I had read notmarthas post about how to start daylilies in water and peroxide and decided if it worked that well for daylilies that maybe it would help some of the other seeds that are harder to get started. http://davesgarden.com/t/414635/notmartha
I am now using it for everything that I want to soak and am really impressed with the results.
I wish I could give you better information about length of times and which seeds work best, but I am still experimenting with both of those.
What I can tell you is that I have had some really great results.
Moonflowers, 4 o'clock, and morning glories all sprouted roots while they were soaking.
I have had great germination after the soak in the peroxide, distilled water mix.
I really wish that I had kept some data on it, so I could give you better information, but it was one of those "lets try this ideas" that worked out much better than I had any idea that it would.
Larger seeds and things with really hard outer shells I was leaving in the mix for about 3 days, some longer if the seeds were not swelling at all.
I have no idea what it does, but I figured if it could actually root and allow leaves on the daylily seeds that it must be good stuff!!!
I did keep track of some wisteria seeds that I soaked and I left them in the mixture for 3 days and then put in seed starter. I had 100% germination in less than 2 weeks and they are all ready about 4 inches high. I just have no idea if that is good or bad having never started them from seed before.
Another one I use this on is canna seeds. Lots of seeds will sprout without it I know, but using distilled water and peroxide sure busts them out of the seed coats in a matter of days! I think one of the biggest benefits is the antiseptic quality of the peroxide. I use this mix to water seedlings with and rarely see mold or gnats (unless I just use plain water).
Kudos to Alice! You have been so much fun with your experiments this year. :)
just today i learned that hydrogen peroxide is what our body produces to fight infection. it is water - H2O plus and extra O. now H2O2, the extra O leaves and attaches to the infection and kills it, leaving water.
so this would make a lot of sense when you have not seen any mold etc...
Badssed I know I have started to scare myself with all my experiments!!!!
It certainly has made winter pass much faster than usual!
I have one other experiment in process that I am having what looks like will be good results with, and I will post when I am sure.
It is just fun to try different things and when they actually work successfully its even better.
You probably have noticed that I haven't written much about my dismal fairlures!!!!haha
Debi Thanks for the info, all I knew was it did something wonderful and that was good enough for me!!! My brain is just not very scientifically oriented!
Yeah, where are the failure posts? LOL Hey, I find that you learn much more from trial and error. It is much more likely to stick with you if you tried it and it worked or failed. If it failed, you will want to improve it and if it worked, you'll likely do it again. I have really enjoyed your experiments. :)
i'm learning a lot from your experiements too. i am not scientifically inclined, it was just a fluke that my dh had told me this , that very morning, and it actually stuck in my head. :) i don't have the energy to do much experimenting, but i'm grateful for those of you who do, and i can learn from you. dave's is full of very knowledgable folks.
I like to avoid even thinking about the failures, but all and all I have had more successes than failures.
I really appreciate the kind words, but I better warn you it probably only encourages me to post more about the things I try!!! haha
When you get bored let me know and I will try to stay quieter!!!
I've found awesome uses for the H202 mix other than seed soaks.I never use it for seeds though, I use Maxicrop for that. I found a product a few years ago made by Safer's called "Liquid Oxygen" and it turned out to be fertilizer w/ h202 added. Then I found out "ironite" fertilizer uses it too. So me and a few friends started expiramenting w/ it.
It's amazing! I've found that it's impossible to overwater if you use h202. Its seems the plants can get more oxygen when you leave a suacer under the plant full of it instead of letting it dry out. I then had a plant that had rootrot really bad from being over watered indoors over winter. I used some H202 to water it and not only did the plant get plenty of oxygen, the H202 cleans or kills the anerobic bacteria that causes that odor and condition. Since then, I've used it most all winter when I have to bring the plants in. It works to help sterilize growing mediums. It also will help any plant that's been over watered indoors or out. You can't go wrong using it imo unless you get the concentration to strong. I don't know if that's possible using 3.5% Hydrogen peroxide found in drug/grocery stores. My Canadian friends went as far as buying hydrogen peroxide bleach, I didn't know there was such a thing. They were able to save money in the long run since it is so concentrated compared to the kind used for human wounds. They could use 1 teaspoon per 5 gallons of water when I was having to use almost a full bottle of 3.5%.
Well I'm worse than aknapp when it comes to posting and worrying about going on and on too much.LOL I know I've crossed that line so good day for now. Let me know if this info is useful and I'd happily provide more info it's its needed.
Jeff, are you saying that you used almost a full bottle to a gallon of water? I'd like your recipe if you have a minute to jot it down and any other recipes that would help with growing seed and healthy plants. On the brug forum there is a recipe thread for anything that might help us with starting seeds and other things. Please take a look if you have some spare time. Sounds like you keep pretty busy growing lots of things.
LOL Brugie. No that was "almost a full bottle of 3.5%" to 5 gallons. It was a dinky sized bottle too. It's been a couple years since I've needed or felt the need to mix that up, I did keep some notes though somewhere. I have such a small house so storage is a big deal plus I'm sitting in a wheelchair that keeps me from getting to the top closet shelf or the attic to find all these "notes". I'm ending this post here and will email Brugie the rest of the story.
Thanks for the email Jeff. Hope I didn't put you to sleep with the one I wrote back to you. We live in a small house also, but I have almost three acres to play with. I have, so far, kept it to the immediate back yard. I don't want to have to drag a garden hose more than 150 ft. LOL!!
LOL Bruggie, no way did you bore me. I was in the middle of short "novel" of an email reply lastnight until my wife had a small case of what I call "puter envy".LOL That happens when I pay too much attn. to the pc than her. So I didn't get a chance to finish my email, I will asap. Thanks for the kind words and offers!!! Do you know how far the Iowa round up is from say Des Moines? Des Moines is just a liitle more than 2 hours from me, if the round up isn't much further and everything goes well...I'll see you there hopefully;). I'm in total "Awww" of your garden/greenhouse. We have soo many projects going on here but we're going to fit a greenhouse in there somehow/someday. I just thought of enough updates to start another volume to my email coming your way!LOL Hopefully I won't bore you. I gotta get out of this forum so we can talk more. I'll write asap, Thanks, Jeff
JL Is that all I need to know is just the 3.5 ounces to 5 gallons of water or is there more to it than that. I would love to try this, I have a terrible problem with giving too much tender loving care to things, which usually means overwatering also.
I hope you make it to the Iowa round up I am excited about going and would love to meet you if you can make it!
No it's not that simple but close. It required some math to figure it out and I do have that info somewhere. I promise I'll find it. I also need to find my notes on the "KREB" cycle that plant/bacteria and trace elements do when they interact w/ one another as in nature. I have a recipe for a additive made of citric acid mixed w/ raw sugar to help in this process too but that's mainly for flavor I think and I haven't done that kind of gardening in years. You maybe able to beat me to it, try a search on "liquid oxygen" and the "kreb cycle". You may find all the info you need, I do remember the doctor and garden guru...Dr. Luther Thomas wrote most all of this info and discovered it too. He also happens to be the owner of "marine Land" aquarium products. I'll dig here too.
I need the moron's recipe for soaking seeds... I just ordered lots of morning glory seeds from Select. My first seeds... patience is not my virtue... so what do I soak them in?
Someone really needs to write "the idiots guide to starting seeds"!
Hi back the method Ihave been using is just 10% regular peroxide and 90 % distilled water. I have had great results using this mix, but this is strictly my own experiments and not well documented at this point.
I had been using just plain water to soak seeds and even that was working well.
I was told to soak morning glory seeds for 24 hours before putting into seed starter.
Depending on what you are using for trays either use the plastic dome lids or just cover with clear plastic wrap until the seeds begin to germinate.
I hope this helps.
If you do a search on seed starting you will find lots of threads about this subject and many different suggestions and advice.
I think we all try our own variations of tried and true methods.
Good luck with your seeds.
I've been soaking seeds in a Maxicrop/water mix. "Maxicrop" is a fancy liquid seaweed. I've been using it for everything you can imagine, cuts, seeds, seedling etc.. It's awesome imo and I've found it raises germination rates bigtime on older seeds. The wife and I have done side by sides w/ the same seeds, some in water and the others in maxicrop. There was no comparison, maxidrop gave us 99% germ rates and much faster to sprout where the seeds in water were at best 50/50 w/ germ rates that varied a LOT. Now I use "superthrive" on them as soon as the pop up. It's a hormone that tells the plant to root hard NOW and worry about vegatative growth a little later. It's great stuff. I wouldn't be afraid of mixing that w/ the hydrogen peroxide solution either. IMO, some of the best liquid ferts I've used have a combo of H2O2 and fertilizer. I'm going to do a mix of both this weekend for another side by side. I'll keep you posted
aknapp. I think Lowe's carries it now. Any garden center worth its wieght in flowers should carry it too. I go thru 5-6 bottles per summer easy. Mix that w/ superthrive and you have the best transplant food in the world imo. That miracle grow starter fert. is good on established plants but the wife really burnt some plants w/ it last year. I actually thought it was worth having around until that. GRRR
Well it depends on your local branch. The last 2 bottles of each product, I bought at the hydro shop. I was already there to buy oasis cubes and I'll pay the extra buck or whateverthe price difference is between chain stores and local shops.
Well I maybe all wrong, I just asked my wife and she said Lowe's had both products. I trust her memory over mine anyday depending on the decision.LOL The Maxicrop comes in 2 different kinds, the weaker/better green bottle w/ a shot glass like white cap. The Superthrive is usually displayed in tiny brown bottles w/ pale green metal lid. The label looks like it was drawn up in 1940(that's when it was introduced at the world's fair and won the gold medal) and is mainly yellow w/ a green stripe across the front. I hope that helps you in locating it. It's been years since I've read the label, man this is some seriouly STUFF and they've had a 5000$ bounty that's been out since 1940 to prove them wrong.
Twin I just got your email and am trying to reply. We're having a slumber party for my daughter's 15th B-day and I'm already worn out, LOL Nobodies sposed to show up till 5pm! Help me!
Man We moved all of our plants and seed trays out for the day only to see my nieghbor's dog run up the steps and overturned 3 full trays w/ all 72 sites full on each!!!GRRRMy labels are everywhere, now I won't know who's who until they all come up.
OK, I must stop thinking about this before this dog gets pellet gun training. Please wish me well cuz I need a LOT of patients to get thru the next 24-36 hours.
TWIN if you and Alice can't locate Maxicrop/Superthrive, lemme know and I'll send you some asap.
Thanks so much for your info. I can relate to your dog problems. I went out yesterday and realized that the fake greenhouse we had made the first of the week must have gotten to cold last night (Friday) and had lost about 30 plants. From there on the day went down hill. We had incredible winds and the greenhouse thing blew down. I went to get stuff to build a hoop house and it blew down about 3 times before I finally got it held down a bit better with my sons help.
I am guessing I will not have a plant left by today, but finally had to give up about 10:00 p.m. on rescuing everything. I was wet, cold, and tired and decided they would either make it or not. I guess we will find out how tough they are.
This morning when I looked out it appears that all but one portion of the plastic held, but I know it was really cold last night so I am no holding out much hope.
I guess life is still one big learning experience for me!
Thanks so much for all of your advice and I will try to get to Lowe's this week to get both of these products.
OH NO! I didn't know you were a Yankee In Michigan Alice. You poor gal. I lived in Midland for 8 or so years. We moved from S. Oklahoma to Midland and OMG...It was a nightmare. Winter has no business lasting longer the spring,summer and fall combined. I found the people up there(atleast where we lived) just so rude and negative. It took 3 years b4 we met 1 of our next door niegthbor's but we hit it off great w/ the other. I think that was due to them being Okies too.LOL I do miss the fishing and skiing alot but we just couldn't handle all that winter.LOL No offense meant, I'm just ribbing you. It's not like living in Kansas is any great treat either but atleast the season's are back to "normal".LOL
Lemme know if you can find those products, if not, my offer is still good;)
Thanks so much Jeff I really appreciate the offer! I enjoyed the humor also!!!! I told somebody a while ago it was about all I had left!!!
Still haven't had the nerve to venture out, but will get there shortly and see what has managed not to blow away.
I noticed a few minutes ago that my cement garden angel in the front yard blew over last night and she must weigh about 200 pounds, probably not a good sign!
I am starting to feel a little like Dorothy from the "Wizard of Oz" only I didn't think I was in Kansas!!! haha
Well, went to Lowes last night looking for Maxi crop & super thrive, but didn't find them. What I did find, though was: Liquid Ironite plant & flower food plus oxygen. Now I think I water with that after they're up, right? The other thing I found was Green Light Root stimulator & starter solution, made with indole-3-butyric acid 5-20-10. Can I soak the seeds with that or do I water when they just come up? All these questions. Am going out one night this week or maybe next Saturday to a garden center where I know they have Maxi crop & super thrive. I am soaking about 30 different kinds of seeds (most of them morning glories) in the distilled water-peroxide mix that I use to soak lily seeds. It was interesting to see all the bubbles made by the peroxide. I will be planting these seeds in the oasis cubes in the hot mat tonight & I will turn the thermostat down to 75 degrees.
I know the Ironite very well, that's 1 more of the ferts mixed w/ H202 for liquid oxygen. It's a great fert, I don't think I'd use it on babies unless the directions say its safe. As a rule, seedlings and cuts need none or very little nutrient. Maxicrop fert values are 0.1-0-1.0 if you buy the green bottle thats liquid seaweed. They have a fish based fert in the yellow bottle that's 5-1-1. I never use and ferts on seedlings until they put on the second set of leaves that are fully grown except for Green Maxicrop(I don't really see that as a fert since it's values are so low), I usually mix in some superthrive too. Both are great for watering cuts or seedlings.
