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Propagation: PVC growlight stand plans?

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Joan
Belfield, ND
(Zone 4a)



October 30, 2003
10:52 PM

Post #696399

I couple years ago I built the pvc growlight stand from some instructions I had gotten here. I can't seem to find the post though, and now I have a friend that wants to build one. Does anyone have the plans?
aknapp
Cassopolis, MI
(Zone 5a)

October 30, 2003
11:00 PM

Post #696416

I had a link to this one that is on t's flower seed site. I hope its the one you want.

http://www.carlnet.org/~ttsdaly/plantstand.html
Joan
Belfield, ND
(Zone 4a)



October 31, 2003
5:28 AM

Post #696672

Thanks! That's not exactly the one I used, but I think it will work for her. Actually, I think I like this one better than mine. LOL.

darius

darius
So.App.Mtns.
United States
(Zone 5b)

October 31, 2003
12:51 PM

Post #696810

Here are a couple of links to PVC stands here on DG:
http://davesgarden.com/t/169142/
http://davesgarden.com/t/373022/PVC light stand
Joan
Belfield, ND
(Zone 4a)



October 31, 2003
4:52 PM

Post #696971

Thanks Darius, I'll go check them out too.
scooterbug
Tellico Plains, TN
(Zone 7b)

November 13, 2003
9:17 PM

Post #708670

Finished mine, with a few changes plus castors so I can move it =)
§

Edited to add:
... Total cost for PVC and T-connectors @ home Depot only $34.64



This message was edited Nov 15, 2003 10:59 AM

Thumbnail by scooterbug
Click the image for an enlarged view.

darius

darius
So.App.Mtns.
United States
(Zone 5b)

November 13, 2003
9:19 PM

Post #708671

Looks good!

paulgrow

paulgrow
Allen Park, MI
(Zone 6a)

November 13, 2003
11:26 PM

Post #708781

Those are the plans that were posted here the past couple of years.
This will be the 3rd year for mine, they work great,

The only change I made was to make the top shelf 6" higher than the plans show. This allows for taller plants.

Paul
scooterbug
Tellico Plains, TN
(Zone 7b)

November 13, 2003
11:37 PM

Post #708795

I cut the uprights at 20 inches so the shelves would be taller and I had some pipe left so I cut four 15 inch uprights for an extra top level and on each side on top I used four elbows and 1 cross piece so each top side is like a upside down U.looks more finished and I have another level to hang 'stuff' from ...LOL
...This was fun to make and I took that stupid cutter back $$ because my hacksaw cuts through the stuff like butter.
...So I ended up with a 7'6" tall overall and top shelf is 6'3"
Hmmm, now what can I do ???
I know...BYe =)
§

This message was edited Nov 13, 2003 9:10 PM
scooterbug
Tellico Plains, TN
(Zone 7b)

November 13, 2003
11:41 PM

Post #708800

Any good ideas for something for support on the shelves ?
I'm concerned the flats will buckle.
Any thing but wood shelving ?

paulgrow

paulgrow
Allen Park, MI
(Zone 6a)

November 14, 2003
9:14 AM

Post #709069

I've never had a problem with the flats buckling.

Paul
poppysue
Westbrook, ME
(Zone 5a)


November 14, 2003
10:21 AM

Post #709075

I used wire hardware cloth on my shelves. I needed something for support...

paulgrow

paulgrow
Allen Park, MI
(Zone 6a)

November 15, 2003
12:23 PM

Post #709862

Good idea Poppy.
Anna07
little hadham
United Kingdom

November 15, 2003
5:10 PM

Post #710064

Hi peeps!

what type of light do you use? normal fluorescent or grow lights? how many per shelf?
Thank you for your time!

paulgrow

paulgrow
Allen Park, MI
(Zone 6a)

November 15, 2003
7:37 PM

Post #710178

I use 2 shoplit fixtures per shelf. In each I have one cool and one warm white bulb. I've used this method for over 5 years with excellent results.
No need for the more expensive grow lite bulbs.

Paul
scooterbug
Tellico Plains, TN
(Zone 7b)

November 15, 2003
7:41 PM

Post #710180

Hi Anna
... and welcome to the best bunch of plant addicts around =)
...You need 2 four foot shop lights with chains so you can adjust the height as the plants grow.
Don't waste money on 'Grow Lights' Just use 1 cool florescent tube and 1 warm tube in each fixture. Change after 2 years because they loose strength.
...Keep lights close to plants and raise the light as they grow.
Good Luck,
...Shirley
§
scooterbug
Tellico Plains, TN
(Zone 7b)

November 15, 2003
7:42 PM

Post #710181

Ooopsie! , sorry paul I posted on top of you =)

paulgrow

paulgrow
Allen Park, MI
(Zone 6a)

November 15, 2003
7:48 PM

Post #710183

No problem, I'm glad you added details about the chains and adjusting the lights.

Paul
Anna07
little hadham
United Kingdom

November 15, 2003
8:33 PM

Post #710208

thank you very much peeps. Yes, I am addicted as well. I love this place!
Anna07
little hadham
United Kingdom

November 16, 2003
7:19 PM

Post #710914

Update!
I went in search of PVC pipes to build my frame.Here in England they are sooo expensive it would cost around£100 ( around$150) only for the PVC. So i visited some hardware shops where i found a wire mesh shelving unit on a sale. As it is wire mesh i can hang my lamps through it with chains and the ventilation is good. It has 5 shelves and fits my bedroom window like a glove.
When everything is ready I will be posting some photos.
eweed
Everson, WA
(Zone 8a)

November 16, 2003
7:51 PM

Post #710923

Anna07 I built mine from angle iron because I have a hang up about building things to last it was cheap to build but will last a hundred or so years. Took most of a saturday to build and paint.

A friend who is an electrican gave me three four tube four foot lights for it and I added grow mats with thermo stats to two of the shelves. I can start eight flats at once with the third shelf being used as a stopping point for seedlings before I put them on the table. I am thinking of adding another mat to increase my starting flats to twelve

Don't know anything about pounds except for how those got on my tummy but mine ended up costing about $225.00 and is a neat addition in my G.H.Regards Ernie
Anna07
little hadham
United Kingdom

November 16, 2003
8:00 PM

Post #710931

Well Ernie, your stand sounds lovely. I am thinking about growing mats. Do you think they would be OK in the bedroom or are they messy? Where did you get yours from ? is it possible to build one?

thank you, best wishes
Anna

paulgrow

paulgrow
Allen Park, MI
(Zone 6a)

November 16, 2003
8:12 PM

Post #710935

Here's a link to Park Seed.
They have grow mats for half off, quit a few of us bought them.

Paul

http://www.parkseed.com
Anna07
little hadham
United Kingdom

November 16, 2003
8:17 PM

Post #710938

thank you very much Paul but I am in England.

darius

darius
So.App.Mtns.
United States
(Zone 5b)

November 16, 2003
10:34 PM

Post #711050

Anna, my new grow mat has a terrible odor. I'm hoping it will eventually burn off, but I had to put it in a separate room in the house, LOL. (I only used it about 10 days this fall, and won't use it again until late winter to start seeds.)
eweed
Everson, WA
(Zone 8a)

November 17, 2003
1:02 AM

Post #711161

Anna07 I got mine from Charleys Greenhouse supply and it is not smelly. You could make one with some things on the market but in the long run it's probably best to just buy one and get a thermostat to run it. Most cheap mats work but you can't control the heat. It is usually regulated at about 20 degrees higher than ambient temprature. If it is 70 in your house it will be 90 in your seed flat.

There are other ways to germinate seeds and several of those are given in one of these threads maybe some one better at cruiseing the threads will come on and direct you there.Ernie
Anna07
little hadham
United Kingdom

November 17, 2003
7:41 AM

Post #711310

thank you peeps,

I have been germinating my seeds following the Deno's method I read on one of the threads. It is working well for me. I am going to see if I can find out more about growing mats.

