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Water Gardens: Koi Sleeping Sickness

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mothermole
Deer Park, IL
(Zone 5b)

February 3, 2012
12:43 PM

Post #8993461

Has anyone ever experienced the koi sleeping sickness condition? They look dead but later when you come out to get them they are now at the bottom hibernating in the correct position. I have a fish right now that may have this. On and off over the last few days it has appeared dead and then later it appears more on the hibernating side. I'm in Chicago and it's too cold to do anything for the fish. It's a under 1 year old koi. I am going to attempt to get a picture.
mothermole
Deer Park, IL
(Zone 5b)

February 4, 2012
2:17 PM

Post #8994681

My dead fish have risen from the dead 3 times and returned. Must be vampires . . .
Carolyn22
Athens, PA
(Zone 5b)

February 4, 2012
2:23 PM

Post #8994687

Or Lazarus...

Linda - I am not familiar with this. Do they lay on their sides and then are upright later? Is it the same fish all the time or different ones?

Interesting.
BonnieGardens
Clermont, FL
(Zone 9a)

February 5, 2012
6:09 PM

Post #8996008

I'm really curious as to whats going on with your fish mothermole. Sounds like their faking you out for sympathy and thinking they don't like being under that ice. Hope spring comes soon and maybe they'll perk up.
Wish you good luck with them.
Bonnie
Carolyn22
Athens, PA
(Zone 5b)

February 6, 2012
1:23 AM

Post #8996237

Linda

I googled this as I am sure you did as well. Apparently there is some need to get the fish to warmer water - is that something you can do? Is the fish still doing this?
Oberon46
(Mary) Anchorage, AK
(Zone 5b)

February 6, 2012
6:21 AM

Post #8996418

Gee Carolyn, at that rate all my fish should be laying around on their backs (or sides). lol. Can't see them now. Too much snow and the ice is very unclear. It has been pretty warm and I was hoping to get a larger open hole to see what is going on down there.
Carolyn22
Athens, PA
(Zone 5b)

February 6, 2012
2:20 PM

Post #8997000

I was thinking about this on the way to work - apparently what I was reading was the water temp needed to be brought to a higher temperature.

http://www.ehow.com/how_7704360_treat-sleeping-sickness-koi.html

Linda - any other symptoms? Can you call the guy who helped you 2 years ago?

BonnieGardens
Clermont, FL
(Zone 9a)

February 7, 2012
4:59 PM

Post #8998375

Carolyn,
Great site. Read all the info. It's amazing what these little creatures can get. Sure hope it can be cured.

Bonnie
mothermole
Deer Park, IL
(Zone 5b)

February 15, 2012
8:18 AM

Post #9007550

No can do with the warmer water - heck I can't even get them out-my pond is 5 feet deep minimum-no deaths and yes it has been different fish but a couple of them are "repeats" . Two years ago I think I tossed a fish that I thought was dead but probably had this. Our temps haven't been too bad this winter. One of you asked what they look like-well, sometimes laying on their sides (looking very much dead) sometimes it appears their swim bladder isn't working and they are tilted only to be fine an hour later. I haven't seen any signs of it this week and it has been much colder. I think they somehow got a copy of a book that was titled "How to come in from the cold" by Mr. Faking Koi Fish. lol! Seriously though, I think they are all fine it's just in the past two years nothing happened like this. I suspect that as soon as it warms up that I might lose a few due to the stress. I plan to get them into a hospital tank as soon as I can and treat them for parasites and bacteria.
Oberon46
(Mary) Anchorage, AK
(Zone 5b)

February 15, 2012
9:28 AM

Post #9007646

Now I really feel badly. Two years ago I saw a fish laying on the bottom on his side (dead ones are pretty much always on the top) and figured he was dead. I wanted to get him out so he didn't pollute the water and used a spear fishing fork to nail him, several times to catch him. Ouch...I REALLY hope he was dead. eeeeuuuu.

Lily_love

Lily_love
Central, AL
(Zone 7b)

February 15, 2012
10:37 AM

Post #9007710

I recently lost a large Koi, Casper was over six years of age. He was laying in the bottom of the pond motionless. Having read this thread, I wondered now if the Koi was just playing dead, and not really dead? Well DH netted him out and tossed him into a lake. If he survived the harsh treatment. There is a chance he may wake up? Hmmmm
dax080
Cedar Rapids, IA
(Zone 5a)

February 15, 2012
10:48 AM

Post #9007718

eeeeeeuuuuuuu too! THANKS for this thread -- never heard anything like it -- very glad to know, cause I could easily have removed one too --- eeeeeeuuuuu!

crazy4brugs

crazy4brugs
Kansasville, WI
(Zone 5a)

February 16, 2012
6:45 AM

Post #9008638

Linda, here is a place you can call. They may have some information for your fish, as they have been
very helpful to me. They are also about 40 miles from you.

http://keystonehatcheries.com/contact

Hope they can help you.
mothermole
Deer Park, IL
(Zone 5b)

March 6, 2012
11:39 AM

Post #9032238

Hey Ms. Brugs (sorry I can't recall your name . . ) Nice to hear from you.