I think I've seen the other product you mentioned, it seems the concept of "liquid O2" is finally catching on w/ mainstream companies. What are the values on the second bottle you mentioned? It maybe mild enough for this purpose. The way I look at it and what I've been taught: Seeds have the hormones and a small amount of fertilizer built into them. That's how seedlings can grow out on a paper towel or on bare ground, Ma Nature filled the seeds full of everything they need to get rolling, THEN they start using/taking up alternative food/ferts.LOL Do I make any sense? I don't feel like I do and I never re-read my posts before posting.
Green Light Root stimulator & starter solution is 2-20-10 for newly planted flowers, shrubs & trees. An aid to the development of fast root structure, strong root structure and green vigorous plants. It has 5% ammoniacal Nitrogen, 20% Available Phosphate , 10% soluble Potash. Derived from: Diammonum phosphate, Ammonium Polyphosphate, Potassium Hydroxide and Muriate of Potash and Chlorine, not more than 3%. It says information regarding the contents & levels of metals in this product is available on the internet at: http://www.regulatory-info-gl.com
Hope that answers your questions. I guess it's only for older seedlings after they've been transplanted into pots.
Yup. That 1 is mainly for reducing transplant shock on mature, well established plants. I bet its pretty good stuff, I like some kind of fertilizer or the like that's intended just for reducing transplant shock. We've used the miracle grow product meant just for this purpose. That's the only miracle grow product I can't stand. We thought it was good stuff at 1st, next thing I knew my plants had burnt tips and were shocked!LOL Guess you never know til you try.
Just got done soaking about 30 different types (mostly Morning Glories) of seeds & the roots are coming out already in 24 hours, after being soaked in the peroxide distilled water mix. Hallalujah. LOL. I am soaking other seeds (in the pea family) to see how they do. I had some rather old (2 years) Veltheima seeds and I soaked them overnight too and they too are cracking open. I'm tickled pink, er, green, with this new discovery. Thanks to you DG-er's for the tip. I'm going to try soaking some very old seeds with it & see if it rejuvenates them. Love these experiments.
My mg seeds got here & I'm ready to go. I have my Superthrive & my peroxide, but I'm terrified about the mixing thing... Would a teaspoon of peroxidide & a drop of Superthrive together be better? Is it one or the other? HELP!!
You use superthrive@ 3-4 drops, 1 TBSP of peroxide and 1 cap ful of maxicrop. I usually don't use superthrive until the seeds have come up. I kinda think Buttoneer's suggestion of that much peroxide to 1 cup of water is really extreme. I didn't start using peroxide on seeds until this year, I'm not certain that it helps, it hasn't hurt either. I use all three products religously once the seedlings are on their 2nd set of leaves. I'm from the school that seeds should contain all the nutrients needed to get the plant to that 1st set of leaves atleast. That has always worked for me even before discovering all these newer plant tricks.
Goodluck and let us know how it goes;)
My seeds are in the mix... now what? How long should they soak? I am so bad at math, I think I ordered too many seeds, although how could you ever have too many plants. I wanted a jungle of vine effect so I ordered 6 packs of all the mg seeds at select. I'm hoping morning glory take over! Here's a photo of one spot I'm planting. Any thoughts? Other than a sweet pea, this will be my first seed.
I haven't had any problems with the ratio of peroxide to distilled water. What I did was take the notmartha forum where it was in mil and convert it to bakers measure to make it easier since I didn't have any graduated beakers. I successfully germinated 2 Australian MG Seeds (Operculina brownii) that I have had for several years and never were able to get the little buggers to germinate. I figured it was because their seasons are reversed, but I think it was the germination inhibitors in the seed and this mix seems to have broken the code, if you know what I mean and I have two nice size seedlings. Yippee!!! Also, Sesbania formosa (from Australia) germinated so if I can do it with 2 species, the rest ought to come easy.
One bean out of ten has sprouted so far (3 days). The same day, 4/7/04, I started soaking 10 Vermont Cranberry beans from 2002. Three days later all 10 have sprouted, I'm impressed! I planted them today in their own individual pots and used the peroxide/distilled water to dampen the growing medium.
Today I started soaking 10 Prizewinner pole bean seed from 1996 which I thought I had lost (now there's hope), Sunset Giant marigold and Grandpa Ott's MG. I'll let you know how I make out.
Thanks you guys for all the information! I had never heard of this method before I ran across this post and so far it really looks promising.
I tried germinating my Uncle Walt's Vermont Cranberry pole beans with tap water and got zero to germinate, on seed both from 1996 & 2002, 10 seeds each. I thought I had lost them, this strain has been in the family since the 1880's. I was sick!
As I only have a few seed left I was elated to get the kind of germination I've gotten so far.
I have the history of these beans posted on DG somewhere, I'll find it and hyperlink it to this thread.
Jeff, Will you adopt me? Your a green thumb and I'm just a green horn! I just started another thread asking about starting seeds on compost and it looks like I really need to be "schooled" in the art of growing seeds. I never even realized I might need to soak them before I planted. Duh! I have thousands though. I just had visions of myself making hundreds of pensil holes for the babies. Does it depend on the seed as to whether a pre-soak is advisable? Is direct sowing asking for trouble? I am going to reread all your great product advise, but i am such a novice I am unsure if the products you are advising are for seed starting that will be in jars like Notmartha or planted in trays? Please excuse my ignorance. I will be a good student and make you proud.
The only seeds I kept in jars of the fluid were the daylily seeds but I was in a hurry, so put the ones with roots sticking out in the propagator. I soaked the rest of the different species of seeds overnight (24 hours) in a small amount of the H202 fluid mix and then did not wash them off, but just planted them in the propagator. With any hard-shelled seed, I always nick a tiny hole in the seed-coat with my husband's toenail clippers (the ones that look like cutters) (he just LOVES that) and then soak them. Of course, I was doing that when I was soaking them in plain water, prior to this. Anyway, it's very interesting to hear of everybody's results in this experiment.
Susan, your making my head swell up big! I'm extremely flattered, but I think I'm too young to adopt anyone...well almostLOL. At 35, I'm the baby of the bunch IMO.
You can still sow seeds as directed on most all seed packs. I've just found by soaking 1st, they germinate much faster, your germination rates go way up, your giving seedlings a lil lift, plus you can get very old seeds that probably wouldn't germinate at all if it weren't for a good seed soak. I soak every seed I plant anymore, it's just turned into part of the plan now.
As you can see here, there are many many ways and solutions to soak in and you can see everyone raging over their results.
I love this place! let me know if I can help out in anyway, that's almost as fun as gardening(teaching).
Could some of you who have been experimenting please give me a short rundown (recipe) of what to use when soaking the seeds as far as mixes are concerned? By that I mean what product and how many spoonsfull to the cup, etc. I find that there is too much said above to fully comprehend the whole thing without using my brain. LOL! I have some old seeds that I would very much like to save. Thanks!
Elena...List of supplies:
regular store bought hydrogen peroxide.
Superthrive or maxicrop are not "MUST HAVES" but they sure help.
I mix up 1 gallon at a time as it cannot be stored.
1capful of maxicrop
2-3 drops of Superthrive
1-2 tablespoons of hydrogen peroxide
Mix all ingredients into a 1 gallon jug of water(or you could scale it down if need be, I feed my plants any left over's)
Pour the solution into a few small cups that you will be soaking different seeds in. Let seeds sit 24 hours or more in the solution. Then sow seeds as directed. Some seeds will germinate/sprout while being soaked, don't worry. You could pluck them out and plant then or wait the full 24 hrs. With really hard shelled seeds(like passion flower or brugmansia's) I soaked mine for the whole weekend.
This will increase germ rates and the amount of time needed to sprout imo.
You can do this w/o those fancy ingredients but I like them and they will last you a long time. Both are great to have around for babying sickly plants or rootrot.
Have fun and good luck
Maxicrop and Superthrive are both available at http://www.mellingers.com/. By the time you add shipping it might be a little pricey - but with the price of gas. . . They ARE available at the tips of your keyboard fingers.
Thank you so very much, Jeff. I am printing all that out for handy reference and want to get started with the soaking and sowing just as soon as I can obtain the products.
Thanks also, rosiesplace. I may have to order also. I will ck. my local stores first but my first thoughts are Lowes and Home Depot. Maybe one of the larger gardening places will have it. I will start checking on that.
Have you tried any of the fancier/HI$ nurseries? Another place to look at is any hydroponic garden shop if you have 1 in your city. I know of a cheap mail order business but I forget the name. Try a websearch and I'll look for the catalog for the place I'm talking about.
If your just wanting to do some seed soaking or the like, there are other very similar products. For example, Maxicrop's main and only needed ingredient is "Ascophyllum Nodosum Seaweed". It has almost no fertilizer values, it's N-P-K is 0.1-0.0-1.0. The maker's name of maxi is "Ohrstrom's", that may help your searching and make sure its a green bottle and not the yellow if you do find Maxicrop. If you can't find it, ask somebody at your nursery if they carry liquid seaweed of any kind, maybe you could discover an equivilent and save us all money. Using Superthrive as a seed soaker is something I just started doing recently since I found some very important seeds that were very old. It did help w/ germination rates of the older seeds but I don't see it being a must have. Heck I've been using the hydrogen peroxide for everything except seed soaking until this year, I did just fine w/o it for many years. I think as far as using it on seeds, it's merely a means of speeding up germination IMO. These products we've combined haven't been around or used in this manor for more than 7 or so years tops. The world has been farming for centuries w/o this stuff, so don't let it dictate how or if you germinate seeds. You'll do fine going the older route if need be;) Just have fun with it.
I figured I would be fairly well ok with the newer seeds, but it is the older ones that I am most interested in saving. Why am I always tempted to get so many different kinds of seeds when I seldom ever plant them all????? That is just exactly the reason I have quit going into the seed swapping forum for the time being! LOL! If I get the ones planted that I now have, I will be lurking there again, that is for sure.
Hello all. I've been lurking on this post and decided to rush out and buy some hydrogen peroxide to soak my seeds in. The trouble is that I don't want to do loads of the mixture as in gallons - just a pint would do. The hydrogen peroxide I have bought is 6%. My other half worked it out to be about half a teaspoon per pint. Please can you tell me if this is correct? I'm very excited about this!
Prudence sorry I didn't notice your post sooner. Your husbands calculations sound pretty good. The hydrogen peroxide I have been using is only 3.5% so I am curious about where you found the 6%?
I am hoping that JLD will notice this and respond, since I know he is a lot more of an expert on this than I am.
I was using a whole pint bottle to a gallon of h2o which I think was stronger than I needed to make it and I have cut that down according to the posts by JLD.
The ones I did with that mixture were so fine, so don't get too concerned about measurements with the peroxide.
Good luck and let us know how you do.
6% is an odd dilution, I've never heard of that before.
AKnapp Thanks for the compliment but I think your the 1 teaching me now. I never tried it nearly as strong as you have and your results sound incredible. I found a dilution that seemed to work fine w/ me and other friends so we stuck with it. Heck, you took the ball and ran w/ it;). Your the 1 who told me to use it on seeds and BAM! It seems to have worked out great. I do have 1 full tray of Datura and brugmansia hybrids that it isn't working well with but there are so many variables when growing unknown hybrids. On the ot6her hand...My wife brought a big clump of "Goldenrod" thursaday evening and hasn't gotten around to planting it yet. I mixed up the samesolution we've been soaking seeds in and stuck the dirty rootball in it and you can't even tell it's been pulled up! Not 1 wilty leaf or anything and its standing in the superthrive/maxicrop,peroxide mix. I'm learning so much from this expirament too.
So what has been the highest concentrate you've used to this point and how well is it going? I'm still using 2 large tablespoons per gallon and everybody is loving it.
I tested my soil this week and found my nitrogen and potash levels were almost unmeasurable! So I bought some bonemeal and muriate of potash and am mixing it in the soil accordingly. I've never ammended soil like this before planting. Man I sure hope I haven't created a mix that will burn everyone out of the ground! LOL I'll keep ya'll posted there too.
Thanks and keep it growin
Hi Aknapp - Just to let you know that I bought the hydrogen peroxide 6% in the local pharmacy. I have soaked some seeds in it and 'denoed' them. These were seeds I wasn't having much luck with that had fairly hard seedcoats. I'll let you know how it goes.
The 10% mix I was using came from the daylily post by "notmartha" which is where I had originally gotten the idea that the peroxide was such a "good thing".
I was so impressed with the results from that thread that I decided it must be good for more than just daylilies, and gave it a try for a few seeds.
You and your friends are much more technical and better at keeping track of your results!!!!! (I have about 100 sheets of odds and ends of unorganized notes that I keep thinking I will put into some kind of order)
The last seeds I soaked I used only a few drops in the h2o and had just as good as results as when I was making it stronger, so I don't think it makes a great deal of difference in the seed soaking area. (I just won't have to buy as much peroxide now)
I still have not been out of town to get the other two items and am hoping maybe to venture out this week. I have been so busy just being "outside" since the weather got decent here, that I have managed to avoid leaving the house except for a trip to the grocery store.
I have been working digging out a bed that is about 25' by 30' in preparation for changing it into an above ground bed, so I have pots from one end of the house to the other. (I was amazed how much stuff was in there) The new are will be slightly larger (still working on the plans) and will provide a home for the new rose bushes that I ordered from the Wayside sale that will be here shortly. (I discovered last year that for some reason that area is "perfect" for roses and that every bush I put in there bloomed twice as much as as the ones that were located in other beds) So have decided to make it a rose garden and am really excited about how incredible I think it will look.