Have you heard about the Deno's way? it is very interesting.

paulgrow

paulgrow
Allen Park, MI
(Zone 6a)

November 17, 2003
8:44 PM

Post #711688

What is Deno's method?

darius

darius
So.App.Mtns.
United States
(Zone 5b)

November 17, 2003
8:45 PM

Post #711689

Paul, there is a thread here somewhere on DG on Deno's Method. Try a Search? (Not certain it was spelled correctly, so try alternative spellings like Dino)
Anna07
little hadham
United Kingdom

November 17, 2003
9:33 PM

Post #711729

Onpage 3 of the propagation forum there is a thread called Deno propagation. The method is explained there. It consists of germinating seeds in wet tissue paper and then planting them after germination.
eweed
Everson, WA
(Zone 8a)

November 18, 2003
12:16 AM

Post #711865

Paulgrow it works well for cucumbers, Sweetpeas,Sunflowers, and green beans. Thats all I have tried that way .Ernie

Who else can add to The list?
eweed
Everson, WA
(Zone 8a)

November 18, 2003
1:20 AM

Post #711930

Anna07 I don't know how to do the hyper link but if you go to the dirt cheap forum and click on grow mats there are some other heat sources for you to consider. Ernie
Anna07
little hadham
United Kingdom

November 18, 2003
8:23 AM

Post #712097

I can, hardy geraniums and pelargoniums.

thank you Ernie. i will have a look
Anna07
little hadham
United Kingdom

November 18, 2003
2:48 PM

Post #712267

Peeps!

do you use your plant stand and lights all year round? Do you use your basement to grow plants all year round as well?
I am curious to know about the american way of growing plants indoors. Here in england it is not common to find people using lights and indoor rooms to grow.
Joan
Belfield, ND
(Zone 4a)



November 18, 2003
5:14 PM

Post #712397

I use mine almost year around. I have the growlight stand in the basement and throughout the winter I keep some plants down there to keep them growing rather than going dormant. In the spring I start seeds down there also, and then in the late spring everything goes outside.

I would guess that I don't use the growlights June, July and August. By September it's getting cool enough here that some things start to come inside again.
scooterbug
Tellico Plains, TN
(Zone 7b)

December 27, 2003
3:28 AM

Post #738294

I now have 2 of paulgrows heat boxes on the bottom shelf
http://www.davesgarden.com/fp.php?pid=22259
Melissa_Ohio
Southwestern, OH
(Zone 6b)

January 5, 2004
3:01 AM

Post #744628

Scooter, did you just put the lights on the top shelf, or on every shelf?

paulgrow

paulgrow
Allen Park, MI
(Zone 6a)

January 5, 2004
11:52 AM

Post #744768

You need lights on each shelf. I use 2 fixtures per shelf/

Paul
Melissa_Ohio
Southwestern, OH
(Zone 6b)

January 9, 2004
3:05 PM

Post #748565

Got 4 ft Shop lights at home depot for 7.25 each. Not a bad price, I didn't think.

Melissa
JimKennard
Salt Lake City, UT
(Zone 6a)

January 10, 2004
2:25 AM

Post #749150

The shop lights Home Depot has use 32 watt #8 tubes, rather than the standard 40 watt #12 tubes. Can anyone tell me if the 32 watt variety are sufficient?

Jim

paulgrow

paulgrow
Allen Park, MI
(Zone 6a)

January 10, 2004
11:10 AM

Post #749293

I like to use the full 40 Watt output.
You have to be careful with the sale bulbs and read the labels carefully. The are some 25 watt cheapies out there also.

Paul
golddog
Western, PA
(Zone 6a)

January 10, 2004
11:44 AM

Post #749307

$7.25 has to be the best price yet. I am going out to buy a couple of the lights. Yes, even in this cold (10 F) weather. I want to replace some old, 'heavy' ones.
scooterbug
Tellico Plains, TN
(Zone 7b)

January 10, 2004
1:01 PM

Post #749350

Just a heads up here...
... I also bought 6 of the HD fixtures for around 7$ each. I returned them all and upgraded to $12 fixtures as I felt the ones I had did not do the job.
...On the cheaper lights the wing-like reflector shades are missing...As you stand to the side you should not be able to see the actual bulb... If you can see it the light is not directed down wards so you are loosing, I would guess , half of the benefit of burning your electricity.
... It is even uncomfortable to look toward the light stand because of the brightness emitted into the room...Instead of being directed down wards to your seedlings...

...Problem solved (-;

Shirley >^..^< SB

Edited...More power to you if you can make your own reflectors...Pun intended heheheh ;~P


This message was edited Jan 10, 2004 12:19 PM
eweed
Everson, WA
(Zone 8a)

January 10, 2004
2:02 PM

Post #749412

Scooter is right about the reflectors I think the loss is greater than 50 percent though but you could make reflectors to help out.

I made mine out of used lights from the ceiling they have prisim reflectors that direct the light st down these can be seen in most office buildings and have those little squares showing. Are you near a building recycle store? good source. Ernie
Melissa_Ohio
Southwestern, OH
(Zone 6b)

January 10, 2004
4:30 PM

Post #749521

These do have "wings" on them, and I think Ernie is right, if these wings aren't big enough I'll make reflectors rather than spend 12.00 more on the one that has the bigger wings. I could buy 6 of the 7 dollar lights and fashion my own reflectors, or just 2 of the 20 dollar lights.

paulgrow

paulgrow
Allen Park, MI
(Zone 6a)

January 10, 2004
6:29 PM

Post #749606

What I do it to take a piece of aluminum foil and place it between the bulbs and the fixture. A great reflector.

Paul
eweed
Everson, WA
(Zone 8a)

January 10, 2004
6:47 PM

Post #749619

Melissa if you make new or extend your refelectors try to avoid recovering the area directly over the ballast to avoid overheating.

The smoother the surface the more light is reflected. The back of my seed starting stand is white to help out you just can't get to much light.

White or silver color is best and if you use cardboard to extend the wings as I probably would you can cover the extension with aluminum foil. Ernie


JimKennard
Salt Lake City, UT
(Zone 6a)

January 10, 2004
7:35 PM

Post #749649

Lowes has shop lights with reflectors (albiet narrow ones) that use the 40 watt T12 lights. The cost was less than $7

I'm glad I didn't get the Home Depot ones that only use the 32 watt T8's.

Jim K
Melissa_Ohio
Southwestern, OH
(Zone 6b)

January 10, 2004
10:42 PM

Post #749980

Our Lowes didn't have any, I figured the 32's were better than waiting. :-) I only bought enough for 2 shelfs, so If I fill those up, I can hopefully go back to Lowes and get the 40 W lights.

Ernie, we're thinking alike, I bought a big roll of heavy duty foil this afternoon while grocery shopping!
I was thinking white poster board, or foil, maybe both!
Melissa_Ohio
Southwestern, OH
(Zone 6b)

January 10, 2004
10:43 PM

Post #749982

Double Posted the above somehow.


This message was edited Jan 11, 2004 1:16 AM
JimKennard
Salt Lake City, UT
(Zone 6a)

January 11, 2004
5:24 AM

Post #750295

Don't go by the picture on the box!! The $7 lights have a TINY reflector - that isn't even a reflector.

I ended up paying $10 for something better, but even that had to have help. It is stainless steel! So I painted the inside white - hope it works.

Jim
Melissa_Ohio
Southwestern, OH
(Zone 6b)

January 11, 2004
5:27 AM

Post #750297

My Home Depot didn't have another option either, it was either the 7 dollar one or the 20 dollar one. I just couldn't justify 4 of the 20 dollar ones.