I know Keystone-it's a cool place-have you ever visited them? It's neat to see how they raise lake fish for resell.


My fish having played any "sleeping games" lately. Not one has died either nor do I see any ulcers or anything on them. However I do expect to struggle in spring in the hospital tank as I know they are vulnerable. I have all my meds ready . . .
MerryMary
Ocoee (W. Orlando), FL
(Zone 9b)

March 6, 2012
6:50 PM

Post #9032725

Gosh MM...I hope you dont have spring problems...Can you start adding extra bacteria/enzymes as soon as the water turns 50?
Carolyn22
Athens, PA
(Zone 5b)

March 7, 2012
1:24 AM

Post #9032918

Linda

Hoping you don't have problems too. I am hoping we don't have any problems as well. We are going to start up as soon as the uv light bulbs arrive -which should be in time for this weekend. When do you think you will be starting up?
dax080
Cedar Rapids, IA
(Zone 5a)

March 7, 2012
9:26 AM

Post #9033267

With this warm weather, my water was at 50 degrees yesterday -- but -- I'm going to wait at least a couple more weeks before I start it up -- need to get some cleaning done before I add the bacteria, etc. All the fish survived easily this year -- no problems, but I only have types of goldfish -- so they're very easy to maintain --

Dax

Thumbnail by dax080
Click the image for an enlarged view.

Oberon46
(Mary) Anchorage, AK
(Zone 5b)

March 7, 2012
9:33 AM

Post #9033275

the bigger white and red ones look like koi. How deep is your pond?
MerryMary
Ocoee (W. Orlando), FL
(Zone 9b)

March 7, 2012
11:13 AM

Post #9033383

Dax...I love the red and white sarassa butterfly goldfish... I started taking out any remaining orange ones, and leaving only the butterfly shubunkin goldfish, and the butterfly sarassa goldfish. Supposedly they breed more slowly than the normal standard comet goldfish, so you don't get over run as quickly...and they are prettier too! :)
dax080
Cedar Rapids, IA
(Zone 5a)

March 7, 2012
2:19 PM

Post #9033609

Yes, and I have had good fortune with shubunkins too. There are some very pretty goldfish -- I love all the fantails. And I've got a couple of granddaddy's - almost a foot long. I'd love to cull them down to just the showy ones, but they are the devil to catch unless the pond is drained. It's 4 feet deep, and otherwise in good ecological balance, so I hate to drain it. Will probably need to go in with my husband and a drag net between us. A local pet store will take them, so at least they will go someplace for a new life.

I'm afraid it's up to at least 100 -- at least with a larger pond, it can support them, but I do need to cull them. Here they are in early April last year -- with our mallard pair. As soon as the lilys grow, it's much harder to see them --

Dax

Thumbnail by dax080
Click the image for an enlarged view.

Oberon46
(Mary) Anchorage, AK
(Zone 5b)

March 7, 2012
3:46 PM

Post #9033727

I really like how they show up so brightly. some of my koi are hard to see - like the one we named Dark Vader.
mothermole
Deer Park, IL
(Zone 5b)

March 12, 2012
7:13 AM

Post #9039240

Dax: Love your pond pictures-your pond looks so natural.
Just wanted to post that all my fish survived the sleeping sickness and appear in very good overall health. The water in my pond has been in the 55-60 degree range and I fed them a small amount so I could get a look at them. No ulcers, no clamped fins, no isolation - so I would say they are doing fine. My pond doesn't get officially started up for a few weeks and I always treat them in the spring for most medical issues as a precautionary measure. I can only catch them when the water is low at draining.

The sleeping sickness made for an interesting post didn't it?
mothermole
Deer Park, IL
(Zone 5b)

March 19, 2012
8:56 AM

Post #9048625

All my fish are alive and well this spring-even with the sleeping sickness. I took pictures yesterday during an especially aggressive feeding time - they got me all wet. It was 80 degrees yesterday in the Chicago suburbs.

Thumbnail by mothermole
Click the image for an enlarged view.