I have rambled on a lot more than intended hope I have not bored you!
Thank you again for the very nice compliments! You are too kind!
I finally took some time to sort out about 50 babies that I had killed by moving outside too soon it was too depressing looking at the empty cells and I had just been putting off doing it. Decided it was time to quit kicking myself in the other end for the mistake and get on with some other things!
I am curious if you soak all of your seeds including the ones that are really small and if so how do you get them out after soaking? I have some really really tiny stuff that I am having a lot of trouble germinating and have been tempted to try soaking and haven't been bright enough to figure out how I was going to get them into the soil after soaking? (Maybe just dump them in water mixture and all and let the water run through) just came up with that idea as I was typing the question)
Hi Aknapp and all, I've been reading these threads on propagation with peroxide with interest- you can now find some reference in many forums! Generally, I also don't soak tiny seeds cause it is a hassle to get them out - what about planting them and soaking the soil with the solution?
What has made it just a bit easier for me is spreading the seeds out on double thickness paper towel (on a dish, platter, etc), cover seeds with more paper towel, saturate/dampen the towels, put in a plastic bag or just cover with plastic wrap. When ready to plant, I uncover and plant very gently with tweezers ... as I said, just a bit easier then soaking in a jar.
This thread has been tremendously educational for me and saved my Hoya which was wilting - I think I overwatered it and it had root rot :( So, you folks gave me the idea to flush it with H2O2, the soil heaved up and in a few hours the leaves perked up and the next day regained its shine!!!
Question: Where do you get your H2O2? My Rx has 3% but I've been told it may contain impurities or addivites and I should use a 'food' quality solution??? Also, 3% won't go too far in the garden ... I'm gonna try this everywhere!
This method has proven invaluble this year. I have used the H2O2/H2O solution to soak the seeds, placed them in zip lock baggies wrapped in layers of paper towels soaked with more of the sloution.
I have had incredible high germination percetages.
Here's a sample:
Hibiscus sprouts 66 of 72 seeds sprouted
We have several hardy hibiscus and my favorite red never seeded. My wife bought a TINY seedling 2 yrs ago of the same color and these seeded bigtime! I think our germ rate is 99%. I'm not sure how many seeds she has in each site but each site is full. I wished I knew why our 1st 1 never seeded or why the small 1's seeded.
Rikerbear, what color are your seedlings? Is it normal for those to seed? My wife thinks the red 1 that did seed was a fluke and she thinks they aren't supposed to seed and probably won't again. I'm optimistic. We have white, pink, amd white 1's w/ a pink throat. The pink 1's have never seeded either.All the others seed like made. You'd think the oldest and most established plants would seed, that sure wasn't the case here sadly.
I inherited a bunch of different datura's to go w/ mt white moon flower. The seeds from mine are 99% germinated but the others are more like 25% sadly. I'm going to try soaking the last of them now and see what happens. Time to double up on the H202 and see what happens;)
JD: these seeds were sent me in a round robin...the tag said single white/single pink.
Is your pink one that won't seed a single or a double flower?
I have read that most doubles are sterile. Have no clue on your red, other tha to suggest that mabye it's a more tropical variety and needs a longer growing season to seed.
Just a guess mind you.
My red's are the single flowers that are dinner plate sized. I'm just happy 1 of them is seeding. these darn hybrids are such a trip. I feel like Forest Gump and my flowers are his box of chocolates!LMAO Hopefully I'll find a few hybrid seeds in this bunch. I'll keep ya'll posted;)
I am wondering if the 6% peroxide is actually 6 'volume'?
Also, this is very exciting news for me as I have trouble getting morning glory seeds to sprout- what is the thought on whether it is necessary to nick them if one is going to do the peroxide soak?
rikerbear- I think doubles are sterile to the extent that some will have had their reproductive parts changed to petals or petaloids, and there may be little or no pollen. Some Japanese morning glories, doubles, have this problem, and the only way to grow these "demono" forms is by saving seeds from the single parents or siblings.
John - I'm new at this - I put all my morning glory seed in a 2/5 solution and I've been planting quite a few already. Some sprouted in 2 days. So far, sprouted are Pres. Tyler, purple, magenta and Japanese. The only one that none has sprouted is Mini Sky Blue. They have been in the sol. 9 days. The MiniSB is still very hard so I think I'll nick them in the am and see if that gets them started. :) P.S.all these seeds came from DG members!!
I would like to know if this method works for seeds requiring stratification or other specialized techniques for germination. Examples: Trillium from seed, Gas Plant etc. 2 types of which I am having very low success rates. Any information would be helpful.
You know the whole stratification thing has baffled me for years. I've read that many of my seeds needed it in order to be viable and yet they still germed w/o it. I'm glad you brought this up as I too am having troubles with a few species seeds. My answer to that Q is yes and no. I've skiped that step so many times, i had totally forgotten about it until you brought it back up. I wonder how we've been able to skip that step w/ some and not others? I used to freeze almost all annuals that tended to reseed themselves. This spring I noticed tons of Datura's popping up outdoors where the parents were last year, those seeds were exposed to some serious freezing over winter. I brought several of the same seeds in last fall and they are thriving in seed flats aswell. So I don't know what to tell you and I don't know what to think now that you mentioned it. I'll research it if you will too and let's share results. I'm going to compare germination rates with several other plants that I'm growing in flats and arte also self seeded outdoor's. I have cleome's, cosmos, clematis, pigmy impatients, datura's and others I'm sure that I can test.
We will soon see.
I too have a few seeds I think I'll nick too. Since they don't seem to be doing worth a darn anyhow, what have I got to loose? I know my Passion flowers have rock hard seed coats, I even took a file and emory cloth to them and never did dent them. They have germ times from 1 week to 1 year. I'll try nicking a few of these stubborn datura's and maybe a few Brugs.
This will be interesting.
It would be worthwhile learning if a peroxide soak could take the place of a cold treatment for seeds requiring stratification. Perhaps it works to break down the same germination barriers.
I now start almost everything using the winter-sowing technique- it all goes into pots on the cold porch around January, and germination usually commences around April. This is very successful with daylilies and pardancanda in particular. It save so much room in the house under lights, and the plants are already hardened off!
Yes, that's what I thought I remembered, volume is different than percentage. So, 6% peroxide equals 20 volume. This is the strength used to color hair, much stronger than the 3% used for cuts and so on.
Okay, hair peroxide also comes in 40 volume...maybe for those stubborn seeds?
I am going to try some morning glories in the 3% from the bathroom. Will let you know how they do!
Hey friends. I have yet another awesome H202 success story.
I don't know if I told you all how I'd use this solution for water logged plants or plants suffering from root rot...Well the weather here has been cold and rainy w/ no sun for almost a full week. Today I found my P. Edulis all droopy and limp from no sun and way too much water. Well I pulled the saucer out from underneath the pot and took a glass of water w/ about 2 tsp.'s of 3.5% H202 and poured the mix through the pot and allowed it to drain. I came back out maybe 15 minutes later to find the same plant standing at attention as if it hadn't had any problems at all. My wife still is in aww.LOL I knew it was a lack of oxygen due to it sitting in a saucer full of water and the soil was dripping wet. BAM! Yet another use for H202. I knew it work but I had no idea it would work so fast;)
Does anyone know what the 97% or so inactive ingredients are in H2O2? Just curious. Is it distilled water???
I've been reading this thread and have tried it on seed starting.
BTW, does anyone know how long it should take for lima bean seed to germinate in the H2O2 solution? Mine are sorta just sitting there getting bloated. I'm also trying okra seed.
The above are in a glass. Am I supposed to be covering them with plastic wrap or something, or just leaving them open?
I also am trying someone's idea of soaking the paper towels in the solution, squeezing them out until just damp, and placing seeds, folding in half, and putting all flat into a plastic ziplock bag. These are zinnias and blue flax, and are starting to germinate.
Hi Judith - I start my seeds in paper towels soaked in the solution. But, I don't squeeze them out, I add a little more solution once folded, hold it up to let some of the solution drip off and then put the soppy towel into a plastic bag. Let us know how they do with less moisture.
I've also been wondering about the inactive ingredients in the 3% H2O2 purchased from the local store, have been told it may contain additives or preservatives that aren't good for the seeds, and that I should be use a 'food' quality solution. Has anyone found a pure and more concentrated H2O2? Do you get it off the internet?
Judith, if your bean seed is bloated, I love that term, they are ready to plant. I generally just soak mine for a couple of hours and then plant. Within about 10 days or less, especially with green beans, they are up.
Thanks, Brugie! "Bloated" is my DH's description of them. He's laughing all the way through my seed starting experiment.
The paper towel seeds are starting to sprout.
I wondered if the other 97% of the solution was just mostly distilled water, so we are actually further diluting the 3% H2O2. If so, it doesn't matter much what percentage the H2O2 is in the bottle, unless is was, say, 30-50%????
This whole thread has helped me a lot, being accustomed as I am to a germination rate for me of ~0-3%. LOL Never was very successful in getting seeds started! I actually have plants growing!!!!! WOW!!!
JudithI, I had good luck sprouting Vermont Cranberry beans in this solution so I think it should also work with limas.
I also tried it with marigold seeds (no germination after 7 days) and with cucumber seeds (no germination after 7 days), just got 'bloated' as you said. The marigold seeds didn't seem to absorb any of the solution, just floated on the top.
Judith, I think the dilution is important, even if the H202 is 97% water (as I believe it is), a 1 : 10 solution would reduce the solution from 3% to only .3% (if math is correct). Or, 6% would be reduced to .6%.
LOL Pardancanda, I realize that technically there is a difference.
My point was, since I'm not all that exact in my measurements (OK, that's about a teaspoonful in the glass, now add "some" water, hmmm).
I know most people are more particular about measurements, but I measure like I do when cooking, dash of this, smattering of that. Just learned about what a teaspoon, or whatever, looks like in a straight glass over the years.
It sounds like numerous solution strengths have been used in our experiments. I know it's not the scientific method, I was just wondering about the significance of the difference when 94% or 97% is already water. Just kidding a bit! : )
Good point, Judith... I am a bit obsessive compulsive with measurements myself. Thinking about the math involved would give me a headache. Will be trying this soon as I have a moment to set up the experiment, and organize all my measuring devices according to size... ;-) John
Had to bring this thread back to life and report my success. Wish I could post pics- but I'm still learning how. I did the water/H2O2 mix with my sunflower seeds and the germination was so fun to watch. I got really excited about seeing them all sprout in the wide mouth jar I had them in. Since I did so many seeds, (started with 500) I did change the water out every few days and put in fresh. I could always see the air bubbles attached to the little seeds and it was fun. This was my first attmept at growing from seed, so I can't compare it to any previous experience. I now have 50+ sunflowers growing in a single bed !! The remaining 450 didn't make it due to lack of small pots to put them in! Still waiting for the blooms, since I started a little late. I'm thinking they will be great fall cutting flowers since that's about the time they will bloom. I'll know to start earlier next year. Just wanted to share- oh and my marigold seeds all rotted, so this methed is not for all types of seeds. :)
I'm sorry but I don't know the type- I bought the seed on Ebay because I liked the picture of the flower. I used plain old tap water. with peroxide. At first I was pretty meticulus about the ratios, and then after a few days, I started to just guestimate the approximate amounts and still came out fine. I have a friend who can teach me how to load pics online and will post when them bloom. They are rigth under 3 feet right now and still no blooms in sight.
I couldn't see the H202 having anything to do with the marigold seeds since 1 of my main reasons for using H202 is that it can prevent any and all rotting when mixed properly. I would think you needed a tad more peroxide if it was rot that took your seeds. Rot is almost always due to a lack of oxygen. When oxygen levels get low, your good bacteria(aerobic bacteria) die off and then the stinky anerobic bacteria take over fast and that is the odor you find in anything that has gone stagnant. If your willing to try it again, I'd use more peroxide since the whole reason for using it is to "infuse" your water or other solutions with much higher levels of saturated O2. That's the only reason I began using H202, to kill off rootrot. Maybe try to not soak softer seeds nearly as long as hard seeds too imo. That's probably my 1st reason for soaking any seeds even before using peroxide, to soften up the seed case and infuse the seed shell with extra hormornes, vitamins and trace elements. It increases my germination rate several fold and speeds up the time it takes for seeds to germinate. Good luck!
ahhhhhhhhhhh! Hey there again! Well, I must admit I used lots of seeds in that jar- Also, I think it was pointless to put a lid on the jar... I mean if I wanted to keep "things" out, I could of just lightly placed the lid on the jar. So, that could have contributed to it going anerobic as well. I'm going to be starting lots of seed this upcoming growing season,. so I look forward to doing this again. My sunflowers are just about to bloom and have loads of buds on them :)
Oh yes, my pics... Well, the sunflowers grew tall and then we had a huge storm come and pummel them to the ground and they were growing sideways. Not exactly picture worthy, so I didn't, but the seeds still came out right... but not he marigolds. I think this works for certain seeds better than others. Also, another thought I had recently, was if you are growing your seeds in a germinating tray, why not use this mixture to spray your seeds? I haven't tried it yet, but thought it may a good idea- to blend tried and true with new. ??
I went to an Orchid farm not far from my work. The owner there was very nice enough to let me watch him propagate his orchid from seeds. After goingt through to sort out the moldy black specks from oridinary paper sheet, into an envelope. Then, he soak all his orchid seeds in Hydrogen Perixide for 15 minutes before pouring them into the nutrient agar. He didn't mixed them in water or distilled water, he just pour the hydrogen perioxide into a small clear plastic container (camera film or prescription medicine containers).