My Daughters went to the UC Game this evening, and my Oldest son had a Wrestling Match to attend, Hubby is sick, so my 6 year old and I made this our "project" for this evening. He had great fun helping me Measure, mark and cut the PVC. At one point I was in here on the phone, and he came in and said, "Mom, here is a 20 incher" He had measured and marked it all by himself.

I like those PVC racheting "Scissors" I know a hack saw or a jig saw would have worked, but I doubt if I could have cut it straight, so it was better for me to buy the Scissors.

But, anyway... it just didn't seem "sturdy" to me, so I tore it down, and now I need some more T fittings, but I ended up putting 4 15 inch crossbeams on each shelf instead of the 2 the plans called for, and 4 of my T's were threaded inside, so I was short on the top shelf anyway.

I also want to use Scooter's idea of putting casters on the bottom of it. But, hopefully tomorrow, I can at least get some seeds under there.

Thumbnail by Melissa_Ohio
Click the image for an enlarged view.

eweed
Everson, WA
(Zone 8a)

January 11, 2004
6:56 AM

Post #750320

Melissa ^5 bravo sometimes you just need to as granpa used to say go ahead on er and never hollar whoa in a tight spot.

I think the added bars is just what I would have done had I not used steel to build mine with.

Don't know how shoe put his casters on but there are fittings sold that make that an easy task. I think they are called clamp fittings or snap fittings. They are made by the same people who make the clamp clips for holding plastic on to pvc for little row protectors. Well done Ernie

paulgrow

paulgrow
Allen Park, MI
(Zone 6a)

January 11, 2004
11:05 AM

Post #750334

Good Job Melissa

Paul
scooterbug
Tellico Plains, TN
(Zone 7b)

January 11, 2004
6:46 PM

Post #750604

Yee Haa...You go Girl!
(-;
§
Melissa_Ohio
Southwestern, OH
(Zone 6b)

January 12, 2004
3:09 AM

Post #750976

And, I have lights!
At least on one shelf... I'm going to have to do some tweaking yet after I get some more T's, and find something, (thinking foil baking pans) to put my seed cups in. But overall, I'm really happy with it, and will be even happier if I start seeing signs of life under them there lights!

Thumbnail by Melissa_Ohio
Click the image for an enlarged view.

MaryinLa
Marshfield, MO
(Zone 6a)

January 23, 2004
3:56 AM

Post #760750

Somebody asked about support on the shelving. I think the best bet, but certainly not inexpensive, would be try to find some fiberglass trays, you can check restaurant and food supply places, I think they are called "market trays", they have a lip on them so they would hold a small amount of water in case water dripped out of your flats.

Even adding those, this still would end up cheaper than commercially available light carts. Do you know how much I spent on a 3 light floracart years ago to grow african violets? It was a bunch!
scooterbug
Tellico Plains, TN
(Zone 7b)

January 23, 2004
2:06 PM

Post #760939

Seedling trays are cheap =)
http://www.novoselenterprises.com

Thumbnail by scooterbug
Click the image for an enlarged view.

Melissa_Ohio
Southwestern, OH
(Zone 6b)

January 23, 2004
4:30 PM

Post #761109

I picked up seedling trays at Lowes for 97 cents each ;-)
scooterbug
Tellico Plains, TN
(Zone 7b)

January 23, 2004
4:46 PM

Post #761128

The closest Lowe's to me is 90 miles away.
Sound like it is a great place for the garden addiction...LOL
poppysue
Westbrook, ME
(Zone 5a)


January 23, 2004
7:59 PM

Post #761257

I've found that the plastic seedling trays aren't rigid enough to use without some sort of shelving for support. They buckle if there's too much weight in them. I wrapped hardware cloth around my shelves and it works pretty good.
poppysue
Westbrook, ME
(Zone 5a)


January 23, 2004
8:14 PM

Post #761270

Last year I also made a table top version from extra PVC. Looks like this except there's a support bar across the top where the light hangs http://www.indoorgardensupplies.com/Images/f220-l_web_full.jpg

I haven't set it up this year yet. I was thinking mabe I'd paint it with that plastic paint so it's not so ugly and put it on top of our TV stand in the livingroom.

This message was edited Jan 23, 2004 5:15 PM
Kaufmann
GOD's Green Earth
United States
(Zone 8b)

January 23, 2004
8:34 PM

Post #761279

If your TV is on as much as mine (my husband never turns it off and I rarely watch it) Poppysue, it will be perfect!
scooterbug
Tellico Plains, TN
(Zone 7b)

January 23, 2004
8:41 PM

Post #761283

Sue,
...Cute light stand =)

I lined my shelves with wire mesh also, starting to get a lot of weight on the unit...glad I did it.
Melissa_Ohio
Southwestern, OH
(Zone 6b)

January 23, 2004
10:27 PM

Post #761351

I'd like to see it after you set it up Poppysue

I used Insulation board as support on mine. The thick stuff that is silver. It works pretty well, and it's really warm in there. :-)
IowaAnn
Elkhart, IA
(Zone 5a)

January 23, 2004
11:57 PM

Post #761430

Does anyone know if a waterbed heater could be used as a heat mat? This was given to me and it looks just like a heat mat for plants...with a thermostat and everything...any reason why this would'nt work?
poppysue
Westbrook, ME
(Zone 5a)


January 24, 2004
12:03 AM

Post #761435

anahi, They're a fire hazard without water to cool them. I wouldn't try it.

crestedchik

crestedchik
Cicero, NY
(Zone 5a)

January 24, 2004
2:24 AM

Post #761566

OK,I broke down and made one...I think I went a little nuts...I said to myself if everyone felt 14 inches is too short than I'll go 24 inches so I can have brug cuttings and other stuff on there...not just seedlings...

ITS HUGE!!!

Almost to the ceiling...

I just had to get extream...
scooterbug
Tellico Plains, TN
(Zone 7b)

January 24, 2004
3:25 AM

Post #761595

Good for you CC,
...How stable is the stand being that tall?
I made my uprights 20" ,I need to stand on a step-stool to water the trays on the top shelf...lol
Melissa_Ohio
Southwestern, OH
(Zone 6b)

January 24, 2004
3:29 AM

Post #761598

YAY for you CrestedChik!!

crestedchik

crestedchik
Cicero, NY
(Zone 5a)

January 24, 2004
12:23 PM

Post #761723

I was worried about the stability ,yet I want to be able to take it apart,so today I'm gunna cement the sections together and where the conectors meet the sides I will not cement.I will drill screws into them on the top and the bottom.Also ,its so tall I am woried it will be top heavey so I may somehow attach it to the wall.Its going in my sons bedroom since he's staying in Hawaii...

paulgrow

paulgrow
Allen Park, MI
(Zone 6a)

January 24, 2004
2:46 PM

Post #761815

CC
I used 1" dry wall screws on all of the joints on my stand.

If you need to modify it all you have to do is unscrew it.
If you glue them they are permanet.

Paul
jagonjune
Edmonton, AB
(Zone 3a)

January 24, 2004
4:27 PM

Post #761901

I am sure you all have COSTCO all over your country too. I had made wood units, bought pvc units, used used wire shelving but the heavy duty 5 shelf wire rack that costco sells for $80 canadian is the best yet. It is exactly four feet so my bulbs don't hang out or not cover everything; the castors are great easily moved, the shelves are very adjustable and comes apart easily for storage for the next growing season. Can do 20 flats on one unit which with plugs gives me between 600 and 1400 seedlings on one unit. Now the problem is finding 4 times that space for the transplanted babies.
eweed
Everson, WA
(Zone 8a)

January 24, 2004
4:45 PM

Post #761911

Jagonjune sounds like the six shelf pair I got from costco for $69. They are pretty neat because they can be put up as one six foot high or two three foot ones. They came with eight casters and all the cute little end plugs to seal the open uprights and to make them less apt to cut you from the raw edge.

As to the space it takes to move the started plants I am lucky green house is 16 x 32 no problem for me.

