flower.
Very pretty when it opened with all the bright red.

This message was edited Aug 6, 2011 10:35 AM

Thumbnail by 77sunset
shellharbour, Australia

Hi everyone,

Sorry Jean I can't help you with a name for your plant, but if you don't have any objections, I could post the pic's on the Bromeliad and Airplant Forum and I'm sure we'd get an ID there.

Colleen - Maybe next time we need to spend the extra and send by express post, much quicker.

All the best, Nev.

Merino, Australia

Than you Nev.
I do like to know the names of my plants if possible, even though I am not the avid collector as most of you here are. I am fond of the bills and tills and am going to try for a few more as they seem to like it here. I like the colors of the neos but prefer the aechmeas for flowers.
I have a few dyckias (encholiriodes x brevilfolia ) here somewhere under the weeds too. i must get them out when it warms up a bit. I moved the puya which was covered in grass, poor thing. I wish it would flower too.
The dyckias flower with their tall flower stems. Very spiky to handle. I dont like them much but they all came with the epis and I dont like to throw a good plant out. I may put them out along the road edge with the agaves and aloes.
Jean.

barmera, Australia

Jean if you don't want the dickyas I'll have them please. They put them up over in the C&S site occassionally and I only said to John the other day, that I should look into finding some. If you really don't want them then D-mail me with a price please. Colleen

Nev thank you for the name of that billbergia. I have already named the photo and will tag it tomorrow. A while back a person who does more photography than I told me to get true colour on broms you need to make the camera focus on your skin tone then remove your hand to take the pic. Since then my photos seem to be closer to real colour. Looking back at my previous photos of quesnelia it looked more hot pink than red so I'm wondering if there is more than one colour in the garden. We have about 6 or more coming into flower including the 2 in the square tub so I will compare soon.

Nev I'll add the ques x to your list for next parcel. I have to trawl through back dmails to see what you have requested to add to list so if you know of any you have requested please let me know.

This is a pic of our ae inca.

Wendy

Thumbnail by perke_patch

Jen we're going to the markets tomorrow. Now you have had a day to perfect the wheelchair do you want to come along hehehehe. Can't believe your first day out of bed and into the wheelchair you used it to vacuum. How many times did you bump the leg into furniture I wonder before you got the hang of it. I guess you'll be outside in the wheelchair supervising us working on the shadehouse for you next week right?????? we better get the shadecloth up for her so she doesn't attempt to climb that ladder again.

Starting a book people ........ how many days will it be before Jen works out how to get herself and the wheelchair into the car when she goes stircrazy stuck at home and unable to get out into the garden. I'll give her a week at home alone and she'll be trying to go somewhere. LOL At least she has the run of the house now with the wheelchair. I'll pop around with a bun for a cuppa every few days and a check on the seedlings for you. After all you looked after my seedlings when we were away so it's payback now ..... my turn.

our ae siedeliana is flowering now and everyone wants some. I should have broken a basket up last year so they'd be ready now instead of breaking up baskets on demand. I think we have about 5 baskets like this pic but one is less full now hehehe

Wendy

Thumbnail by perke_patch

I forgot in previous posts to tell you we have flower spikes coming up everywhere in our foliage vriseas. soon we'll be trying to decide which ones to take pollen from and which ones to put pollen on. there'll be tags hanging everywhere hehehehehe.

Snows of ....., forrest, platynema, intermedia, ...... about 8 in all coming into flower.

Wendy

Brisbane, Australia

Lovely photo Wendy. Your garden is just a mass of flowers at the moment. Maybe you need to take a video like Sue did and load it onto FB so we can all have a tour. I tried to sneak the wheelchair out into the yard today but Ray is watching me like a hawk. But you know they say about cats being away! I'll have to pass on the markets tomorrow but as you said I'll be stir crazy by next weekend.

shellharbour, Australia

Good morning everyone,

Jean - I've shown the pic's of your plant to several brom growing friends including posting it on the Brom. Forum and they all seem to agree that it's Mary Brett. It seems whoever told you it was Mary Brett is correct.
Here's one of the answers from N.Z. and I think if you check the web address he sent you will agree.

"Hey Nev,

It looks like Aechmea 'Mary Brett' to me. I used to have heaps of them, they're a good tough aechmea.

http://botu07.bio.uu.nl/bcg/bcr/index.php?genus=AECHMEA&id=350#350

Cheers, Andrew."

Colleen - What's the C & S site?

Wendy - Re. the Quesnelias, yes all of mine seem to be more of a very Hot Pink than red also, yet every time I photograph them they look red and likewise, everytime I take pic's of my red Neo's the colour is never true either, so thanks for that tip about the skin colour and the hand, I must try it (but not today as it's raining again)

Sorry I can't help you with the plants I asked you for as I never kept a list and of course the memory won't help me.

Jen - You really need to take it easy with that knee you know, because if you fall out of the chair while trying to climb the ladder with it, you could tear the tendons right off the bone and that's a very, very long healing process and will "clip your wings" severely.

By the way, does the chair have seat belts on it? It seems in your case it should.

Wendy - That idea about taking a video sounds great and it would be especially good for people like me who will never get to see your garden in person.

Also with your Vrieseas you plan to hybridise, it's a good idea to isolate them in a shade cloth enclosure so bats, moths, birds etc. can't pollinate them before you. There's been many a hybrid made which have turned out to be the work of insects and not the human hybridiser.

All the best, Nev.

Merino, Australia

Thank you Nev.. I am glad to have the right name at last.
I did look at that site myself but wasnt exactly sure. Mine has darker green leaves but that may be from being in a cooler climate. It is certainly a very hardy plant.
I will hope for another flower so I can post it here.
Jean.

Brisbane, Australia

Thanks for the advice, Nev. The fall gave me a fright so I think I'll be a bit careful from now on. Certainly don't want to do anything that will slow down the healing as my 'brom wings' have already been severely clipped. Jen

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