He said it kills any fungus/bacteria in the "good" seeds before pouring them into the nutrient agar.
No, I didn't see him prep the agar. He had a bunch ready to go when he show me the steps, however, I did know where he buys his chemicals. He uses 4 or 5 different kinds of chemicals and their strengths. He purchased his chemicals from PhytoTechnology Laboratories, LLC, PO Box 13481, Shawnee Mission, KS, 66282. www.phytotechlab.com
Looking thru his book from the above company, I found the seed sowing kit order number, I'm sure he just buys the chemicals after he knew what he was doing.
Just found this thread, I can not believe what we can do with peroxide, Superthrive,Maxicrop! Talk about Mad Sience, I am going to try my Mountain Laurels seeds, they are very hard. Been trying to get them to sprout for over a year. I will let you know! Since it is DEC. do i have to wait til spring? Thanks, Krispi
One of the first days I was on this site, I too read notmartha's post about how to start daylily seeds. Being a seed snatcher, I tried this with some misc. daylily seeds I had.. It's been about 2 weeks and I see the first root!!! Needless to say, all the cabinets are now full of jars hiding in the dark. :)
I also tried the mix by soaking a paper towel in a ziplock baggie.. I put it in the middle of the stove by the pilot light, (since I don't have a warming mat yet) I have seeds (Mimosa pudica) in pots that were there 2 weeks before I tried the ones in paper towels on the stove with no sign of life, after 10 days in the papertowel on the stove, I have roots!!
NatureWalker sent me over here - this thread is a huge help - thank you - we have about 4 sq. ft. on a table in the kitchen to dine upon - guess what's taking up the rest of the space over, around and beneath that table? And it's only 12/7/05 - LOL. Thanks to you folks, am feeling quite empowered now to deal with fungus and space issues when starting new seedlings -
NatureWalker, by mentioning the use of gibberellic acid as a germinating aid, I did not mean to suggest it as a substitute for any method that already works fine. But, if there are any seeds that don't respond to the above techniques, then this might be a possibility.
So, if anyone has hit that wall, Norman C. Deno has written the book Seed Germination Theory and Practice that incorporates a lot of research and explicit directions for using gibberellic acid (and other techniques) on thousands of different kinds of seeds. A source of supplies is: http://www.jlhudsonseeds.net/GibberellicAcid.htm
As of 1994, Prof. Deno could be contacted at:
139 Lenor Drive, State College PA 16801, USA
His book might still be obtainable from the University State Pennsylvania
I haven't tried the gibberellic acid yet, but am certainly going to add everything in this thread to my germinating arsenal first.
I buy 35% H202 from our local health food store for $21.99 a pint. They also have the medicine bottle w/dropper to dispense it. For internal comsumption, it should only be mixed with distilled water. If you go to google, type in 'food grade hydrogen peroxide', about 250,000 sites come up. There is a lot of information about it's many uses and sources for purchase.
Yes, it is dangerous if not handled carefully. It will turn the fingers white where it touches and will sting or burn. I am using 7 drops in a glass of drinking water every week or so and also use an equivalent to 3% dilution in my CPAP hydrator. There is a doctor here who gives the H202 IV treatments but I've never decided to do that.
We've had a taste of your northern cold weather down here in Texas for the last two weeks!!!! Down to freezing each night.
LOLOL with the taste of our cool weather. I don't think we've even had a daytime hi temp above freezing for the last week or so. Its in or below the teens every night now and we hate it. The darn snow won't even begin to melt.
I sure miss living in the Red River Valley and all the mild weather that comes with winter there. I don't think it really matters where one lives as there is always some kind of weather problem that occurs now and then.
I was in Kansas City six years ago. My husband had liver cancer and was operated on at the University Hospital. It had spread too far to correct. The day we left the city, it had begun to snow. So we left at 6 a.m. in the morning to get down the road toward Texas before things got too bad. He only lived three weeks after that. Sometimes it seems like yesterday and then some days it seems forever ago.
He always planted a large vegetable garden and would have had all kinds of greens ready to eat by now.
Merry Christmas and Happy 2006,
So sorry for your loss Louise. Maybe not good memories of Kansas.
But JDL, we haven't had temps above 16 for the last 3 or 4 weeks. It was 1 degree last night and all previous nights. We got 2 inches of snow a month ago but there has not been a cloud in the sky since. Normally January and February are our cold months. Winter doesn't start until the 21st of this month. Isn't that Wednesday?
Hold on to your hats guys, the storm is moving in this afternoon at 4 0 'Clock It is suppose to snow for the next several days. Yup, woke up to clouds this morning.
Wow!!!! There must be plenty of nice things about living in Washington for you to tolerate that kind of weather. About all I really remember from the news and geography (years ago) would be Mt. St. Helens and apples. How long is your outdoor gardening season? Do you have many houseplants?
It snowed here in Texas today but it melted before hitting the ground.
Hi all, this idea seems to have been around for a while but I've only just came across it here on DG. Here's a link showing many different uses for H202. To find the seed information scroll down a bit.
Thats interesting info.. here it all is for ease of reading:
Sprouting seeds: Add 1 oz. of 3% food grade hydrogen peroxide to 1 pint of water and soak the seeds overnight. Add the same amount of H202 each time the seeds are rinsed.
IN THE GARDEN:
Foliar Feed: For crops, put 16 ozs. of 35% food grade hydrogen peroxide into 20 gallons of water. This is sufficient for one acre. Spray on plants early in the morning.
Seed Germination: To germinate seeds put 1 to 5 ozs. of 3% hydrogen peroxide into a pint of distilled water. Soak the seeds for 8 hours. Excellent results have been reported on older seeds as well as fresh.
Insecticide: Mix 8 ozs. or more of 3% H202 to a gallon of water with 8 ozs. of molasses or white sugar (molasses seems to adhere to the plant better).
House & Garden Plants: Put 1 oz. of 3% H202 into a quart of water (or add 16 drops 35% to 1 quart water). Water or mist plants with this solution.
Orchards: Water ground around the trees using 6-8 ozs. of 3% food grade hydrogen peroxide to a gallon of water, and also use it as a foliar spray.
To make a 3% H202 solution, take one (1) ounce of 35% food grade hydrogen peroxide and mix with 11 ounces of water, preferably distilled water, to obtain 12 ounces of 3% H202.
1 Pint 35% food grade hydrogen peroxide makes 1.5 gallons of 3% H2O2 solution.
1 Quart 35% food grade hydrogen peroxide makes 3 gallons of 3% H2O2 solution.
1 Gallon 35% food grade hydrogen peroxide makes 12 gallons of 3% H202 solution.
GRADES OF HYDROGEN PEROXIDE:
3% Hydrogen Peroxide (Drug/Grocery Store Variety) Used as antimicrobial agent for treating wounds and sanitizing agent [Made from 50% Super D Peroxide, Diluted. Contains stabilizers - phenol, acetanilide, sodium stanate, tetrasodium phosphate among them.] [This peroxide contains known chemicals do not ingest!]
6% Hydrogen Peroxide Used by Beauticians for Coloring Hair. Used as sanitizing agent. Comes in strengths labeled 10,20,40 volume. Must have activator added to be used as a bleach. [Contains stabilizers, additives, and impurities dependent on manufacturing and dilution process. Do not ingest.]
30% Re-Agent Hydrogen Peroxide Used in medical research. [Contains stabilizers, additives, and impurities dependent on manufacturing and dilution process. Do not ingest.]
30-32% Electronic Grade Hydrogen Peroxide Used for washing transistors and integrated chip parts before assembly. [Contains stabilizers, additives, and impurities dependent on manufacturing and dilution process. Do not ingest.]
35% Food Grade Hydrogen Peroxide (Also 50% Food Grade H2O2) Used in food products like cheese, eggs, whey products. Also used to spray inside of foil lined containers for food storage - known as the aseptic packaging system. Used for the disinfection of potable water. Also used (diluted) to disinfect, kill bacteria, sanitize wounds and introduce oxygen into the body. Eg. bathing, gargle, toothpaste, treat drinking water, etc. [Contains stabilizers, additives, and impurities dependent on manufacturing and dilution process.]
35% Technical Grade Hydrogen Peroxide Used for waste water treatment and the disinfection of potable water, cosmetics, and laundry applications. Also used (diluted) to disinfect, kill bacteria, sanitize wounds and introduce oxygen into the body. Eg. bathing, gargle, toothpaste, treat drinking water, etc. [May contain a small amount of phosphorus to neutralize any chlorine in the water it is combined with.]
35% Standard Grade Hydrogen Peroxide (Also 50%, 60%, 70% Standard Grades) Used mainly for bleaching in the pulp and paper industry and in the textile industry; oxidation reactions in the chemical industry; environmental processes (detoxification and deodorization). Used for Waste water treatment. [Contains stabilizers, additives, and impurities Do not ingest.]
90% Hydrogen Peroxide Used by the military as a source of Oxygen at Cape Canaveral. Used as a propulsion source in rocket fuel.
99.6% Hydrogen Peroxide This was first made in 1954 as an experiment to see how pure a hydrogen peroxide could be manufactured.
WARNING: This product is a VERY strong oxidizer and will temporarily turn skin white on contact. NEVER use 35% food grade Hydrogen Peroxide without diluting it first. Read First Aid precautions on label before using. Storage: Keep out of flourescent light. Store in a cool dark place.
In the Houston area Superthrive is available at HD, Lowe's & Walmart-
also at vrious nurseries but the cheapest is Walmart and Lowe's- $700 & change for 4 oz bottle.
I find the shelves are not labled to include superthrive, it's always in the outdoor fertilizer section at the stores- if you can't find it you can ask the store manager why they don't carry it and if they plan too- most of the time if one store carries it others do also, but I have found that you can't ge good help these days- most of the employees in the garden section @ these chains can't tell a mum from an orchid- hope this helps.
WOW just found this thread and what help for a newbie! I've never planted anything from seed so am trying it this year. I live in zone 6b and I'm not sure when to plant them outside after they sprout. It says my growing season is 207 days and frost dates are 4/16 in spring and 10/14 in fall. Do I keep them inside until after 4/16? I've tried to research this here but there are so many different opinions. One site says to plant everything outside in mini greenhouses:
Winter Sowing is done outdoors during Winter using mini-greenhouses made from recyclables; there are no heating devices, no energy-wasting light set-ups or expensive seed starting devices. This is from www.wintersown.org
Others say keep inside, keep some warm and other cool.
I'm very confused, any help would be greatly appreciated!
April, I'm glad to hear it. I've been wanting to get some and thought that ordering it was my only option. I asked for it at a top notch garden center chain in Atlanta and they guy was very puzzled. Glad to see it's more readily available.
One thing I have tried is Messenger and I can not say enough good things about it. I had these little baby mums and I sprayed messenger on them and they just exploded! I'm serious. They went from about looking dead and punny, to these huge vibrant over 1.5 foot across amazing plants. http://davesgarden.com/forums/t/451274/
Carolyn, pick up a book or two about starting seed from the library and read up as much as you can. This is my second year and I'm still doing lots and lots of asking, reading books and of course being on Daves.
The entire reason for starting indoors is that you will extend your growing season. For example tomatoes started indoors and later taken out, will be larger plants and bear fruit sooner and longer than those left outside to germintate when the weather heats up and the soil is warm enough. All those plants you see in the garden centers in spring are being started now in a greenhouse somewhere! :) Also, if your starting seed and planting flowers, you have a ready made garden instead of waiting when your area passes the last frost date. If you do start seed indoors there is a process and you should learn about before you do it! Here are some tips from my mistakes.. use a seed starting soiless mix and sterilize it and everything you are growing in or else it will damp off (die!). Invest in a set of lights to place your babies under or else they will be stretching for the window and you don't want that. There's lots more to know.. that's a small start :) Good Luck.
Try some of each. I always thin out over 70% of what comes up to give remaining plants space to thrive. So planting half a pkg inside in a domed flat and half outside under 2 liter bottle houses is a great option.
Get a notebook, or blog progress on each. Some things will always work best one way or another. Growing from seed does require some maintenance care. Hydrogen peroxide is your best friend and shop lights are great for fooling small plants into taking off. Good luck.
You will love Messenger. I used it and Spray n Grow last winter on a bed of white petunias. The plants got to one and a half foot balls consantly loaded with 50+ blooms. I also used it on my coleus seedlings at about six weeks and they all thrived.
A gardener needs all the help I can get and most of the things we buy will last attleast for 3 years.
Hey Sidney, How you doin'? My daughter gave me one of the clams I think you call them, of her order of Messenger last year but I never used it. I will try it this year. Thanks, hope everything is well with you.
Anyone, I have used this method to sprout some exotic asian morning glories, and...some seeds My mom collected in the mid 70's from West Africa...seeds are sprouting including the ones from Africa...I'm very excited about it as I don't know what the plants will be from Africa as my mother is no longer with us. What I don't know, is how soon after they have sprouted that you plant them?? Any particular mixture etc?
Can anyone provide me with a link for this Messenger stuff? I would greatly appreciate it.
I'm usually pretty up to date with these newer and different products but I know squat about this stuff. It sounds like 1 more product to add to my stash of other unique foliar apps.
Thanks so much and please keep the info coming;)
Thanks so much for the links! This stuff sounds pretty amazing and I can't wait to give it a try. Please let me know if you find any more info or results from the use of this product. I'm eager to hear how/what our friends here have seen and have to say about it.
I forgot to say above that I put 3 days between the Spray n Grow, and the Messenger applications.
I also use SnG's Bill's Fertilizer when I apply Spray n Grow.
