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Plant Identification: SOLVED: Tiny Blue flowers, yellow center, 5 petals

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Forum: Plant IdentificationReplies: 39, Views: 829
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dave

April 13, 2002
6:03 PM

Post #26875

These flowers are TINY (about as big as the thickness of a pencil).

I sowed these in sector 2 last fall, but the marker faded and cannot be read anymore. :( Any ideas?

Dave

Thumbnail by dave
Click the image for an enlarged view.

gardenwife
Newark, OH
(Zone 5b)

April 13, 2002
6:05 PM

Post #242228

Is that brunnera? I just took pictures of some yesterday and fell in love with it. :) http://davesgarden.com/showthread/226449.html

This message was edited Saturday, Apr 13th 2:08 PM
dave

April 13, 2002
6:08 PM

Post #242231

Unquestionably in that genus, according to pics I found on Google! Very nice, GW.

Now to find out the species. It does match very closely with this: http://herba.msu.ru/pictures/Living_Pictures/Boraginaceae/Brunnera/LP_100.JPG

I'm going to compare the foliage and see what I find. This one that I have is only about 6 inches tall...

dave
gardenwife
Newark, OH
(Zone 5b)

April 13, 2002
6:09 PM

Post #242233

I didn't write down the variety from the tag, I just saw the big letters brunnera on one of my pictures.
louisa
Troy, VA
(Zone 7a)

April 13, 2002
6:55 PM

Post #242260

Brunnera macrophylla variegata - they cost an arm and a leg over here!!!! They prefer shady conditions and good soil. If you ever take cuttings Dave... :-)
gardenwife
Newark, OH
(Zone 5b)

April 13, 2002
6:57 PM

Post #242262

I know, that's what I'm wondering. A finder's fee for IDing it for him, right Louisa? ;)
louisa
Troy, VA
(Zone 7a)

April 13, 2002
6:59 PM

Post #242263

Kimberley I think you are absolutely right...hee-hee!! Back home they are expensive but I couldn't resist it. Over here I'm resisting, not only an arm and a leg but a whole body!!
Evert
Helsinki
Finland
(Zone 4b)


April 13, 2002
7:14 PM

Post #242275

I think it looks like Myosotis..
louisa
Troy, VA
(Zone 7a)

April 13, 2002
7:18 PM

Post #242277

I can understand you thinking this Evert. Myosotis is the common or garden Forget-me-not but this is the true perennial.
Evert
Helsinki
Finland
(Zone 4b)


April 13, 2002
7:21 PM

Post #242279

See:

Myosotis scorpioides
http://www.pmk.posti.fi/pmk/kuvat/merkit_isot/iso3251.jpg
http://www.planto.de/DBImage/246.jpg
http://lachlan.bluehaze.com.au/spring2000/05junea2000/05jun013.jpg
http://biology.smsu.edu/Herbarium/Plants%20of%20the%20Interior%20Highlands/Flowers/Myosotis%20scorpioides.jpg
http://caliban.mpiz-koeln.mpg.de/~stueber/lindman/81.jpg
http://linnaeus.nrm.se/flora/di/boragina/myoso/myossco1.jpg

Myosotis sylvatica:
http://linnaeus.nrm.se/flora/di/boragina/myoso/myossyl1.jpg
http://linnaeus.nrm.se/flora/di/boragina/myoso/myossyl3.jpg

There is lots of other Myosotis (Forget-Me-Not) species though..
louisa
Troy, VA
(Zone 7a)

April 13, 2002
7:51 PM

Post #242307

You have a point Evert!! Dave, I opened Gardenwife's link and that was definitely Brunnera so I have to ask you then - is your plant variegated?? If not, then it could be that Evert is correct!!
dave

April 13, 2002
8:14 PM

Post #242324

It is -not- veriegated.
louisa
Troy, VA
(Zone 7a)

April 13, 2002
8:23 PM

Post #242328

Then it is the annual Myosotis - self-seeds profusely and is lovely. When the leaves go grey and mouldy looking - pull them up, shake and scatter the seeds!!
Evert
Helsinki
Finland
(Zone 4b)


April 13, 2002
9:31 PM

Post #242366

Louisa, isn't Myosotis biennial? Hmm.. anyway there is lots of species and differences between them I think. Some annual som biennial.
poppysue
Westbrook, ME
(Zone 5a)


April 13, 2002
9:52 PM

Post #242376

It acts as a biennial for me. Plants re-seed and the small seedlings winter over. Once in a while a few big plants will winter over too. Is this it Dave?
http://plantsdatabase.com/go/233.html
Weezingreens
Seward, AK
(Zone 3b)