For 69 bucks I think its a better deal than making one out of pvc. Each shelf is rated to hold 600 lbs. Ernie
scooterbug
Tellico Plains, TN
(Zone 7b)

January 24, 2004
5:55 PM

Post #761953

Scheesh !! No costco, lowes or logees here =(
IowaAnn
Elkhart, IA
(Zone 5a)

January 24, 2004
7:01 PM

Post #762005

thanks poppysue for the forwarning. I never thought of it as a fire hazard. Good thought.
eweed
Everson, WA
(Zone 8a)

January 24, 2004
9:18 PM

Post #762109

Scooter the things are relly pretty heavy so shipping would not work for you.

Some one posted they saw them at walmart but don't know if they are the same.

You could be just like me I just drove 170 miles round trip four hours total to get some plastic and the place wouldn't take charge or debit cards. the plastic was $85 and I had $87 but not enough for the tax. I don't carry a check book so the trip was all for naught. So I guess the moral is be prepared lol. Ernie

kooger

kooger
Oostburg, WI
(Zone 5b)

January 24, 2004
11:20 PM

Post #762205

Don't know if this is the same as Costco, etc., but Sam's Club sells Gorilla Racks and they are GREAT! The very heavy duty ones are around $80. They are 6' long. Menard's sells them too but are much higher. The heavy duty are 4' wide and 6 shelves high but you can break them down and make like a workbench 8 feet long and 3 shelves each. We have 3 in my sewing room, and 3 in the storeroom. They are GREAT! I think I will have to rig one up for lights. Think DH will notice? :) (What a bummer, Ernie!)
eweed
Everson, WA
(Zone 8a)

January 24, 2004
11:31 PM

Post #762211

Krooger gorilla racks are different still good and would make good light stand. Thats what I went to town to get then discovered the wire racks.Ernie

kooger

kooger
Oostburg, WI
(Zone 5b)

January 24, 2004
11:39 PM

Post #762218

eweed - would the ones you got have an edge on them with a zigzag pattern on the edge? They have some of them at Sam's too and maybe at Wallyworld too, I don't know. I've seen that kind as Baker's racks too around here.
scooterbug
Tellico Plains, TN
(Zone 7b)

January 24, 2004
11:51 PM

Post #762232

kooger, my Menard's has the same unit you are talking about -and- you can buy them one piece at a time and make your own configuration. A 2ft. x 4 ft. shelf is $12.00
But I think I have plenty 'for now'.
* mad laugh *
shirley

kooger

kooger
Oostburg, WI
(Zone 5b)

January 24, 2004
11:59 PM

Post #762240

Menard's just had 4' florescent lights on special for $5. but I didn't get up there that week. Boo Hoo!
scooterbug
Tellico Plains, TN
(Zone 7b)

January 25, 2004
12:08 AM

Post #762250

Aw Shoot !!!!!!

kooger

kooger
Oostburg, WI
(Zone 5b)

January 25, 2004
12:25 AM

Post #762264

I ducked!!
eweed
Everson, WA
(Zone 8a)

January 25, 2004
1:33 AM

Post #762341

Hey i have been hit so many times whats another hole in the head saves on air conditioning.

Kooger yes thats the one. Ernie
eweed
Everson, WA
(Zone 8a)

January 25, 2004
1:35 AM

Post #762345

Hey i have been hit so many times whats another hole in the head saves on air conditioning.

Kooger yes thats the one.

Shirley enough is never enough.

Ernie

kooger

kooger
Oostburg, WI
(Zone 5b)

January 25, 2004
1:57 AM

Post #762368

Ok, I will check them out better. I like the wheels idea. The local stop-and-rob here uses them for their condiment stand. FYI: C-stores are known as stop-and-robs in the family, courtesy of my uncle, the cop! Small wayside diners are choke-and-pukes! There's your Sat. eve. chuckle!! hee hee
JimKennard
Salt Lake City, UT
(Zone 6a)

January 25, 2004
2:47 AM

Post #762400

Sam's Club has a great 6'-tall 4'-long metal shelf system with 6 shelves - for only $70!!

It is much better than the PVC one I just built, and will hold 20-24 seedling trays.

Jim Kennard
jagonjune
Edmonton, AB
(Zone 3a)

January 25, 2004
4:17 AM

Post #762451

Ernie it not just your beautifully sized green house that saves you - its that zone number next to your abode. Half of the things I start you could leave in the ground over the winter. Oh well, zone envy will not get it any warmer any earlier.
scooterbug
Tellico Plains, TN
(Zone 7b)

January 25, 2004
5:09 AM

Post #762470

Whelp...my 2 PVC stands cost $69.28 for both and they will hold 20 trays plus 6 hanging plants on each. Altho I must admit yours are more aesthetically pleasing =)
...It is doubtful if I will put trays on the tippy-top shelf, this area will be for my taller plants.
The other shelves all have room for 20" tall plants.
...I really can hardly wait to get them out into the front porch, if it ever warms up...dang it's been a cold week !
§
Zen_Man
Ottawa, KS
(Zone 5b)

January 25, 2004
6:57 AM

Post #762487

Jim Kennard,

I got one of those chrome wire stands from Sam's Club. I got their display unit because apparently they didn't have any more. The shelves are 4' x 18" deep and the thing stands 76" tall because it has 3" casters which make it easy to roll around, but 4 inches taller. It's in the kitchen/dining area and my wife has appropriated one of the shelves for our microwave. I guess we will put a toaster oven there too.

Since this shelf unit is in a relatively warm living area (68F night to 72F day) it really is too warm for sustained seedling growth. But it is a good place to start seedlings and I have a freshly planted tray of onion seeds there now. Hopefully they will germinate soon. I have only one fluorescent fixture mounted over them at the moment, but I intend to mount three 6-inch wide fixtures per 18-inch shelf, with no open space between the fixtures. I have to cut notches in the outside metal relectors to allow them to fit between the metal support colums.

The open wire shelves are handy for hanging fluorescent fixtures on. You can attach the chains anywhere. Incidentally, I am using those Home Depot 32-watt 4-foot T8 shoplights you mentioned in an earlier message in this thread. Surprisingly, I believe 32-watt T8s are actually brighter than 40-watt T12s. Check it out. The T8s are more efficient. And the bulbs are economical. I got a box of ten Philips cool white T8s for $19.99 at Home Depot. All told, I have bought 28 of the Home Depot fixtures, because I have some 4' x 2' chrome wire shelves coming from Northern Tool and I plan to populate each tray of it with 4 of the Home Depot fixtures. And I am overdriving the T8s to make them 70% brighter than their already bright normal level. It takes two normal fixtures to make one overdriven fixture, hence my large number of Home Depot fixtures.

The Northern Tool shelves are similar to the Sam's Club shelves except they have only four shelves and the casters are a larger 5-inch size for heavier duty. Oh, and the unit costs $129.99. I will put the 48"x24" shelving unit in our breezeway where we can maintain a lower temperature in the range of 50F to 65F, which should produce stockier transplants. As a bit of serendipity, the fluorescent tubes may also be a little brighter in this ambient temperature range. Our breezeway, though enclosed, is currently unheated and uninsulated and it runs about 32F in this cold Maine winter, so we will add some insulation and some kind of thermostatically controlled electric heater to keep its night temperature from falling below 50F. The numerous fluorescent fixtures will provide a significant heat source when their timers have them on.

-- Burton --
eweed
Everson, WA
(Zone 8a)

January 25, 2004
1:03 PM

Post #762574

Jagonjune nothing can save me from me.The green house is way to small. This little program is a perfect example of the eyes being bigger than the belly so to speak.Funny thing is if my belly was any bigger I would have to have my bibbs made by Omar the tent maker.

As for zone envy I would kill for yours or at least for lots of the things you enjoy. Hunting, fishing, and a reduced population for starters. The thrill of turning two or three high energy English setters loose on a frosty clear morning in the sound of silence is something I will never experience again. Now I look at the pictures of my sons little trips to Montanana, South Dakota, and even Eastern Washington and drool. So I guess we all have zone envy or address envy.