I have Brugs and tomato plants buding and setting fruit. I think I'll give em a treatment this week.
Are we not even allowed to discuss private small co-op's? Having four people go in on that would mean getting 100 packs for $40, or 50 packs for $20 plus tax and shipping... that is a very sweet deal and I would certainly do it from here.
Yes, it is a huge shame that the co-op thread is dead.. I would jump all over this.
If we can't do coops here, we can/should just creat another kind of meeting place to do and duscuss these kinds of things. Sometimes pooling of funds is the only way some products are affordable to us all. I know when spidermites were thick 1 year and we couldn't get rid of them entirely until finding a product named "Avid". It works so well, it made spidermites no more of a problem than over watering practically. My point tho was this stuff cost around 200$+ for a quart and we gardener's only would need 1-2 liquid ounces of it and that lasted a few years. Babble Babble Babble...Here I go on rambling again.
I need to make a purchase of this stuff like yesterday so if anyone would like to email me and discuss doing this, please do ASAP. I saw someone above mention that just 4 people combining funds could make for a huge saving, I'm 1 of the 4 right now!;)
I haven't the foggiest idea of where to order this stuff from yet as I've been too darn busy with hospital BS and preparing for yet another 3-4 week stay sadly. I go in Feb. 1st and I need to get this messenger along with a billion other things lined up so my wife can take over while I'm away. Obviously I need to order this pronto so if a few more of you are ready, let's git-r-done;). If I don't hear from a few of you in the next couple days, I'll be doing an individual order but I don't want to. I can be reached here or my email is:
I would greatly appreciate it if someone could/would find the best place to purchase from now so we can be ready.
Meanwhile, I have some serious "wining and dining" and cramming in as many quality fancy dinner dates with my wife before I get checked in at the hospital. I need to creat as much quality time with my family as possible as fast as possible in an effort to make up for what won't be happening over the next 2 months or so.
LOL Those are my feeble excuses for not researching any of this stuff. I gotta run, I think tonight will be a romantic dinner followed with a few hours at the Casino. She just loves doing the casino thing a few times each winter and it makes for a good date;).
Wish me luck and thanks friends;)
Hi Jeannette, as I understand things, Edenbio is a retail outlet for Cornell University's Harpin protein (Messenger). It's very tightly controlled for commercial use in Washington and approved for only select crops and growers. I guess because if this they can't ship to just anybody, even though I certainly don't intend to sell my tomatoes or anything else. LOL Well, give away maybe. I can understand really, we have a huge apple industry and the state would not want Eco-purists thinking growers are messing with nature!
Well, all of the seed catalogs are selling the Messenger and they aren't saying anything in their catalogs about not sending to Washington. I haven't tried to order any to see if they would tell me no.
If they would send that why wouldn't they send the Mighty Plant Mess. Unless nobody, not any of the seed companies are selling the MPM either????
Does anyone know how much Might Plant it takes for one gallon of water?? And, does anyone know how many gallons a 'packet' makes? Can it be ordered any way but by the packet?? Thanks!!! Hey, point me to a place that will tell if, if there is one, thanks again!!
BTW, it takes me about 60 gallons to fertilize, which is why I ask.
MightyPlant™ All Purpose Plant Food
MightyPlant is the next generation of plant food for your garden. MightyPlant combines the highest quality water-soluble fertilizer components enhanced with harpin technology. MightyPlant supplies the essential nutrients hungry plants need to grow and be productive. Each packet of MightyPlant is premeasured to mix 1 gallon of plant food.
MightyPlant is much more than just a complete, healthy diet for plants…it’s a healthy diet that plants just can’t resist!
Okay, it would cost me $120 to fertilize, my green plastic buckets are two gallons. Now, that is using fertilizer on everything. Sometimes I fertilizer just the brugs with a water hose, early evening or early morning. When everything is watered, I use 60 gallons and that is a conservative fertilizing. My hubby's mom's place, my aunt's, my guesthouse and my son's house and my barn, all open to the cement pond. LOTS of lawnmowing, lots of plants, lots of work. soulgardenlove, I do have LOTZ of space, just about everyone does in our small, rural town...
You only use this stuff as a wet spray every 3 weeks on the foliage. Your regular drench type fertilizing would be the 60 gallon type. My yard is small so I really have to look for things to use a whole gallon.
Thanks to Pins2006 for telling me about this thread. I am a scientist with Eden Bioscience and am thrilled to see so much interest in the product. Here are the answers to some of the questions I saw.
Mighty Plant is different than Messenger in that it contains both a foliar fertilizer and harpin protein. Messenger does not have the fertilizer.
You are right, there is a great deal going on right now for Mighty Plant. The price we sell to "garden clubs" is even less than the price you see on line so a co-op would be even less expensive than you are thinking. The only restriction is that it must be a true garden club, and the item must be purchased in case quantities. Please feel free to send me a private DM if you want to discuss further.
Mighty Plant can't be shipped to WA because it is not labeled in WA. In other states Mighty Plant is labeled as a fertilizer. WA considers the "Messenger" portion of Mighty Plant to be a biopesticide so they wouldn't label it as a fertilizer. You can buy plain Messenger in WA because it actually is labeled as a biopesticide. I know that hardly makes sense...who can explain the regulatory agencies??!
One packet of Mighty Plant mixes one gallon of water and should spray about 400-500 ft2 foliar. You can also use it as a drench but it is not as cost effective. For Sherrilike...if you are going to mix up 60 gallons you should purchase your Mighty Plant from you local agriculture distributor such as Helena or UAP. They sell it in 25 pound bags. That is way too much for the average home gardener though (not that us DGers are average!)
Please let me know if I can help in any way.
Thank you Robin. I used it as a drench and when I started, I really thought it would go further. Way too expensive for me like that, but I do like the sound of the 25lb bags. Do you know the approx price for the bags?? And, what are the 'numbers' on Mighty Plant???
Shoot, I forgot to ask: So what do you do for thrips, Robin???
Robin, it's so great to have you jump in this thread at the perfect time before we go ordering.
I'm involved with a handful of people here and we are preparing to place a bulk order ASAP. Do you have the instructions we will need to make a purchase as a garden club? Now we are just a group of individuals from DG pooling funds for a bigger purchase, I don't think that would qualify us as an actual "Club/garden organization". Is there any way we could get around this in order to take advantage of a club discount? I would greatly appreciate any and all info you can help us with.
I have a serious timing problem and I have to get everything finalized on my end before Feb. 1st. I'm going under the blade on the 1st and will be inpatient for 1 solid month. As I understand it, I'll get an ambulance ride home at the end of that month then I'll be extremely limited to the amount of time I'll be allowed out of bed per day for another month or so.
I've been a paraplegic for 13 years now and while trying to "transfer" myself out of a boat, I slipped and came down on my tailbone hard enough to chip off a few pieces of bone. That became infected with a serious"resistant staph" infection that was cleared up after surgery 2 years ago...or so we thought. Well the infection is back so I have some bone and infected tissue that must be removed and replaced with muscle from 1 of my "cheeks" back there. I guess that is going to stretch the skin on my behind so tight that I'll have to remain flat on my back for the 1st month just for it to "take". Then I'll be allowed to get up into my wheelchair for brief periods daily in small increments of time until the skin has grown enough to allow for enough slack so I won't rip it loose/open again.
Anyhow, To make an already long story shorter...I need to get my end of this order paid for and finalized before I'm admitted. I'm very long on idea's and very short on time. I'd like to have this stuff on the way so my wife can use it while I'm down for the count. Any ideas on how I can go about getting all of this one pronto would be greatly appreciated.
Also, my initial/1st use of this product will be to help my plants rebound from some serious mite/pesticide stress. I'll probably use some maxicrop or superthrive with it to help my babies come through this ordeal.
Do you think using it in this matter would be a waste or could it help me at this point? I'm open to all input.
I'll use it much more as spring heads this way with cuttings/seedlings and then spraying the entire garden area's.
Please let me know if I'm on the right track;)
JD, you are so precious and I've really enjoyed getting to know you on the brug forum, you are always an interesting read. My broken ankle last year, was a piece of cake, compared to your surgery and I want to tell you that you really brightened my days back then and I really appreciated you taking time with the lady, old enough to be your mom. I will be thinking of you during your surgery and you will be in my prayers. Do you think someone could let us know, when you get outta surgery, and then updates on your progress??? I'm certain I'm not the only one from DG that will be interested!!!
Wow JLD you are about to go through the wringer. I hope all goes well. How thoughtful that one of your concerns through all this is your wife and gardening friends. You guys should choose someone to handle this "garden club" order. Soulgardenlove is a great choice because we have already exchanged a few DM's about doing this for her dahlia society. It is easy and I'll make sure you get the discount price. I told susan I would send her the pricing for all our products by DM so she can put the order together.
To answer your question, for sure using Messenger or Mighty Plant helps plants deal with the stress of transplanting, insects, or diseases. Mixing with superthrive, or other plant stimulants is fine. I really like Messenger and alfalfa tea.
Mighty Plant is an 18N-18P-18K, plus micronutrients (Mg, B, Cu, Fe, Mn, Mo, Zn), plus harpin protein. I am not sure of the price of the 25 pound bag because we don't sell that product directly to the consumer. It is only sold to the consumer through agricultural distributors and they set their price. But I can bet that it is considerably cheaper. I would not buy that if you don't have a HUGE yard or a commercial operation. The harpin protein is only stable for one growing season and much would go to waste if you don't have lots to treat.
I am so ready for spring that I can hardly stand it!! My gardening juices are starting to flow! Oh yea, about the thrips (thripmaster)...I used to work for the company that makes Avid and the name was coined because we were seriously wiping out some thrip on avocados in CA with that product a few years ago. Truth be told...I am a plant pathologist, not a bug person at all!
Man you guys are the best! Sweet, thoughtful and then some.
I'll be back online as soon as I get home, I'm trying to work out borrowing a laptop or the like. I have a laptop that is so old, I don't think it's work trying to get lined out in time. That thing is just a fancy boat anchor imo;). So I'm not certain about up to the day updates but you can bet this will be my 1st stop online when I do get home. I'll be getting out the monitor extension cord so I'll be able to type from bed.
You'd really think I'd be so used to all these surgeries I've been through over the last 10 years or so, over a dozen atleast. For some reason, this 1 has my guts all fluttered and brain racing. I've never felt like this in the past, I wished I could get a handle on this. I guess I'll just learn to roll with it. trying to predict everything that will need to be taken care of over the next 6 weeks+ is consuming me but I always seem to manage. I just like to be thurough so my loved one's don't have any more to stress out over. This list just keeps on growing;)
Thanks again friends and I'll keep you posted.
JD, I will be holding positive thoughts for you. I know all your friends on DG will be doing the same - that's some mighty powerful healing energy coming your way...kind of like Messenger for humans. LOL Wishing you the very best outcome possible.
thripmaster, Eden Biosience...is this affiliated with the Eden in Cornwall England?
JD, I will be sending you energy of healing as well. I've had both hips replaced, and I know what you mean about the surgeries.
Well hello Dumpster Diving Diva!! I looked at some of the pictures of aquisition..very impressed.
Please send me an email about our topic. Thanks
You Guy's are the greatest! I can not begin to thank you enough for your thoughts, prayers and positive energy flowing my way. I need it more than ever right now. When I read these posts wishing me well, I literally sigh a giant, wonderful exhale of relief and all is well for that moment. I can also put thoughts down on this page that I don't want to drop on my family, I HAVE to be the "rock" around here or my wife and daughter wouldn't be as sure/confident about this whole ordeal.
I'm sure the other Dad's/husband's around here maybe able to relate to this messed up mindset I have goin here;)
I sure am excited about getting this messenger ordered and would like to thank all the "powers" around here that have made it a reality. It's awfully cool to simply Paypal a few bucks to an email addy and only have to wait for it to arrive;)
I never did get my hands on any of those Horned Toads darnit. I'm very afraid to try and find any online since finding out they're a protected species or the like. I did however have a chat with many of the kid's that live around Lake Texoma and put a "bounty" out on the Lil critter's. It's pretty sad to hear that maybe as few of 1/2 the kids even knew what I was talking about. They must be much more rare now than I originally thought. I still have a grand plan of collecting atleast 1 pair to breed them and re-introduce as many as possible back to the wild. I've had great luck in the past breeding other reptiles like chameleon's(and those are VERY hard to breed), box turtles, king snakes and even some fish(just tropicals from the pet store). My yard backs up to a big public park with a 5+ acre lake and a lot of natural grass lands. In the 1st 10 years I lived here, I could count the number of King Snakes and Box turtles seen on my 2 hands. In the last 5 years, I see and hear the nieghborhood kid's excitedly talking about seeing/catching them as it was when I was a kid. I pray this micro habitat I started can support itself and continue to spread. Even if it doesn't, I sure had fun doing it and sharing my experience with other's. I hope I "planted seed's" in the mind's of the kid's that helped me release the critter's.
Please keep your eye's open down there in the chance you find 1 of those little dudes;)
Everyone...I apologize for "hijacking" this thread with all of my way off topic posts. If I'm taking up space or annoying anyone by taking up so much space, I'LL HAPPILY EDIT OUT THESE MARATHON OFF TOPIC POSTS with no hard feelings at all. I totally understand.
Thanks again friends, ya'all are the best the internet has to offer inna club like setting.
