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Wildlife Gardening: Idaho to kill wolves

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terryr
Bureau County, IL
(Zone 5a)

August 18, 2006
2:14 AM

Post #2633569

Quoting:Don't Let Idaho Kill Endangered Wolves
As a dedicated conservationist, I strongly urge the Fish and Wildlife Service to reject the state of Idaho's request to kill wolves in the Lolo Elk management zone of the Clearwater Basin and in the area north of I-90, where gray wolves are still protected under the Endangered Species Act.

Gray wolves are an important part of Idaho's ecosystems, and contrary to anti-wolf extremists, are not a significant threat to livestock or game populations. Studies show that habitat loss has had a far greater effect on elk numbers than the reintroduction of wolves to Idaho.

These are not responsible management practices. I strongly encourage you to deny unfounded requests to kill wolves.

Thank you for considering my comments.


Please follow the link and add your name to the petition.

http://www.thepetitionsite.com/takeaction/664280276?ltl=1155866978
fly_girl
The Woodlands, TX
(Zone 8b)

August 18, 2006
4:12 AM

Post #2633990

Thanks for the info! This breaks my heart.
Equilibrium

August 18, 2006
5:11 AM

Post #2634111

I signed.
spartacusaby
Hendersonville, NC
(Zone 7a)

August 18, 2006
6:01 AM

Post #2634174

Thanks, terryr; I'd received and signed this petition online, but never thought of posting it here. Great idea!
grampapa
Wheatfield, NY
(Zone 6a)

August 18, 2006
12:25 PM

Post #2634467

I signed the petition. Thanks for posting, Terry. I checked the boxes that I was interested in hearing about animal rights topics. I really hope I don't start getting contacted about any of the other topics. I trust they really do respect my privacy.
terryr
Bureau County, IL
(Zone 5a)

August 18, 2006
1:54 PM

Post #2634691

Thanks everyone. Hopefully we can make a difference.
knolan
Sugar Land, TX
(Zone 9a)

August 18, 2006
3:56 PM

Post #2635103

I signed!
Murmur
Whidbey Island, WA
(Zone 7a)

August 18, 2006
4:03 PM

Post #2635124

Done!

nanny_56

nanny_56
Putnam County, IN
(Zone 5b)

August 18, 2006
4:34 PM

Post #2635228

Signed! Why do they reintroduce a species and then a few years later turn around and want to kill them again?! They belong there more then we do !

Claudia



brigidlily
Lumberton, TX
(Zone 8b)

August 18, 2006
4:57 PM

Post #2635317

Signed!
Fireweed87
Collingswood, NJ
(Zone 6b)

August 18, 2006
5:01 PM

Post #2635337

Signed.
terryr
Bureau County, IL
(Zone 5a)

August 18, 2006
7:33 PM

Post #2635801

You guys are great, thank you!
MQN
Salt Lake City, UT
(Zone 6a)

August 19, 2006
7:22 PM

Post #2638728

signed - thank you for bringing this to us
pepper23
KC Metro area, MO
(Zone 6a)

August 19, 2006
7:45 PM

Post #2638773

Signed.
WillisTxGarden
Willis, TX
(Zone 8b)

September 1, 2006
12:33 AM

Post #2679796

signed...thanks!
fly_girl
The Woodlands, TX
(Zone 8b)

September 1, 2006
12:48 AM

Post #2679847

It's at 36,333! Yeah! Only 13,667 to go
terryr
Bureau County, IL
(Zone 5a)

September 1, 2006
2:38 AM

Post #2680212

Wonderful!
GreenAtHeart
Franklin Grove, IL
(Zone 5a)