Everyone about screwing pvc joints to keep them from spreading. This is not a fundamently sound practice. While some have stated that they do so and seem to be happy with the results so far.

I myself would not do it. Screwing pvc compromises the strenght of the material. Localized fasteners reduce the integrity of the material. Part of the beauty of pvc is its ability to expand and contract with heat change allowing it to remain strong.. If you must screw the stuff at least use a pilot drill first. A better way would be drill it and pin the joint with a cotter pin putting a little tape over the bent ends to prevent you from being scratched from the sharp ends or by using very small machine screws with nuts size 8 would do nicely.

As far as that goes white pvc electrical tape wrapped neatly around each joint should work as well as any thing unless you want to pick the thing up and move it while it is loaded.Ernie

scooterbug
Tellico Plains, TN
(Zone 7b)

January 25, 2004
3:06 PM

Post #762680

Ernie,
... I was kinda thinking of the PVC connectors working on what I would call a gradual compression principle. So wouldn't inserting a screw compromise this? Huh?...lol
Once again folks..."I" know what "I" mean...
LOL
eweed
Everson, WA
(Zone 8a)

January 25, 2004
3:38 PM

Post #762711

Scooter Yes any screw be it screw in or thru bolted will compromise,Any deviation from glue period will sacrafice some part of the design principals of pvc. Some changes more than others can be a trade off. Is the risk of cracking worth what you are trying to do?. Each has to figure that out for themselves.

Form follows function was the first rule of design I ever learned in my work and at home. Hey there are lots of ways to do most every thing and my way may be right for me but wrong for you. If what a person builds ends with the builder being happy with it then I say ok. Ernie
jagonjune
Edmonton, AB
(Zone 3a)

January 25, 2004
4:35 PM

Post #762769

Maine Man What's overdriving? (at least as relates to lights)
eweed from the stuff on this thread it sounds like we could use one or two of you handy times up here on occasion so if you ever want empty unpopulated experiences again...
Zen_Man
Ottawa, KS
(Zone 5b)

January 25, 2004
5:57 PM

Post #762869

Jagonjune,

Overdriving a 2-bulb fluorescent fixture consists of rewiring the 2-bulb ballast to drive a single bulb and adding another rewired ballast to drive the other bulb. Each ballast is driving only one-half as many bulbs as it was designed for, so it is "loafing". But the bulbs get more current and hence burn about 70% brighter.

You can also overdrive a 4-bulb fixture by reconnecting the 4-bulb ballast to only two bulbs and bringing in another 4-bulb ballast for the remaining two bulbs. Once again, the ballasts "loaf" but the bulbs burn brighter.

Not all fluorescent light ballasts are overdrivable. First of all, none of the magnetic ballasts can be overdriven. All of the older fluorescent fixtures used magnetic ballasts and you are probably used to hearing them hum.

Many newer fluorescent fixtures use electronic ballasts. They have a lot of advantages, including that they are quiet. But only some of the newer electronic ballasts can be overdriven. It depends on the wires that come from them.

Overdriving does shorten your bulb life, but I think it is worth it to get more light on my plants. Besides, my Philips 48-inch T8 bulbs have a rated life of 20,000 hours (if my math is right, that would be 2.6 years of continuous operation.)

Since it is recommended to change a fluorescent bulb after one year of continuous operation because their phosphors decline in efficiency, and since I won't be burning the bulbs 24 hours a day or all 365 days of the year, I think overdriving makes sense for my plant starting operation. I hope to get at least two seasons out of my overdriven bulbs. I want to get as much affordable light as possible on my seedlings, and this seems the best way to go for me. There are, of course, high tech expensive lights that are much brighter.

Examples of 2-bulb Rapid Start ballasts that can be overdriven are the Sunpark SL-15 (the ones I am using), the Advance REL-2S40-SC, Advance REL-2S40-RH-TP, GE B232R120HP, and Sylvania QTP 2x32T8/120 RSN-D.

Examples of 2-bulb Instant Start ballasts that can be overdriven are the Advance REL-2P32-SC, GE B232I120RH, Sylvania QT 2x32/120 IS-SC, and the Sylvania QTP 2x32T8/120 ISN-D.

There is a lot of information on the Internet about overdriving fluorescent fixtures. Aquarium hobbyists have been doing it for many years to get more light on their aquarium plants (and fish). Some have even done 4X overdriving, although that is not a good idea for plant growing. The regular 2X overdriving that I am doing is better suited for growing plants.

-- Burton --
jagonjune
Edmonton, AB
(Zone 3a)

January 25, 2004
6:23 PM

Post #762884

WOW

paulgrow

paulgrow
Allen Park, MI
(Zone 6a)

January 25, 2004
6:33 PM

Post #762890

I've had my PVC joints secured with drywall screws for over 3 years without any problems.
I did drill a pilot hole before I screwed them in.

Paul
eweed
Everson, WA
(Zone 8a)

January 25, 2004
7:56 PM

Post #762965

Burton makes perfect sense to me. Much cheaper than buying or converting to HO fluorescent.I have some of each type of ballast and they are cheap and easy to replace.Ernie

Jargonejune and is there a pretter sight than a thousand ducks on their final approach to a parrie pond at sunset?
My great American dream is quite different than most.In another time my nick name could be outback. Ernie
jagonjune
Edmonton, AB
(Zone 3a)

January 26, 2004
4:06 AM

Post #763376

Ranks right up there with the return of the snow geese in the spring or the white swans or a thousand other views on the prairies in almost any weather except a blizzard but maybe that is the price we have to pay
eweed
Everson, WA
(Zone 8a)

January 26, 2004
4:58 AM

Post #763403

opps jagonjune seems I snuck in an extra R and an extra E in your name sorry. Thats the problem two finger typers have can't see the big picture.

Yes for the Blizzard but think of the solitude they bring with them. Yes its a pain to feed live stock but how fun to listen to the wind as it pushes the snow over the landscape changing it every few minutes washing it clean of the dirt and grime of real life.

Yep you called it right we pay a price and its true no pain no gain. Ernie
JimKennard
Salt Lake City, UT
(Zone 6a)

January 27, 2004
4:38 AM

Post #764461

Burton:

Thanks for that good information on the different sources for shelves, and on overdriving the bulbs.

My experience is that ample light and separation of the plants, so their leaves don't overlap (causing them to "stretch" their stems looking for light) assure good stems, even in temperatures of 68-72 degrees.

You might use the commercial greenhouses as an example. I have grown some wonderfully stocky plants in commercial greenhouse conditions of 70-80+ degrees.

again in my experience, the temperatures below 65 degrees are not very conducive for many vegetable plants to get started, and I'd rather have them warmer than that, if possible.

Thanks again for your insights.
Zen_Man
Ottawa, KS
(Zone 5b)

January 27, 2004
6:54 AM

Post #764504

Jim,

"My experience is that ample light and separation of the plants, so their leaves don't overlap (causing them to "stretch" their stems looking for light) assure good stems, even in temperatures of 68-72 degrees."

Thanks for that tip. I will try that extra-space technique to see if our kitchen/dining area plant shelves can succeed beyond the germinating stage. We will need the extra growing space on the Sam's Club shelves anyway, so you have given me hope that our warmer living space can serve to produce healthy transplants.

We will still continue with the breezeway project, because it is about the only available space for our on-order 24" x 48" shelving unit.

Last year, with much weaker fluorescent fixtures from Wal-Mart, we had lots of problems with spindly plants.

If you want to try overdriving fluorescent fixtures, I can provide a URL to detailed information.

-- Burton --
JimKennard
Salt Lake City, UT
(Zone 6a)

January 28, 2004
2:09 AM

Post #765311

Yes, Please.