April 13, 2002
11:45 PM

Post #242439

Are you sure we are not talking about cynoglossum? They are an annual that is often referred to as a Forget-Me-Not. They are a very intense blue. If so, I think they are self-seeders.
Weezingreens
Seward, AK
(Zone 3b)


April 13, 2002
11:48 PM

Post #242440

Here's a link to Googles Imaging: http://images.google.com/images?q=cynoglossum&hl=en&btnG=Google+Search
louisa
Troy, VA
(Zone 7a)

April 14, 2002
1:04 AM

Post #242508

I think that's the Chinese forget-me-not Weezing!!
Weezingreens
Seward, AK
(Zone 3b)


April 14, 2002
2:19 AM

Post #242575

Forget-Me-Not/Chinese/Cynoglossum amabile...yes,Louisa. I grow a few cynoglossum every year. They bloom late here about the time the calendula are blooming. That's an impressive combo! I don't have a great germination rate on them. They like to be in darkness I think. They probably do best started outdoors. No time for that here!

I'm always confused about forget-me-nots. There are the mysotis, which are biennial, but there are also some wild forget-me-not here...our state flower! There is also a clumping form of some sort. I sure like them!
Brugie
Chariton, IA
(Zone 5b)

April 14, 2002
2:49 AM

Post #242614

I just bought a Brunnera macrophylla variegata and I didn't think the cost was too bad. It was in a six inch pot and was less than eight dollars. So pretty. Have to say that it was worth the cost, but I'm mailing mine to NY on Monday. Someone very special is getting this one.

dave

April 14, 2002
12:58 PM

Post #242831

This one is definitely a Forget-me-not. It matches the pictures perfectly.

Additionally, go_vols was here yesterday, and she walked up to the plant and, without hesitation, said, "Oh, look at those forget-me-nots".

I was too embarrassed to tell her that I had posted it to the ID forum and we were discussing that very plant! ha!

Well, forget-me-not it is. Are these invasive? The Plants Database is not marking it as invasive.

dave
philomel
Castelnau RB Pyrenée
France
(Zone 8a)


April 14, 2002
5:59 PM

Post #242958

Not the ones i have. They are really charming bienniels that seed themselves around, but always seem to know where they will look best! If any grow where you don't want them, they are easy to pull out.
:)
Weezingreens
Seward, AK
(Zone 3b)


April 15, 2002
12:08 AM

Post #243159

Dave, these are not the biennial myosotis, I think, but rather the annual Chinese forget-me-not, or cynoglossum. Actually, my myosotis drops seed everywhere, but I don't mind. I just move them where I want them. I think the cynoglossum is marginal for this area, so it doesn't seem to self-seed...don't know how it will behave there. The cynoglossum seem more evasive than invasive here!
gardenwife
Newark, OH
(Zone 5b)

April 16, 2002
5:05 PM

Post #244123

Just to thicken the plot...There is a non-variegated brunnera, though. :) Boy, those sure look like the brunnera, too. That's wild!
Weezingreens
Seward, AK
(Zone 3b)


April 16, 2002
11:45 PM

Post #244301

The thot plickens!
philomel
Castelnau RB Pyrenée
France
(Zone 8a)


April 17, 2002
6:55 AM

Post #244599

It does indeed WZ lol!
Dave, we really need to know the leaf size, colour and texture as this would distinguish better than the flower??
...and have you taken its fingerprints?
;)
Weezingreens
Seward, AK
(Zone 3b)


April 17, 2002
5:00 PM

Post #244847

You know, I think Dave posts these bloom closeups without any defined foliage just to see us all speculate!
philomel
Castelnau RB Pyrenée
France
(Zone 8a)


April 17, 2002
5:45 PM

Post #244883

Yup, think your right Weez!
Dave??...
dave

April 17, 2002
5:48 PM

Post #244889

I just need to get the camera out. I'll do it in a little while :)
Weezingreens
Seward, AK
(Zone 3b)


April 17, 2002
5:52 PM

Post #244893

Ah, Philomel.. we've "guilted him out"!
philomel
Castelnau RB Pyrenée
France
(Zone 8a)


April 17, 2002
5:57 PM

Post #244894

A description would be quite acceptable to be going on with Dave ;)
Weezingreens
Seward, AK
(Zone 3b)


April 17, 2002
6:03 PM

Post #244902

Philomel.. I don't think eloquent description is an option when a man can just go out, take a picture and be done with it! He's probably beginning to wonder why he ever posted in the first place!
philomel
Castelnau RB Pyrenée
France
(Zone 8a)


April 17, 2002
6:10 PM

Post #244907

Yes, was forgetting...
whoops, hush my mouth, was nearly rude to the opposite... and that would never do, particularly to a KING! lolol ;)

Terry

Terry
Murfreesboro, TN
(Zone 7a)


October 17, 2002
2:52 AM

Post #386837

Oh, mercy. I hadn't realized I had been quoted in this thread, (and perhaps a gaff at that!)