Jeff, you obviously need to reach out and your being heard and this is fine. I love talking and listening so your great with me.. Besides the original concept of this thread has been throughly discussed... I just hope that the "powers" your talking about don't get shut down!! :)
However, always being the gardener...is there anyone on here that germinates their seeds with the Hydrogen Peroxide and then winter sows? Like what they are doing in the winter sowing forum? I'd like to know if there is? I'm very excited about wintersowing this year. Thanks
Yes, Jeff, there is great love and support here at DG. It's always good to talk, and relate to others.
Yes..from this thread I produced my first H202 sprouts of Asian Morning Glories. I have been tracking them in my Journals under seed propagation schedule --- http://davesgarden.com/journal/ed/
The seeds sprouted at a high percentile. I followed instructions at the top of the thread. The Glories are about an inch tall- and are about to receive their first true leaves. They have been re-potted in small pots and will be planted in the garden in about a week.
This was from RikerBear further up ...if I may quote
"This method has proven invaluble this year. I have used the H2O2/H2O solution to soak the seeds, placed them in zip lock baggies wrapped in layers of paper towels soaked with more of the sloution.
I have had incredible high germination percetages"
I used the mixture Jeff wrote about here ...it's Apr. 12th I believe. It worked like a charm!
It took them about 5 days to germinate, although I must admit...I found one in a batch of seeds that were from someones garden..that did not germinate..but I still potted the seeds.. It sprouted today..so that's a good 20 days for that particular seed batch. See my impatient self was re-using the soile when I noticed the little guy sprouting.
Here is a picture of the seeds. I will be posting a current picture of them in my journal tomorrow.
Yes I was happy with it too. Be careful, as the roots grow at quite a rapid pace. They were digging into the paper towels rather nicely. I am going to try an experiment and cut around the roots leaving them lodged in the paper towel. They may still get nutrients from the superthrive that way. Plus it doesn't mess with the roots.
I want you all to know that I got a 4 oz bottle of Superthrive at Walmart for $7 something . I have been paying $9 at other places including HD and the local hydroponic store for a 2 oz bottle.
A lot of people have a problem dealing with Walmart, but that is their problem. I am not going to get into an argument on the pros and cons of that situation. Just letting you all know if you are interested.
I have had real good results on a variety of seeds using the method you guys are talking about with the paper towels in the baggies. About the only ones I didn't were very small and also the flat papery type seeds. Can't think of what they were right now but they got real sticky.
I called wal-mart and no go. I just called superthrive to see where it is in our area and she gave me one retailer that carries it They buy direct from them and after lots of questions :)she also gave me the number to the large distributor that buys it one state over. Their number is 1-800-441-8482 (Superthrive) to locate it in your area.
JR, this is very exciting!! I am so glad to hear that you germinate first and then you pot up and put them in an outdoor covered condition? Are you wintersowing or cold frame or greenhouse? I was just afraid that I would be germinating inside and then wanting to indroduce them to the potted WS method outdoors and they wouldn't go for it... i especially want ot get started with hollyhocks, since I have so many seeds and they need a longer growing time from what I hear. I didn't know if I had to wintersow completely as directed and put the seeds in the pots and let them start there as well. I will be reading your entire journal to see what you've been up to. Thanks so much for sharing.. it is very helpful ! :)
I'm such a nut-- I go to bed thinking about how wintersowing is going to make my garden so incredible and I was in a exercise class this morning and I was distracted thinking about where all my plants will go.. what I will start... how I'm going to do this in that garden and that flower in that garden. Winter use to be a sad time for me since there were no blooms and everything seemed so drab.. Not anymore! It's the much needed downtime for the orchestration of the symphony!! (And I discovered camelias!!)
I've been using H202 for everything from seed soaking to help revive plants with rootrot or other over watering conditions for several years now. I used it in some hydroponics systems too.
It's great for increasing gemination rates and allows you to soak seeds much longer with out the soak solution going stagnant.
Many times in late fall when many plants are brought indoors for the winter they end up getting over watered as they no longer need a fraction of water as they did outside. Usually all you can do for such plant's is to let them dry out so the rotting parts are no longer wet enough to rot further. But by allowing them to dry out, the plant's end up suffering from lack of water. By mixing in as much a 25% H2O2(sometimes more) with 75% water and watering with this mixture, it kills the bacteria that causes the root rot. I've found it impossible to overwater plant's when using this mixture. The roots can literally be standing in this mix and be able to absorb more oxygen from the H202 than they can when dried or drying out.
Miracle Grow used to make a product called "Liquid Oxygen" and it was nothing more than H202 and a little fertil;izer. Ironite liquid plant food also contains H202. It is such a simple and forgiving way to help plants and seeds get more oxygen. I also use it alot over winter so I can allow more liquid to sit in the trays under my plant's which buys me more time between waterings.
I just can't say enough for this stuff. BTW, I always use 3.5% strength peroxide you can find at any store.
Give it a try, you won't regret it;)
Yes,...thanks Jeanette for giving me the H202 thread..as I was able to save my 12 foot potted Papaya tree, the mother to all my other trees. She would have died this winter from root rot if I did not do the H202 treatment. This is a picture of her through the kitchen window. Having a potted papaya bearing fruit is a very rare thing- they do not do well in pots past 6 feet.
I am going to use the H202 baggie method to sprout papayas, heralds trumpet, pea vines, more morning glories, hibiscus -- and for the H202 of it, I will try some Holly Hocks -- (and report to Susan :)
I will document with pictures like I have the morning glories for those interested in the progression.
Speaking of which...Those of you who are interested, I have compiled a list of links concerning H202, including the ones Robin just listed. I have also linked H202 threads. Please feel free to visit, and if you would like to contribute more information - I will be happy to add them. Listed under my Journal in the category Off the Shelf Garden tips H202/Aspirin and..?
or direct link
Does anyone know where I can buy food grade H202? 30%-50% would be great to have around for so many uses. I have a friend in British Columbia who buys it over the counter as bleach. I called a few agricultural places today with no luck.
JD, I bought mine from Garden of Eden, addy below. Really irked me that I had to spend so much for something I should be able to buy locally, but that's the breaks. I've had mine a year, used very little and it is still as fresh as the day it arrived. Good luck!!!!!
Enjoyed reading your journel, RJ. Thank you for the reminder about starting seeds in baggies. Have never started seeds this way. I do use Hydrogen Peroxide when I water my plants and also in my seed starting mix. It seems to work great for me and alot cheaper than Damp Off.
Thankyou! I have just started using the baggies myself. I am also starting to use the H202 with regular watering. It was very difficult to get accross the mental barrier - It was like thinking about pouring alcohol to me. I am glad you mention the h202 in the seed starter kit,...because. I bought one yesterday with the intention of using the H202 plus superthrive formula with it. The possibilities...yeah!
Jnette, I got it at an small local bonsai grower who was originally from California and he used it there and loved it. i got a small bottle for around $7-8. Of course I told him all about messenger.. I'm just a messenger spokesperson!! You can send a check to the Superthrive maker and they will send it to you if you can't find it locally.
I watered my poor garaged tropicals and they really perked up!! I know that water alone would have done them some good, but they just look great after using the superthrive.
Yes Susan, Superthrive is a great help. If you got it for $7 - $8 you must have gotten the 4 oz bottle. For some crazy reason the people that are selling the 2 oz bottle are charging $9. Think they read something backwards. Maybe Dyslexia. LOL
I can't say enough good about Superthrive and 1 other product I use along with it called "Maxicrop" which is a liquified seaweed + some other goodies. The 2 combined work miracles imo, I use them mixed with H202 aswell. Those products make my rooting/cuttings a great success which in turn has my friends and nieghbor's thinking I'm some sort of botanical genious!LOL
Why thanks for asking about my well being. I'm doing as good as can be expected I reckon. My surgery date was changed to 2-8-06 and I've been administering IV Vancomyacin(antibiotics) twice daily for the last 2-3 weeks. I'm really happy that they were able to arrange for home administering this time. Last go around, I spent 2-3 weeks just sitting in a hospital bed so I could get the same antibiotic treatments.
I've made a huge list of things I need to get done in an effort to prepare for a 3-4 week hospital stay, it's hard to try to figure out such a list. I need to get as much done as possible to lesson the burden on my wife and daughter while I'm laid up. Hopefully this will make life a little less stressful for them and they won't feel guilty for working at home when they think they should be visiting me. There is just so much to try to get done and the days pass so quickly.
I'm also struggling to keep all the beneficial bacteria that reside in our bodies alive and working properly. This antibiotic I'm on is 1 of the 3 strongest known and just kills everything it gets to, good and bad. That makes things "interesting" for a lack of better words. Somehow it makes conditions prime for varying kinds of yeast infections that pop up in the oddest places. It's just gross but something I need to keep in mind and try to get ahead of.
There are many more little tidbits of info I'll leave out for now;)
I'm trying to figure out a way to have computer access while I'm in the hospital. My mother in law has a really cool laptop I'm going to borrow and hopefully I'll be able to connect to the hospitals wireless connections. I can't imagine life with out the internet these days! LOL 10 some years ago, I couldn't imagine having/wanting or needing a PC for anything. Irony is a very funny thing;)
That's all for now, thanks again for asking;)
I'll keep you posted,
JD, know what you mean about the yeast infections. The first time I faced that problem in the hospital I refused to leave the hospital until they got that cleared up because I didn't go in there with it. The surgeon was mad because he wanted to make a big splash by getting me out of there in 3 days since hip replacements at that time had to stay 5 days. So he didn't bother sending a Gyn around to see me for 3 days.
Guess he showed me. LOL
You certainly have more patience than I would. And it is nice that you can do that treatment at home. Anything at all instead of going to the hospital. Have you talked to the hospital or the dr. about getting a hookup for the laptop?
Hugs JLD!! Thinking of you and yours!! I just got to read this, hope your surgery goes well. My bro was in hospital (Cancer of blood - modern technology!) and rented a laptop for the month. Shouldn't be a prob, but suggest you talk to your hosp/dr before you go to make sure they have ability to do. ~ Suzi :)
I'm a bit of a mess, very tired and soreBUT I'm alive. I just thought I'd test this connection and say hello.
Please keep me in your thoughts and prayers as I have a long road in front of me.
I will continue to send lots of light and positive energy your way. I am so impressed by your courage and your consideration of others despite all you have to go through. May your healing process exceed all your expectations. (((JLD)))
LOLOL Katy...I always get a lil chuckle when people forget or don't realize I'm a paraplegic;). I haven't done much walking in 13 some years:).
it's going to be a minimum of 2-3 weeks before I'll be allowed to sit upright or the sutures would tear out. This darn infection ate away enough tissue that the doc had to stretch over more skin and muscle to fill/cover it up. I'll have to let it heal and then begin stretching it to size very very slowly. What a drag huh? I wished they could put me inna coma for a few weeks then get up go.lol no such luck.
Well I'm gonna try to get some sleep.
You guy's put a 1 heck of a smile on my face every evening, I can't thank y'all enough.
Katy don't say ignorant! I can't see what your sitting in now either.;)
Why is it that I'm never tired at bedtime buy I can barely hold my eye's open during the day? Go figure.
I'm taking advantage of this down time toquit smoking. they usually want smoker's to wear a nicotine patch but I passed. Man 1 of the finer things in life is to sit at my pc and unwind with a smoke! UUGHHH I'm gonna make it stick forever this time even though Iactually enjoy it! That leads me to believe that this addiction is as strong as heroin.
I did get some great news about my lungs!!! My infectious disease doc took lung X-rays and came back asking me just how much I had told him I was smoking etc...This kid(me) has spotless lungs!!!!! WOOHOO
He said he'd never seen anything quite like it. Theres noo way I can go out and mess theen up now;)
Thanks so much friends for allowing me to totally hijiack this thread and vent all I need too. There are maybe 1-2 lil tid bits of info my wife has no business hearing about as this deal pans out. I'll tell her, just no need to over worry her yet. You guy's give me something to look forward to everyday via your lil posts.
I plannedon setting up my seed trades in Feb.,That will have to wait. I collected more seeds than ever this year! I never did finish organizibg them. Maybe I'll be able to do that after I'm allowed to sit up;)
Well this reading has made me a lil sleepyfinally Gonna call it a night, thanks again;) JD aka Jeff
Hi Jeff, I wonder what it was that cleared the lungs. Must have been all the antibiotics you are/have been on. I can't imagine anything like that happening. I gotta tell you that I went into the ICU in November of 2002 and was in there, under sedation, for 5 weeks. Then in a rehab to get my muscles working again because they had gone to sleep after all that time. So in that 2 months I did not have a cigarette.
I have not had one since. You are in the hospital with clean lungs, man you have gotta make this thing work. I know it is tough because I really enjoyed them too. I know it is easy for me to say since I was literally out of it for that long. But, it does get easier.
Jeff, you will be sooo glad you've quit. The patches do give one very good dreams, but then you have to wake up and be disappointed they were just dreams.
You will also look remarkably younger in the face, at least I did.
Keep-up with the progress and keep us posted.
Big hug for you and those that love you.
After a while, Jeff, you will wonder why you ever smoked in the first place. At least all the people I know that have quit feel that way. I enjoyed smoking too, but I do enjoy not 'having' to smoke too and I don't miss having to find the cigs and the matches or lighter and the cost of purchasing them. However, I cannot tell one difference in the amount of money in my pocket now, than when I smoked. I have no idea when I quit, two or three years ago. Doesn't bother me at all to be around cigs or smoke or people that smoke, I guess I've lost the desire to smoke. One day you will wake up and you will be over cigs, good luck, you will enjoy it when you stop and then wonder why you ever did it in the first place. Good Luck!!!