Jim
Zen_Man
Ottawa, KS
(Zone 5b)

January 28, 2004
4:58 AM

Post #765434

Jim,

There is a forum on the Garden Web called "Growing Under Lights" and in it there is a long message thread entitled, "I have found the BEST cheap fluorescent ballast/fixture" posted by Zink, zone 6a, on Wed, Nov 26, 03 at 12:29. Much of the basic information was included in the original post, but much clarification, additional information, photos, and diagrams were added by Zink, Lightt, and others in subsequent messages. I learned a lot from this message thread and said as much in a post there.

Hopefully you can access the thread. I am a member of the Garden Web (also under the name MaineMan) and membership there is free, but I think non-members can read the threads. Let me know if you can read this thread:

http://forums.gardenweb.com/forums/load/lights/msg111229472000.html

-- Burton --
JimKennard
Salt Lake City, UT
(Zone 6a)

January 28, 2004
10:01 PM

Post #766065

Thanks Burton:

The Food For Everyone Foundation, of which I am President, is listed there also.

Jim Kennard
Melissa_Ohio
Southwestern, OH
(Zone 6b)

January 28, 2004
11:49 PM

Post #766151

Is there any type of fire hazard in doing this to the bulbs?
Kaufmann
GOD's Green Earth
United States
(Zone 8b)

January 29, 2004
12:10 AM

Post #766172

Poppysue: Thanks for the idea! I "built" one today that holds one 48" double shop fixture. Its shaped like the one in your link, just out of pvc. Its too big to use as a tabletop unti, but functional. Next I'll tackle the shelving unit. Thanks to you all for your great ideas and input!
Zen_Man
Ottawa, KS
(Zone 5b)

January 29, 2004
12:39 AM

Post #766191

Melissa,

There is no fire hazard for me because I am careful to do good electrical work, using the appropriate procedures, tools and materials. However, there would be a fire hazard or electrical hazard for anyone who did a bad job of rewiring the fixture.

As far as the bulbs themselves running warmer, they aren't even close to a fire hazard. Based on the information given by Scottplumerias 5KC on Tue, Jan 20, 04 at 15:38 in the referenced Garden Web message thread, in regular fixtures the T8 bulbs warm to about 100F. When 2X overdriven they are about 120F. Scott made those measurements with his infrared pyrometer. I don't have one. (sob)

In my experience, the overdriven bulbs are noticeably warmer, but not so hot that you can't remove the bulb with your bare hands. Definitely not a fire hazard. And the overdriving ballasts themselves actually run cooler, because they are driving a smaller load.

-- Burton --
eweed
Everson, WA
(Zone 8a)

January 29, 2004
1:19 AM

Post #766222

I haven't tried this but in theory one inch wooden dowling should slide inside the one inch pvc pipe. Dowling is usually sold in three foot incraments.

If you slide the dowel through the horozontal pcs and center it you will make the supports much stiffer and the shelves will hold more weight with a lot less sag. Ernie
Melissa_Ohio
Southwestern, OH
(Zone 6b)

January 29, 2004
1:33 AM

Post #766234

Great Idea Ernie!!

Thank you Burton, not sure if I can convince hubby to do it or not, Nascar starts again this weekend. LOL

I doubt hubby would do a bad job... he's a Master Mechanic, and is trained on the electic hybrids, plus he's done a lot of wiring around here. :-)
eweed
Everson, WA
(Zone 8a)

January 29, 2004
2:00 AM

Post #766268

Melissa other things should work also such as a good coarse grained grout or pour foam.All you are trying to do is stop the first moment of movement.

I just thought the dowel was cheap and easy for the results I am sure it will return.

Now about the overdriving I can do it but I hate electrical work send hubby lol. Ernie
scooterbug
Tellico Plains, TN
(Zone 7b)

January 29, 2004
2:15 AM

Post #766286

Melissa ,
... I have seen some PVC Hoop-House directions that have you insert a length of smaller PVC to strengthen the ridge and joints.
Shirley
Melissa_Ohio
Southwestern, OH
(Zone 6b)

January 29, 2004
2:25 AM

Post #766295

Another Good idea Shirley!! And the PVC certainly would be cheaper than the dowel. hmmm decisions decisions!
Maybe I'll do both. :-)
eweed
Everson, WA
(Zone 8a)

January 29, 2004
2:50 AM

Post #766313

Scooter I am not saying you are wrong but there are only a couple of pipe sizes that will fit inside with a nice snug fit.You could be right If I remember I will check tomorrow at work

I have seen those type drawings and the ones I have seen mentioned using emt conduit for reinforcing plastic pipe.

I should have remembered that because it is cheap and comes in 10 foot pcs and is really strong compared to plastic. Having 10 feet to work with you could make the support pc longer.

Lots of ways to do most things and when we brainstorm we get to use a little of this and some of that untill the best way is found. Ernie
Melissa_Ohio
Southwestern, OH
(Zone 6b)

January 29, 2004
3:09 AM

Post #766321

I agree Ernie. Just look at the different ideas that have been "spawned" in this thread alone!

Melissa
jagonjune
Edmonton, AB
(Zone 3a)

January 29, 2004
1:39 PM

Post #766583

You guys should all be on the Red Green show!LOL

paulgrow

paulgrow
Allen Park, MI
(Zone 6a)

January 29, 2004
2:43 PM

Post #766624

This is the 3rd year I've used mine. I have it really loaded with flats andplants and have never had a problem. The PVC is strong enough without anything in the center.

Paul
scooterbug
Tellico Plains, TN
(Zone 7b)

January 29, 2004
5:03 PM

Post #766725

Ernie, I found the plans I mentioned for the re-enforced PVC.
Sheesch ! No wonder...
...They used 1" PVC with 3/4" conduit inside. I guess it could be OK for a temp GH or seedhouse but even so I think their idea is just too lightweight =)

I'm wondering after the combined cost of materials, why not go 1 1/2" from the git-go?

taa-taa
eweed
Everson, WA
(Zone 8a)

January 30, 2004
2:05 AM

Post #767158

Scooterbug didnt get to the measuring today but I see you found the conduit to be the reinforcer.

I have 12 x 48 hoop style high tunnel made of 1 inch pvc with a i inch ridge poleI used no reinforcing and no purlins. This is surely too light for your snow loads . You need a stringer set on post under your ridge and probably one more on each side. Yes bigger for permanate type and you have the option of schedual 80 which has a much thicker wall thickness it is grey in color vs white for schedual 40.

Ernie
eweed
Everson, WA
(Zone 8a)

January 30, 2004
2:20 AM

Post #767175

Jagonjune I don't watch much TV is there such a show or is the red green for stop and go? Ernie

Paul sorry you don't seem to see the need to make things better Glad you are happy with yours.

Melissa has posted two pictures of hers the first is empty and the shelves appear relatively stright.

The second picture shows the same shelf with two flats of starts on one shelf which is obviously starting to bow with the weight.

To help her and others who are interested get a little nicer finished product I am trying to stimulate creative problem ideas to accomplish this. Ernie

kooger

kooger
Oostburg, WI
(Zone 5b)

January 30, 2004
2:24 AM

Post #767181

eweed - The Red Green show is on PBS (public TV). They are the duct tape kings! (originate in Canada) I love their closing line "If the women don't find you handsome, they should at least find you handy!"
scooterbug
Tellico Plains, TN
(Zone 7b)

January 30, 2004
2:37 AM

Post #767193

ernie,
... I think while I am hoarding cast off windows and patio doors to build my GH, I have a design in mind that I am going to make a prototype, out of Sch 40 just to see if it will fly...OOOpppsie! ...wrong word...see if it will stand. There that's better *smile*


A picture of me and my 2003 prototype.