Okay, I'm resurrecting this thread to try to put this question to rest once and for all. Judges, what's the verdict? Is this Cynoglossum or Myosotis?
Weezingreens
Seward, AK
(Zone 3b)


October 17, 2002
5:52 AM

Post #386940

I swear, Go_vols, I didn't restir this pot on purpose! However, I still sat cynoglossum... Chinese Forget Me Not. No white in the center. Hey, wasn't Dave supposed to go out and take another picture?
CoCo

October 18, 2002
1:59 AM

Post #387519

He must be looking for the camera.

No matter what it is,it sure is a pretty little thing.
dave

October 18, 2002
1:19 PM

Post #387721

I'm sorry that I never did get a foliage shot of these guys. :( And they are long gone, never to return alas, as we grew them in barrels and the soil from the barrels has been chucked back into the garden. I doubt we'll see any more seedlings come up. :(
Weezingreens
Seward, AK
(Zone 3b)


October 18, 2002
7:01 PM

Post #387917

I don't know, Dave. Either forget me not variety is a pretty aggressive seeder... you may still see more! Maybe I should send you some seeds of each kind and we can start the experiment all over again!

Terry

Terry
Murfreesboro, TN
(Zone 7a)


October 18, 2002
7:30 PM

Post #387933

Okay, here are a couple representative photos with foliage for Dave to review and recall:

Myosotis: http://images.google.com/imgres?imgurl=www.uaf.edu/grnhouse/images/myosotis.jpg&imgrefurl=http://www.uaf.edu/grnhouse/arcticplants/myosotis.html&h=480&w=640&prev=/images%3Fq%3DMyosotis%26svnum%3D10%26hl%3Den%26lr%3D%26ie%3DUTF-8%26sa%3DN

Cynoglossum: http://images.google.com/imgres?imgurl=www.mindbird.com/920808c0.jpg&imgrefurl=http://www.mindbird.com/cynoglossum_grande8b.htm&h=396&w=640&prev=/images%3Fq%3DCynoglossum%26svnum%3D10%26hl%3Den%26lr%3D%26ie%3DUTF-8%26sa%3DN

Only Dave (and Trish) can tell us for sure. But I'm still leaning toward Myosotis for the following reasons:

1) the Cynoglossum seem to have a protruding, button-shaped center, which is distinctive;

2) The foliage between these two is very different (and if I said the plant was a FMN, I was most definitely referring to Myosotis, because that's what I was growing at about the same time; I'm not sure I would have been so quick to pipe up with an opinion if the plant had this other foliage); and

3) Dave said he sowed these last fall and they were blooming in April. Cynoglossums are more of an annual (yes?) and I don't know if they would have fared well with being sown in the fall, nor would they have been blooming that early.

Of course, only Dave and/or Trish can tell us for sure, assuming they recall the details :)
Weezingreens
Seward, AK
(Zone 3b)


October 18, 2002
8:44 PM

Post #387976

Ok, Go_vols. I think that the lack of white around the center is bothering me, but if I disregard that and compare it to this pic, I can concede that could be myosotis sylvatica: http://www.earthlygoods.com/wildflowers/forget_me_not.html
Here's a pic that shows more of the plant itself, in case Dave can recall his plant: http://www.grzyby.pl/rosliny/gatunki/Myosotis_sylvatica.htm
And of course, here is our own PDB page: http://plantsdatabase.com/go/233/

Here is a picture of Cynoglossum amabile: http://www.humeseeds.com/cynglsm.htm
As you can see, the centers are blue. C. amabile is also in our own PDB: http://plantsdatabase.com/go/258.html This is a good closeup: http://plantsdatabase.com/showpicture/4307/

I'm always shaking my head about these forget-me-nots. I have at least two varieties in my yard... the M. sylvatica and a wild variety, M. palustris. Though M. alpestris is our State Flower, I have to tell you, I'm not familiar with it. The common name for Cynoglossum is "Chinese Forget-me-not" so it gets confusing. I can see why our English compadres get so impatient with our "pet names".

Your point about the seeds being sown in the fall could be a clue, but in the proper climate, C. amabile is an avid self-seeder, so sowing seeds in the fall would be fine. I assume Dave's winters aren't too severe.

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