Another ex-smoker chiming in here. I quit 5 (or was it 6?) years ago. I didn't want to - I really enjoyed smoking. However, it had gotten so expensive financially, physically and psychologically (I was getting tired of feeling like a criminal huddled outside in the cold furtively sucking away on my adult pacifier LOL) that I knew it was time. I started taking Wellbutrin which really made it easy to quit. I don't regret it a bit, in fact every time I see a smoker lighting up in the freezing cold or smell stale smoke on somebody in a store or see the price of a pack of cigarettes I am sooooooo glad that I don't do that anymore. I don't judge people who still smoke. If there were no harmful consequences for me I would still be smoking too. But I sure don't miss it all.
So maybe this is the silver lining in all that you are going through right now. Maybe you will come out the other end a non-smoker and happy to be one. Think of all the extra money you will have for PLANTS!!!!!
I think Jeff has heard enough about cigarettes you guys. If it were me I would want to slap every one of us. LOL Just reminds him of what he wants.
Can you look at the seed companies' websites on your laptop Jeff? That would be so much more enjoyable. Whether you buy their seeds or not, or whether you like their service or not, Parks has a nice website. Also, I was thinking about Thompson & Morgan. I know their catalog is wonderful. But don't remember on the computer.
I always start the hard coated seeds with H2O2. They usually germinate within a week with a very high success rate. Two weeks ago I started 25 sweet peas in a sandwich baggie soaked with the H2O2 solution. Only 3 seeds didn't germinate. The others are outside now.
Sherry, are regular peas different than Sweet Peas? My daughter who is in zone 8 like you always grows regular sugar snaps for her husband and son. They love them. Don't know if she has ever tried for the flowers tho.
Aren't sweet peas the very colorful vined peas...blue red pink yellow purple orange and so on...
I back up pins2006 statement. I have tried a few mediums in the past couple of months- Best germination at least for hard shelled seed is the baggies, papertowels, H202 and superthrive. I just planted in the ground yesterday morning glories I started on New years day using that method for the first time- learning it on this or another thread.
I was talking about Sweet Peas, the flower. They won't bloom here if not planted before Jan 1. Now Sugar Snaps do just fine but they say bye bye when it gets really hot, they hate the heat. We have to plant lots to get enough for our family, they are a real fav...
I've used the same bottle of Super-Thrive for ever, and bought a new one this year at WalMart, like Jnette said, it's the cheapest place I've seen it. Out of all the stuff that is not fertilizer, Super-Thrive is the cheapest and I cannot tell the expensive ones do one bit more. I do use H202 with the S-T, but I only started doing that last year...
Jeff, wishing you the best, happy days, and hope you are healing quickly and completely!!!
I came to Charlotte, NC yesterday. Raked some wet leaves and took DS out to dinner. Getting DM's house ready for new realtor. I sure would like to leave three planters full of flowers and may do it with water crystals. The daffodills are blooming here.
Thread for Jeff is http://davesgarden.com/forums/t/575519/
pins, I use the 35%, but this recipe comes from a local pal, who does use the 3% and he is a master gardener...if I were you, I'd try it first before spraying all your plants...however, at this time of the year I think you will be fine, only thing is that it WILL burn your plant leaves if applied in the blazing sun...
I'm in zone 8a, southeast Arky and we can't water or mist in the blazing sun. I burned leaves with 3% peroxide the first time I used it, but I did so many things wrong that it's a wonder I didn't kill them all, but they are survivors and they did just fine...now my rule is, if I think it just might not be the right thing to do, I just hold off and rethink it. Works pretty good...
I saved an eyedropper from one of the bottles in my medicine cabinet to use with the Super thrive- works pretty good. I figured if we're suppose to be using "drops" might as well use the eye dropper as my drops from that bottle are quite a bit.
I wasjust reading up some and seeing soo manypeople stillsprouting seeds doin the paper towel innna baggie gig. This baffles me... I've done it several times myself and it sure is fun to look at but...Why do it when your adding just 1 more stressfull transplant step to tho whole ordeal? I use all the ingredients but preffer to let them sprout in the medium they'll grow in until ready to pot up etc.
Do Y'all really see a benefit to sprouting in baggies other than KNOWING germ rates and germination times?
Just curious...I've snapped the roots seedlings when trying to remove them off the paper towels, they tend to snag if I recall.
Goodnight all, Jeff
I like the paper towel method because I am planting only the seeds that sprout and not wasting space or time on unsprouted seeds. Since I tend to keep my seeds from year to year until they are gone, the germination rates drop as time passes. Also I plant large seeds like sweet peas directly into individual cell packs and I don't want to have empty cells if I can help it. So germinating them first on paper towels avoids that problem.
If the sprout starts to penetrate the paper towel, simply tear off the piece of towel that is attached and plant the whole shebang.
I did some more research on the Sweet Peas and find that for my area I can put them out 4-6 weeks before my last frost date. I see that you are in a much warmer climate than me and you could even direct sow in October. (Zone Envy here!)
Jeff, I am completely and only wintersowing this year and I'm quite active in that forum.. Not only am I growing seeds with regular old potting soil, I am going to put them straight into the garden from the containers they are in now. I had so many types and varieties of seeds that even soaking all of them beforehand would have been a major undertaking.
ahh I can see some good uses for this method now other than just getting to look at the sprouts;) LOL And some do look really cool. My wife likes the "plants 5 fold the recomended amount of seeds per cell and just deal with it later!" LOL Man I'm not kidding either when I say overfilling cells. Some are so stuffed, it's impossible to keep them watered before transplant time. She drives me crazy with this "method" annually! LOL
Keep on keeping on friends;)
I wonder if you can sprout this in a baggie with H202?
It's funny you asked that question JD, because I had no idea why, other than it was a cool new thing I learned that worked rather well. Now I'm supersized with those seed kits with the lids. Wonder what will be next!? LOL
Let's see how long I can keep the cool coconut tree alive!
A little coconut humour- I brought this back from Hawaii.
My Mom planted a coconut tree in Homestead AFB FL around 1974 and when I went back and passed by to see it around 1990, before Andrew, it was the only thing still part of all the things she planted, so unless RJ's coconut gets hit by a monster hurricane, it will do great!!
Now Jeanette, I try not to think of calculations like that! It is probably too cold here in the winter for it, but stubbornly I wanted to see for myself. I never realized how tall they can get, so I won't be able to cover it after a period of time. - although there is an occasional freeze in florida - Right!?
Yesterday I saw my first morning glory flower, from the seeds I planted in January, (yes JD, using the baggie method!) :-)
I'm too lazy to look up the technical name, but it is purple and white striped. The plant is only about 5 inches tall. The second crop of morning glories just came out of the seed "incubator".
This if the first time that I've noticed this thread and did a quick read through it. I am just about to get some seeds started and morning glories are among them. I'm so glad that I checked here first.
Most important question for me...does this H2O2 menthod work on hosta seeds. They are papery, so I'm concerned. I suppose that I could try it first on seeds that I have in quantity, but with others I only have a few seeds and would really like to have them all sprout.
Thanks in advance for all of the wonderful information.
Marie, I did not have good luck with the papery seeds and the H202. They turned all sticky. Don't know why. I can't remember exactly which seeds they were, but I do think they were possibly cup n saucers? Not sure. Anyway, I threw them away.
Mine turned out ok, as long as I left them on top of the soil and spray/misted them with the solution. They were Tecoma stans var. angustata http://davesgarden.com/pf/go/2047/index.html wonder if they'll come back this year? Better start some more seeds to try too. Testing for viability.
Gee, I hope Jeff is too busy planting seeds and getting ready for spring to get on the computer. Does anyone know if there is somebody else on DG who is in direct contact with him and can let us know how he is doing?
Man I'm glad I checked this thread!!!
I'm doing great, thank you for wondering;)
I have no open wounds for the 1st time in 4 years!!! I don't know how to act, it seems so foriegn but I'm sure I'll get used to it;).
I apologize for not checking in sooner, my desktop pc crashed hard and I'm not sure how to get it fixed. It keeps telling me there is a corrupt or missing file I need to re-install in order for windows to start/load. I've fixed it once but it quickly crashed again and won't let me repair it. I'll figure something out.
Thanks again everyone;). It was an excellent suprise to check this thread and see Jnette and others wondering where I was and how I'm doing.
It is great to hear that you are doing so well, Jeff. That is wonderfu, wonderfull news. Too bad about your computer though - I hate it when they don't work. You might try posting in the computer forum. There are some experts there who are very helpful and may be able to solve your pc problems for you.
Man Jeff, wonderful to hear from you!!! Are you still in the lockup?? I sure hope not. It has been so long since we have heard from you that I don't know what to expect. Bet it seems a hundred times longer to you.
So glad you are on the mend. Hope you get that computer mended also. Hang in there Jeff, spring is here, summer is on the way and it's a whole new ball game.
Thanks, Jeanette. Now that I've read it I realize it is a method I have been using for several years with great success. This year I used it to sprout my ranunculus tubers. Usually I have a problem with them rotting before they ever sprout but this method has solved that. Now I am looking forward to lots of beautiful ranunculus blooms. Hooray!
NiH2O - how did you use it to sprout tubers?
I bought a bag of freesia tubers or corms I guess they are and the instructions are a little imprecise. Wonder if it would work on that
I've read this whole thread a couple times and I'm still a tad confused about what the recommended ratio is of household 3% peroxide to water. I think its 1 tsp to a quart of water.
I bet this would be good to mist my dahlia tubers with that are eyeing up right now
I misted layers of paper towels with the H2O2 solution so they were just damp, like a wrung out sponge. I rolled the tubers in the paper towels, put in a plastic bag and kept in a cool location (ranunculus need cool temps to germinate). I checked them daily and misted as needed. I removed the tubers when they developed roots or shoots and potted them up.
The crucial thing with ranunculus is moisture and temperature. If they are too wet or warm they will rot. So it was really important to keep the towels damp but not wet. In the past when I planted them in directly in pots with soil-less potting mix they usually rotted, I couldn't regulate the degree of dampness well enough.
I have never grown freesias so I don't know what their requirements are.
I have read various proportions for the ratio of H2O2 to H2O also. Since I was using a 32 oz. spray bottle with markings for each oz. I used one oz. of H2O2 and filled the rest of the bottle with water.
I have also used this to mist dahlia tubers that were a little shriveled.
Water, 10% by volume hydrogen peroxide H2O2 and kelp meal yucca meal or alfalfa meal tea is just about the best for any seed or cutting starting you would like to do. Note: One of the above three mentioned not all three.
The value of H2O2 is nicely presented in this thread.
The value of kelp meal, yucca meal or alfalfa meal tea is a super organic boost both of which include the same type hormones that are in most if not all products sold to assist in seed and cutting starting. There are also many trace minerals and very minor organic fertilizers when used to soak seed and cuttings prior to placement in the soil.
How much of the tea bases? Just make it look like tea your might drink. A scant pinch in a pint of water is surely enough.
Robin...sure they were available for over sixty years now and from a firm in your home state called North Country Organics and yet another I have forgotten. I have been told by my other NY friends that their service is very good.
You also have a very strong and intellegent Fertrell Dealer listed on the Fertrelll web site. Fertrell is the oldest distributer in America of organic soil and cattle feed additives. They are national distributors.
I have purchased from North Country Organics over the years to support my aerobic compost and worm cast teas. I do not know for sure if they have yucca meal.
I do not mess with GA. It may be OK but I know that it causes mutations by chemistry that is not considered safe by many who speak of it. It was a novel toy acid to play with when I was in college...back then about 1957 - 59. We got some real weird results at that time. That is why I have never used it since. The label warnings were enough to cool my interest in GA.
HAPPY...For seed soaking I use aproximately (not rocket science) 90% water and 10% H202 by volume. To that I add the element of one tea. Tea should color the water to the color you might consider drinking yourself. Again it is not rocket science. In a clear glass hold it up to the sky. When it looks like tea you are ready to soak.
By looking at this thread there is a similar mix of water and H202 which runs an average of my suggestion. Adding tea introduces eyeball evaluation. None of these elements are caustic or very strong therefore my comment..."not rocket science" .
My tea savy. Kelp, alfalfa and yucca in my meal stock contain natural growth hormones plus many other trace elements which help insure a very vigerous start right in the seed starting medium. I trust the experience of many others with the facts here in stated.
There are other plant meals or juices that do contain growth hormones. These are just the ones I have come to know and trust.
I fertilize with the same teas both in the house and in the garden. Fish oil gets added in for the fertilizing rotations. There is a very special relationship between fish oil and kelp. Both from the sea. Alfalfa grows best over clay and limestone...again from the elements of the sea.
If I could only have three additives for my soil building efforts they would be in order of importance: Mycorrhiza, kelp meal and fish oil. The only difference in kelp meal and kelp in fluid form is the expense of shipping the product. The same goes for cold processed dehydrated fish if shipping becomes an issue.
LOL that type of tea :-)
I make my alfalfa tea every spring to put in my rosegarden,bought them by the 25 lb bag.
Also use fish emulsion,kelp etc.
Talking about fish/sea/ocean products.I drive to the ocean and get my own seaweed.Last summer I brought back about 10 grocery bags full.I don't mind the smell,as long as it helps my gardens it's ok with me.Maybe not the neighbor's ?
Ok, I am getting totally lost here. Doc: where do you get mycorrhiza? How do you administer fish oil (we take it orally, but I don't think that is what you mean). And for the teas, do you make the tea separately and then pour some into the potion you water with? Do you mix the kelp, alfalfa etc together, or just use whatever is on-hand? How do you convert the kelp meal to fluid form? Etc. Etc.
eglant...i too live by the ocean. i am new to propagating and such. you said that you get your own seaweed... then what do you do with it to prepare it for fertilization? awesome about the peroxide. will definitly try that on soem of my new starts.