Thumbnail by scooterbug
Click the image for an enlarged view.

scooterbug
Tellico Plains, TN
(Zone 7b)

January 30, 2004
2:42 AM

Post #767199

I think the bowed shelving is caused by the extra joints added to the shelves, more cuts made it weaker. Also it should be somewhere in the directions to 'whack a good one' with a rubber mallet to really seat 'each' compression fit tee-joint good and solid.
ss
Melissa_Ohio
Southwestern, OH
(Zone 6b)

January 30, 2004
2:48 AM

Post #767204

On the Positive side, mine isn't sagging any more than it was, even with the added weight, but I would like to get that sag outta there. :-)

Thumbnail by Melissa_Ohio
Click the image for an enlarged view.

scooterbug
Tellico Plains, TN
(Zone 7b)

January 30, 2004
2:52 AM

Post #767209

AHH _ HAAA !!
... I see little green thingies, they don't seem to care that they are a lil side-ways. As long as the unit stays together I see no prob. Good going =)
Melissa_Ohio
Southwestern, OH
(Zone 6b)

January 30, 2004
3:08 AM

Post #767247

They're all sideways cuz their momma hasn't put them upright after sliding out their tray to see if any of their brothers and sisters had sprouted in the back! LOL

I forgot to add the most important thing, whether it sags or not,

IT WORKS!!! and I am SOOOOOOOo grateful for everyone's input and ideas here. Were it not for this, I would have had to waited til spring to start growing my babies!

This message was edited Jan 29, 2004 11:18 PM
Melissa_Ohio
Southwestern, OH
(Zone 6b)

January 30, 2004
3:11 AM

Post #767249

And you're right scooter, I've never whacked em good to get em good and solid in the joints either.
jagonjune
Edmonton, AB
(Zone 3a)

January 30, 2004
4:47 AM

Post #767304

If you can't find the PBS listing and you have some time between your handy man projects rent "Red Green the Movie" it cracks me up what these guys can do with duct tape. Sort of a modern day 3 (but two or many) stooges.
Melissa_Ohio
Southwestern, OH
(Zone 6b)

February 3, 2004
4:30 PM

Post #771460

And it all comes crashing down...

I came home from school to find my plant stand in peices on the floor. I think the Puppy must have climbed it.

I'm just SICKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKK

I think the majority of my seedlings are ok... except for the ones that dumped out. I was just saying to hubby last night that we needed to bring the crate in for the puppy.

Unfortunately, I don't have time to put it back together, I have to leave for class again at 3, and have homework to do in the meantime.

I could just cry.

kooger

kooger
Oostburg, WI
(Zone 5b)

February 3, 2004
4:36 PM

Post #771466

Hang in there Melissa. Things will get better! You'll do OK! Wish I could come help you pick up the pieces!!
scooterbug
Tellico Plains, TN
(Zone 7b)

February 3, 2004
7:02 PM

Post #771584

Oh no Melissa, I am so sorry to hear this heart-breaking news. I don't know what else to say my friend..hang in there =)

Yesterday's worries are only thoughts that
Have fallen into the sea with the sunset:
It is tomorrow's dreams that survive.


§
LimeyLisa
Princeton, IL
(Zone 5a)

February 3, 2004
9:59 PM

Post #771696

Oh, Melissa. My heart hurts reading this. I hope that you are able to save most.

LimeyLisa Kay
eweed
Everson, WA
(Zone 8a)

February 4, 2004
1:56 AM

Post #771842

Melissa sorry for your setback you are resourceful so I know you will prevail. Ernie
pdkrones
Monroe, NC
(Zone 7b)

February 4, 2004
11:29 PM

Post #772475

Melissa - So how are the seed babies? I have a feeling that most of them will make it. Let us know.

I have been enjoying the seedling stand discussion, and it finally hit me yesterday... I kept thinking of "heat tape", which can be used to wrap pipes to prevent freezing. Then I remembered that when I raised and bred snakes (my apology to those who shudder, but it was a great hobby!) I had (and still do in storage) a bookcase like "rack" into which the tupperware boxes slid that held my lovelies. It had grooves in the shelves, weaving from one shelf level to the next, in which the tape lay. The tape was held in place at corners by plastic-headed pins, and the tape controlled by thermostat.

Problem is, no room for lights to be added, so I can't use the old racks. But that commoner heat pipe tape could be run from end to end on the PVC shelves. What do y'all think?

Peter

paulgrow

paulgrow
Allen Park, MI
(Zone 6a)

February 4, 2004
11:56 PM

Post #772502

Sounds like a plan Peter.

Paul
Melissa_Ohio
Southwestern, OH
(Zone 6b)

February 5, 2004
1:22 AM

Post #772566

Hopefully they'll be ok, they got "haircuts" compliments of the lights sitting directly on them. I'm probably lucky my house didn't burn down.

There were two seedlings that I'm not sure what they are now. Have an idea, but, not positive. I lost a few that got sucked up in the vacuum I think.

You can see in the picture, where the light sat on top of them, their leaves are singed.

Thumbnail by Melissa_Ohio
Click the image for an enlarged view.

LimeyLisa
Princeton, IL
(Zone 5a)

February 5, 2004
1:58 PM

Post #772913

So glad that not all is lost. All that work. Must have made your heart stop for a minute!

LimeyLisa Kay
eweed
Everson, WA
(Zone 8a)

February 17, 2004
12:37 PM

Post #783992

Melissa well what was the out come ? Ernie
Melissa_Ohio
Southwestern, OH
(Zone 6b)

February 18, 2004
2:10 AM

Post #784555

I think they're "stunted" but they're still alive... not very tall though. Maybe getting their heads burned off made them produce more roots? LOL
scooterbug
Tellico Plains, TN
(Zone 7b)

November 8, 2004
2:42 AM

Post #1134342

bump ...

Some more money savers

Heat box for germinating seeds ( holds 2 trays)
http://davesgarden.com/forums/fp.php/fp.php?pid=22259

PVC plant stand ( holds 12 seed trays)
http://www.carlnet.org/~ttsdaly/plantstand.html _nice color coded instructions
http://davesgarden.com/forums/t/169142/
My total cost for PVC and T-connectors @ home Depot only $34.64 (last year)

Seedling trays are cheap =)
http://www.novoselenterprises.com/products/seedling.asp


This message was edited Nov 7, 2004 10:23 PM
imway2dumb
Gordonville, TX
(Zone 7b)

November 8, 2004
2:47 AM

Post #1134361

Thanks for the bump!
TamaraFaye
Fritch, TX
(Zone 6b)

January 15, 2005
2:09 AM

Post #1238462

lets bump this again... great info ;=j
eweed
Everson, WA
(Zone 8a)

January 15, 2005
3:01 AM

Post #1238529

These are functional but you can get six adjustable shelves on casters for $72 bux from costco. They are very well built with heavy duty wire shelves. Ernie
TamaraFaye
Fritch, TX
(Zone 6b)

January 15, 2005
4:39 AM

Post #1238653

Well, the PVC project would be a great thing to do with my kids. Meanwhile, we don't have a costco here, but it is on my Sam's Club list. I bought a light from Indoor Gardening Supplies, and have it set up. I have to go look again, but I don't think it is even like pictured. If i am not satisfied, I will post here again, and in the watchdog. Thanks everyone for all the great tips, I have Spring Fever!
pdkrones
Monroe, NC
(Zone 7b)

January 16, 2005
11:45 PM

Post #1241878

FYou know, since this thread is alive again, I gotta say something about flurorescents. They don't work for me. I made the plant stand last winter, so I am in the second year of growing things under lights - cuttings and seedlings. the combination of the 2 types of bulbs - can't remember the usually recommended pair - just doesn't work well. Plants do better on my window sill, even in dim conditions. Anybody have any ideas?