Oberon46
(Mary) Anchorage, AK
(Zone 5b)

March 19, 2012
9:21 AM

Post #9048687

Holy cow. They are like paranhia (spelling is wrong - you know - those flesh eating fish)
Carolyn22
Athens, PA
(Zone 5b)

March 19, 2012
5:22 PM

Post #9049351

Linda

Mine have been active as well. I did finally start feeding them this past week. Water temps have been at 60 degrees. We vacuumed the pond, and fertilized the waterlilies this past weekend.
MerryMary
Ocoee (W. Orlando), FL
(Zone 9b)

March 19, 2012
7:25 PM

Post #9049533

Mine, of course, have stayed very active (just because of our climate) but I've been battling terrible oak leaves, acorns, oak pollen, and camphor leaves and berries...Sheesh, it seems to be never ending this year! The water is murky, even though I net the pond every day, backwash the filter, and keep adding bacteria/enzymes. I've even done partial water changes, but don't want to do them too often. In Florida, our oak trees have smaller leaves, and they don't fall in the "fall" they fall off when the new spring growth pushes them off. The camphor trees new growth pushes off little caps that encapsulated it, along with the berries. Holy cow...can't wait for spring to move on in to summer!!!
BonnieGardens
Clermont, FL
(Zone 9a)

March 20, 2012
5:56 PM

Post #9050670

M Mary,
After what I've been thru with leaves, oak blossom etc. before next year I will make sure I have enough screening for all 3 ponds. I even removed 1 pump as it was so clogged with leaves it was operating on lesser strength. I skimed off leaves twice a day but didn't help much. I know just what you mean. One gal is having a screen room built over her pond. Charlie could build one but with location of my ponds thats not possible. He brought out new fountain to show me today. Two options one is large mushroom spray and one head shoots straight up with some droping to sides..
Of course he reminded me parts came mostly from what I call his junk in his shop. Should provide more aeration in larger pond and one son Jeff bought for me fits small pond perfectly.
Hopefully we will get all set up and running again soon. Charlie has to do some valve changes on water supply to larger pond. Right now old pond is doing good. We numbered them pond 1-2 and 3 so when we are discussing ponds we know which we are talking about.

Dax love your ducks but don't they poop in water and make it murky? I used to have 4 pet mallards but with my young dog can't have them. Plus Fis & Game Dept. here says you have to have permit to own them now. If I wanted them I'd just ignore them. I think they are beautiful.

With all the problems I have been having with dead fish I'm seeing them in my sleep. Tonight I'm going to read a good book and try to forget them until morning.

Bonnie
MerryMary
Ocoee (W. Orlando), FL
(Zone 9b)

March 20, 2012
6:24 PM

Post #9050702

The good news is that I have replacement fish for you...The sad part is what it took to get them :/
Even though I've already treated my pond for parasites ( I do it every spring when the first water warming takes place) I just ordered more because of what you've been going through! Better safe than sorry! I saw shade cloth, like they use for sun umbrellas, available in rolls at Walmart, and thought about buying it for next year. I can maybe put up some up at angles on poles, like the big shade tarps over large pools. Maybe I can get the acorns to roll to one end and drop in the bushes? Just thinking out loud, lol...
mothermole
Deer Park, IL
(Zone 5b)

March 21, 2012
8:32 PM

Post #9052226

M. Mary: I use that shade stuff over my hospital tank. I have an easy idea that might work for you. At Home Depot or Lowes or same, buy white conduit plastic pipe and make a large structure that you can put on and off the pond. It's really easy. I cover my stream up like this and all I needed was the plan and the size and the angles and a hacksaw and the special glue that is needed. It's kinda hard to store away when not in use so I break it down a little (applying pressure to my "glue" joints and it snaps apart. Sometimes I break a joint or two but they are easily fixable with a new plastic piece that is v. inexpensive. I originally made a climbing unit for my kids to climb under in the yard to pretend that they were "soldiers in training" minus the barb wire and used landscape cloth. In the fall the leaves were making a mess of my stream and I pulled it over the stream and it worked great. I altered it a bit the following year to fit better.
MerryMary
Ocoee (W. Orlando), FL
(Zone 9b)

March 22, 2012
3:00 AM

Post #9052344

Sounds like a great idea! (and better than my daily netting and filter cleaning!)
BonnieGardens
Clermont, FL
(Zone 9a)

March 22, 2012
8:43 AM

Post #9052674

I found a warehouse in Orlando that has shadecloth for $3. a yard should anyone need some. Comes in many colors. It's on Craigs list usually all the time.
Also in Acquatic Eco Systens catalogue I found polyester mesh netting 100 " wide for $18.00/yd. Mesh size is 1/32" so I'm sure that would keep lots of gunk out of pond. They have many other forms of netting also.
Like M Mary I am determined to avoid all the mess we have had here next year. It was awful.
Well got up this morning to find no other fish dead so far. I'm hoping all things will begin to even out and I can refill other 2 ponds. Found a hole in the larger one but Acquatic sent me tape to patch it right away and its easy to peal and stick on. Great stuff. You can also get doubl. sided to join pond liners with.
Weather here is beautiful. It's time to put out fertilizer on plants .
Happy ponding to all.
Bonnie

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