All the products for tea making can be purchased from most organic web sites. The big box stores have bottles of fish and kelp all ready to be used as diluted teas. You can grow enough alfalfa on a three by three bed to make enough growth for most small property needs. Just cut off a hand full or so and food process it into a gallon of water and let it soak a week. Dilute it to look like tea you would drink and watch the goodness happen. Look for Alaska products in the big box store garden centers. I purchase a bale and use a six inch layer of it to make fifty gallons in which case I stir it daily for two weeks and then use the same way. Alfalfa Meal has the about the same value as kelp meal or gathered kelp. Gathered kelp has to have the salts flushed out of it before using. What we on the Eastern Shores find is not good quality kelp. In fact what many call kelp is not kelp at all but it is good after salt flushing and makes fine mulch or compost pile additions. Buying kelp liquid or meal is better in my opinion.
I actually put it into a large garbage can,add water,let it steep but I also use the seeweed and put it around my roses ( no kritters have dug them up even when we raised raccoons - rehab) also I put them into my plantinghole .
Thankyou, to all of you. I spent about 3 hours last night reading the whole thread, yes I was fairly crosseyed when I called it quits. I found
the whole thread very interesting and enlightening. Everyone has great input, I'm sure I will get a lot out of all the information. I have
read before about peroxide but there wasn't much useful info about it such as quantities etc. Should be good for soaking cuttings
in before potting up would you think? Probably read the answer last night but it didn't stick in the brain. Some very interesting Hyperliunks
too they are tonights homework lol. I used to do a lot of seed raising and cutting work but not for a while, now I feel the urge setting
in again. It's all a lot of fun anyway whether on a big scale or small. Hoping all your seeds do as they should and make you proud
Hi to all af you. To save me having to go back and read the whole thread again I have a question for you. If I got the peroxide from a supermarket what form would it be in. I bought a bottle at the chemist its about 4oz and $5.80 and a 3% solution so it will be quite expensive, where as the stronger I can get the further it will go. I asked at 2 hardware stores but no luck. I read somewhere that some had been bought at a super market and it was 36% solution. I hope someone can help. thankyou. Lesley.
I don't know what would be available in New Zealand, but here 3% is definitely the most common, you won't find anything much more concentrated than that in drug stores, supermarkets, etc. As you get higher in concentration it becomes pretty dangerous, not something you want to mess with. Even if you do find someplace that will sell you 30% concentration I wouldn't recommend buying it.
Thankyou ecrane that information was very interesting. It really is good to know what it is that you are playing with, so to speak.
Peroxide has been used for so many things for so long that you tend to forget that it has a not so good side to it. It will be very interesting to see how much difference it makes to my plants. Of course I'm hoping for miracles. Lesley.
I love this thread! I'm Winter Sowing a big batch of seeds (yes, I know I'm late getting started). I wanted to use the H2O2 formula to help get the seeds going and head off any "damping off" disease that might develop in the soil.
While I was gone on vacation last year I had someone else tending my seedlings. They over watered the plants and I lost all my seedlings to "damping off."
Hi Bev!! How are you doing? I used to have this thread in a file but it has disappeared. The link that Dori posted right in the beginning has been taken over by something else. Do you have the instructions on how she did the daylilies?
Or maybe you know if there is a new link?
edited to add: Just looked at it again. I think Alice Knapp posted it.
I believe stronger solutions can be bought at beauty supply sources... for hair dye.
Keep in mind that once H2O2 is exposed to sunlight, it rapidly loses it's strength, hence the brown bottles. So, putting the solution into a saucer 'shouldn't' do much good... the extra 'O' will just be lost to the atmosphere. Also, once opened, the bottle of pharmacy peroxide is usually only good for a month.
I'm glad I read this... I have lots of seeds to propagate this spring, and I'm looking forward to trying it!
Once you open the H202 put it in the frig and it will last for a good wial. I use the 30% and delud it to one part 30% H202 to 11 parts distilled water equals to 3% H202. I keep the 30% H202 in the freezer. (one part 3% H202 to 9 parts water for my seedlings)
Just found it. I heard about using the H2O/H2O2 solution first here on DG and never in my gardening days had I heard such a thing. I haven't been able to employ it much this year - this and that have kept me from the garden, but I expect I will incorporate it into all of my gardening schemes and plans.
I have used Superthrive but not some of the other products mentioned here. It's great to be able to learn something new.
Someone inquired in a post about whether it would work on lavender seeds?
In one of my classes for restoration (in school for master's degree in forestry at NCSU) we talked about using liquid smoke to aid in germination. I have academic/scholarly articles discussing certain chemical elements that are released from burning wood/forest products that "signal" certain plants to germinate faster than others in a way to out-compete other species that are fire-dependent. It's been a while since I read any of this, but our class discussed the article which suggested that these elements were most effective at releasing seeds/dormant species at trace levels. The Ph.D. in charge of the restoration program is the one who mentioned the liquid smoke as something that is used in the field to aid in germination of species that are fire-dependent and would otherwise not germinate or germinate at very low percentages.
Liquid smoke is sold in the grocery and used to make BBQ sauces, etc. If used for germination I understand it must be used in a very very very dilute solution to be effective.
It was suggested that it was/might be effective on particular plant species that were difficult to germinate such as lavender. I haven't looked at ay research that is on point for typical horticultural/gardening applications. This is just an FYI and another very interesting fact to add to this already very interesting thread on germination.
If you use Alfalfa meal or pellets that works too. I've started alot of seeds in "Rabbit" Alfalfa Pellets and it's done wonders! Although it may start to smell a little when it decomposes. There are Alfalfa Pellets for horses too.
I found that some seeds really do need to pre-soak badly.
I've been using Alfalfa seeds along with hard to germinate seeds together, this sometimes helps too. When your seeds germinate let them grow next to each other in the same pot. This will nurture the particular seedling you want. Then when The Seedling You Want looks healthy enough; clip out the Alfalfa down to the soil line. Don't throw the Alfalfa away though, let it dry and add back into the soil when replanting or add to your compost.
I think there is a thread around here about Alfalfa...
Hydrogen peroxide does wonder for overwintering brugmansias in water. I pour a couple tablespoons or so in my buckets when I refresh them and it helps keep them from rotting, etc. I kept about 40 brug stalks in 4-5 water buckets this past winter and only lost a few, usually the younger ones without a woody stalk.
Just spent a good bit of time reading this thread. I have learned a lot from all of you. I have some plants I just got a few days ago that look more dead than alive. Plain water has done nothing to revive them. I am going to try the H2O2 method, and see if they will perk up. I will also be using the H2O2 soak for seeds next time I start some. I am really looking forward to seeing for myself how well this works. Not that I doubt the amazing things I have read here. lol
You can try watering in some Superthrive. The stuff often does wonder for plants, especially transplants and rooting. the next best thing is a foliar feed with Miracle Gro or some other high nitrogen. Just use a spray bottle and spritz it.
I have put the Superthrive on my shopping list (after reading this thread) to try and find. It's a long way into town from where I live, and I don't get in very often. I think I may try this weekend again. I was wondering if a little fish emulsion in a spray bottle would help?
Superthrive is great to use.I had a really hard time finding it and one of the members from the rose forum bought and sent it to me a few years ago.But than later on I found it at WalMart.You might want to call them first .Good luck and have fun :-)
I have been a vendor in the garden center at walmart and other big box retail chains.
Don't bother calling. No one knows what the product is, let alone where to find it. Down your way they may still have it in stock, but late in the season most stores stop ordering garden supplies to focus on the fall/winter holidays.
The product is great though. Hope your plants pull thru.
I have been hybridizing both daylily and Iris seeds since 2009. Two cultivars bloomed while still in my coldframe this past summer. And the rest will bloom next season. Since this is a daylily forum, I will refer to that plant.
Mix Peroxide at ratio of 9 parts water to 1 part Peroxide to help prevent mold. Also be sure to mark the cultivar. I mark pod parent x pollen parent. If by change you have a blooming plant that deserves to be registered, you will want to know what parents produced such beautiful child.
This method is called the Deno method from Dr. Deno who invented it years ago.
First, soak the seeds overnight in hand hot water to plump them up. Then use a kitchen paper towel, cut into 4th and moisted it in the Peroxide. Squeeze out the excess. Fold it in half. Place the seeds and fold to cover the seeds. Place this package in a small ziplock bag and zip it, leaving a small opening to blow air into the bag to fill like a balloon. Once filled, zip it closed. Place in fridge for 3 weeks to stratify (moist cold) the seeds. After 2 weeks, check to see if any have begun to sprout, which often they do. After 3 weeks, move to room temp to germinate.
Sprouting time depends on variety. At this point, check the seeds at least twice during the week, starting after the 1st week since they can sprout overnight. As soon as seeds have formed a radical (tiny roots forming) with a tweezer grasp the seed casing of those and transfer to seed flat or pot. Make a hole with a pencil and guide the root into the hole. Plant so the seed is 1/4" below the surface, 1" or more, apart. Be sure to place roots downwards in the hole. If the roots have grown into the paper towel, just tear around the roots and plant it. Do not try to remove the roots from the paper. The paper will eventually rot. Sometimes it is hard to tell if the tiny growth is roots, or leaf buds, which sometimes appear fist. If that is the case, lay the seed on its side and let the seed determines which is which. Water young seedlings once after potting with Miracle-Gro QUICK-START a hormone to help establish root quickly.
Until the sprouted seeds have broken through the soil, they do not need light. However, once they do, grow them in a sunny window, under light, or place the flat outside in a protected area if weather is warm. Daylily seedling look like blades of grass when young. I plant the seedlings in my coldframe end of May when there is no more chance of frost. I space them 4" apart.
The Deno method above can be used for all perennials that are large enough to handle. Most hardy perennials require stratification (moist cold) to begin sprouting. Mother Nature devised that plan so that hardy perennials wouldn't begin to sprout outdoors during winter when they can't survive.
Below are Daylily seeds sprouting in a kitchen paper towel just prior to planting. Photo taken February 2010.
You know my sister just sent me some Japanese Maple Tree seeds. I have been trying to get them to sprout for a year or 2. This time I have enough seeds to try every imagineable method. Will print your method for day lilies and try that too.
For Japanese Maple, seed should be collected from the tree before it dries, then sown directly outdoors for germination the following spring.
These seeds require stratification, meaning flunctuating winter temperature to break them out of dormancy. It is the same with Iris seeds, which I sow.
I would soak the seeds over night in hand hot water. Then sow the seeds in a plastic container, like a shoe box from Walmart. Plant the seed 1/3" deep of its size. Leave the container outdoors on the north side of a building. Melt drainage holes with a hot nail. Premoisten the potting soil, then keep the container covered.
Below is a photo of this years harvest of Iris seeds. Any perennial can be sowed the same.
If I use your method above, do I water them occassionally? I do have some seeds that have been in pots for about a year and a half. Never though about checking if the seeds are still there. Guess I'll keep them right where they are.
I did look at the site: seedsite.co.uk, but found it difficult to maneuver. Am I missing something?
plantsfor peg, if your pots are not covered, yes I would wtater them. The reason why my seeds are covered is so I don't have to worry about them drying. I do chieck once in awhile but they really can't dry out.
I found this thread last year and incorporated many of the methods described here. I have one tip to add: I used plastic sweater boxes to WS in, with drainage and top air holes burned in with a small soldering iron. To keep critters--and slugs--out, I wrapped the top and bottom with old reemay and secured with duct tape. A stone or two on top kept the covers from blowing off. I had great results!
Blomma, I think I got the idea to use the plastic box from one of your old posts. The only thing different was taping the fabric over the holes to keep invaders out. I followed a lot of your suggestions last year, and they were a huge help, so thank you for all your encouragement and support in these forums.
Ibartoo, Reemay is a type of fabric row cover used to extend the growing season. It lets in light, air and water but helps against frost. I had some pieces left over from previous years were too torn to be of use in the garden.
ibartoo, the problem with using litre bottles is that it is almost impossible to remove the seedlings safely. The shoe/sweater boxes I use makes it easy to remove seedlings with roots intact. Walmart carries the boxes and they are cheap. Actually, Walmart carries plastic boxes in all sizes. If you only have a few seeds you want to sow, save the plastic containers that holds sliced ham. I use those also.
I just took out 4 cuttings I had started of Mock Orange shrubs that I had started in the soda bottles. I used a large meat fork to take them out and they really did great. All had a lot of roots and they looked sooooo good. I think what I might have done if I had had trouble, is cut down to the bottom of the bottle in a couple of places with scissors. That should have helped if I had needed it.
I guess if you have difficulty working with your fingers WS in bottles and jugs can be hard, but I don't mind the very delicate work of lifting seedlings with their tiny roots from milk jugs. I don't use a whole lot of soil either, that could probably increase the difficulty level. As it is, an inch or two of soil is all I use to start my seeds.
Guess everyone has their own methods/preferences, but I certainly do appreciate all the tips on germination here.
I did use too much soil with the cuttings, however, maybe cuttings are different than seedlings. They had a couple of inches of plant to get nodes in the soil. Guess it depends on the type of plant and there is definitely a difference between cuttings and seeds.
Sorry pfg, I thought I did bump this thread. My computer just doesn't always complete what I am trying to do all the time. I have heard others have the same trouble with this site. I was thinking it was my computer, but after hearing others, I am not sure.
1] Photo is my 3 year-old iris seedling with first bloom. Cross is Raspberry Blush x Little Chestnut.
2] Pod parent
3] Pollen parent
4] same as 3
5] All my seedlings for 2012 before planting in nursery.