Peter
eweed
Everson, WA
(Zone 8a)

January 16, 2005
11:56 PM

Post #1241887

Peter are your seedlings within two to four inches if not you are to far away. I use four tubes in each shelf of mine alternating cool white bulbs for the blue side of the light spectrum best for vegatative growth and warm white bulbs to provide the red light part that is best for flowering and fruiting.I keep my starts very close to the bulbs and have good results. As we speak I have two flats of onion starts simmering away and they will stay there till mid febuary when I will harden them a bit and plant them out. Each year my plant stand is nursery to hundreds of seedlings. Ernie
Melissa_Ohio
Southwestern, OH
(Zone 6b)

January 17, 2005
12:48 AM

Post #1241959

They work great for me. I have to go buy some 2 ft lights tomorrow, I"m WAY downsizing the amount I'm starting this year.
scooterbug
Tellico Plains, TN
(Zone 7b)

January 17, 2005
1:45 AM

Post #1242061

Peter, The lights need to be 2 or 3 inches from your plants/seedlings.

paulgrow

paulgrow
Allen Park, MI
(Zone 6a)

January 17, 2005
6:52 PM

Post #1243119

Also make sure you get 40 watt bulbs also. They come in 25 and 40 W.
As scooterbug and eweed said the bulbs need to be 2-3 inches from the plants.

Paul
pdkrones
Monroe, NC
(Zone 7b)

January 18, 2005
4:06 PM

Post #1244586

Right now, I have African vilets under the combination of cool and warm lights. They are about 3' from the plants. The leaves are bunching up, not like leaves that are missing light and reach up but in a rounder cluster with slight cupping of the leaves. They are exposed about 12 hrs. a day. Last year, seedlings got leggy and lacked stem vigor. It may be my fertiliaation program that is to blame. I'll be starting some seed soon; we'll see. I am going to go to a higjh phosphorus, low nitrogen liquid feed.
MaryEv
Columbus, OH
(Zone 6a)

January 19, 2005
12:38 PM

Post #1246009

pdkrones, I'm not an expert (this is my first winter using lights,) but I think 3' is way too far from plants or seedlings. Scooterbug is right, the lights need to be 2 or 3 inches from your plants/seedlings. I have read no farther than 6", but nevertheless, a lot closer than 3'.

I have (4) 4' florescent lights, all with just plain ol' lights (no mixture of warm/cool) with tropicals and succulents growing under them for the winter. They are all doing amazingly well. But the light fixtures are not more than 6" from any plant. I wasn't feeding, at all, but when all the plants starting getting full and putting on growth I added some Osmocote, just in case they needed it.


Edited for spelling

This message was edited Jan 19, 2005 4:47 PM
pdkrones
Monroe, NC
(Zone 7b)

January 23, 2005
3:30 PM

Post #1253506

I musta typed wrong. I am at 3 inches! :-) I think my issue is proper fertilizer formula and strength. You're right; the Osmo is always a safe choice!

Peter
jcbfree
Greenville, WI
(Zone 5a)

January 24, 2008
8:23 AM

Post #4446290

I built the pvc plant stand but I made a few alterations. In the center of the horizontal pipes instead of putting a t connector, I put a + connector and put vertical pvc pipes to support the shelves to each layer. I also put the shelving on a piece of plywood with rollers on it so I could move it in and out of my garage during warmer days and move it back in at night when it's too cool out. Just make sure you glue the horizontal pipes so they don't pull apart while moving. I also put the white light weight shade cover (or bug cover) on it so the sun wouldn't burn the leaves and the wind wouldn't damage the leaves. I just held it on with the pinching clothes pins. Hope this helps. Happy planting.

Joann
azreno
Mesa, AZ
(Zone 9b)

August 12, 2008
1:35 PM

Post #5403474

OK, I made me one of these so I thought it was time give it another good bump! I also made the shelves 20" apart instead of 15" and I'm glad I did. I don't currently need all the space for starting things but I figure maybe in time ;) I need more strip lights!

I did also place an order with novosel for trays and things and I have to say, I expected the same quality as the Jiffy trays I would pick up at Walmart but they are much better quality IMO and I'm so glad I ordered some. And the inserts are super cheap and now I have a variety of sizes (some are deep!) and they separate out easily, love that.

Thanks for that tip Scooterbug!
scooterbug
Tellico Plains, TN
(Zone 7b)

August 17, 2008
3:12 AM

Post #5424952

URVW ;o)
p1mkw
Danville, IN
(Zone 5b)

August 31, 2008
7:40 PM

Post #5491273

Here's a picture of my weekend project. I'm not sure which thread I found the link to the diagram that I used to build this, but it's exactly what I was looking for. Total cost for materials at Lowe's was less than $65 and that includes two light fixtures and sun-stik bulbs (full spectrum). In case anyone else is interested, here's where you can find a copy of the materials list and diagram for putting it together. My son did the cutting and assembly for me. He has a PVC pipe cutter which really sped up the process ... he probably spent in total, maybe a couple of hours doing all of this. The gluing seemed to take longer than the cutting. The long vertical pieces are not glued so it can be broken down for easier storage.

http://pics.davesgarden.com/pics/ladygardener1_1168446806_613.jpg

I found a coleus on the 'I'm almost dead' shelf at Lowe's yesterday for 50 cents and am experimenting with rooting cuttings from it following tigerlily123's great instructions. Once I either finish killing the coleus or get some good results, I'll probably put this all away until around the end of January.

Thumbnail by p1mkw
Click the image for an enlarged view.

Smockette
Magnolia, TX
(Zone 8b)

November 6, 2009
11:57 PM

Post #7248729

Bump! Tis the season! lol
TsFlowers
Delphi, IN

November 16, 2009
2:39 AM

Post #7277984

In case you all wanted the new link to plans:
http://www.tsflowers.com/plantstand.html
Pippi21
Silver Spring, MD
(Zone 6b)

February 27, 2010
5:16 AM

Post #7591245

Melissa..this goes to show people that "You should never under estimate the power of a woman!" I'm so impressed that you made this by yourself, with help of son. Way to go! Pat yourself on the back. What do those racket scissors look like and how do they work? I would not be able to cut a straight line with or without a hack saw, believe me. You should see the cuts on my WS jugs and soda bottles made by box cutter. Good thing we aren't graded on cutting those!

paulgrow

paulgrow
Allen Park, MI
(Zone 6a)

February 27, 2010
2:37 PM

Post #7591852

They are called ratchet shears or PVC cutters.
They resemble a pair of tin snips; cost $10-$12.
Dogs_N_Petunias
Cleburne, TX
(Zone 8a)

December 13, 2010
9:23 AM

Post #8257779

Bump

Built the PVC stand this weekend and will use it inside our house. Will have two 2-tube flourescent shop lights for each shelf. Any problem with using these 3-piece greenhouse kits for seed starting under lights? http://www.novoselenterprises.com/products/single.asp?ID=5726

Will the clear propagation dome be useful to use with the light right down close to it? I don't mean actually resting on it but maybe one inch away. I have not done this before, so have a lot to figure out. My thought was the propagation dome would be helpful indoors because our central heat creates a much drier environment than would ordinarily be in a greenhouse.

Thanks.
Imperial_Tropic
Yorba Linda, CA

December 19, 2010
9:41 PM

Post #8268556

I love making stuff myself, and to be honest I did consider building plant stands out of PVC at one time, but decided against it because the smaller size pipe like 3/4 and 1" are just too flimsy for my liking. I use that stuff for air, water and filtration lines in our aquarium systems, and it just gives way to much for 'heavy' liner trays.

Also, the cost, as I see pointed out above is higher than just going to Costco and buying the chrome racks, which is what I ended up doing. Although if you don't have a costco near you, that isn't much help.

regarding lights, I bought the Home Depot shop lights that were 19.95. Virtually no reflector at all on them, but I haven't really noticed that as a problem. The space I'm using is well heated, and the lights are much higher above the trays than I have seen depicted here. I have a full spread of light, and I haven't noticed any problems with any of the species I'm propagating.

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