September 1, 2006
11:20 PM

Post #2683020

Signed and emailed the web site to friends and family.
bakercity
Baker City, OR

September 12, 2006
9:57 PM

Post #2716766

I don't like to disagree with everyone, but you don't live in Idaho. You have not been out in the hills and had wolves follow you. You have not been out and had them attack your dog. The wolves they have planted in Idaho are not Timber Wolves which is what was here, these are from Canada and do not belong in the state of Idaho. Our forefathers got rid of the wolf for a reason. I know you do not think we need to run our cattle or sheep in the mountains, Well please stop and think where your meat comes from and the wolves are taking not only the elk herds but a lot of cattle and sheep. And please believe me when I say they are fast losing their fear of humans.
You want to put things back like it was 200 years ago, that is just not going to happen. Thanks to people like you who live in the east and try and tell the west what we need. There is fewer farms, less cattle and sheep ranching, and logging is all most gone. What is going to happen when Canada, Mexico, and other countries decide to cut off our wood, and food supplies.
fly_girl
The Woodlands, TX
(Zone 8b)

September 12, 2006
11:29 PM

Post #2716991

The Timber wolf, Arctic wolf and Tundra wolf are all other names for the Gray wolf, Canis lupus.
Our forefathers persecuted wolves and hunted them ruthlessly because they were afraid of them, hopefully education about wolves has changed the way it was 200 years ago. I don't want wolves to be trapped and almost caused to become extinct like it was years ago, I think they have a place on our planet and in the US.
I don't see how the wolves have caused fewer farms, less cattle and sheep ranching and logging.
This is an archaic example of 'blame it on the wolves'.
BackyardZoo
Poquoson, VA
(Zone 7b)

September 13, 2006
9:41 PM

Post #2720081

Smart divers do not go into the ocean without a shark spear. They know that they are entering a shark's territory and they take precautions. If you are walking in the hills and a wolf follows you, or attacks your dog, is it then the *wolf's* fault that you were in it's territory and it thought you (or your dog) were food? They are predators and they deserve the respect as such when you are in their territory - even if that territory extends into your own backyard. Kill the vicious ones if they prove to be a threat to all - but otherwise, if they are not bothering you, don't bother THEM.

Wolves are an important part of the ecosystem. Without them, the grazing animals lack population controls. Would you rather have cougars? They may take up some of the slack. But what then happens if a disease hits the cougar population and wipes the majority of them out. You then have elk, deer and rabbits with no natural predator. The world's populations were designed with diverse populations for a very good reason.

If there is less cattle/sheep ranching and logging than before, did you ever stop to consider that maybe it is because it was at an unsustainable point before - not that the wolves are causing the problems?

So what if Canada and Mexico supply us with food and lumber? Perhaps then it will help to force us into more peaceable relations with our neighbors so that our supply does not get cut off. Perhaps we will even be forced into producing another, maybe more innovative, way of supplying the income needed to pay for such imports.

Yes, I feel for the individual ranchers and loggers. But I also would have felt bad for the blacksmiths and the buggy-whip makers upon the invention of the automobile. Adaptation is a fact of nature. If you don't adapt, you die. This is true of the ranchers and loggers, too - not just the wolves, who appear to be doing remarkably well at adapting.
nivlac
San Antonio, TX
(Zone 8b)

September 14, 2006
1:12 PM

Post #2721877

signed. although it is probably to late. usually when you find out about these things it seems that the ones letting the info. out have already made up their minds. But...

I voiced my opinion
calvin
stetchworth
Ocean Springs, MS
(Zone 8b)

September 24, 2006
11:36 AM

Post #2754211

I signed
jujucaps
Silver Spring, MD
(Zone 6b)

September 24, 2006
1:20 PM

Post #2754364

I signed, too. Thank you for posting this.
garden_mermaid
San Francisco Bay Ar, CA
(Zone 9b)

October 2, 2006
4:44 AM

Post #2777657

Signed...and forwarded to others here in the west.

bakercity, my family has been on the west coast since the gold rush of the 1800's. We stretch from Dawson City in the Yukon, south to Los Angeles, including many Oregonians. We value and want our wildlife. I am truly sorry that YOUR forefathers were unable (more likely unwilling) to live in harmony with the wolves. MY forefathers considered a healthy wildlife population to be a sign of a healthy balanced earth.

We were taught to respect wildlife and to understand their needs and habits...which means we don't go out tempting fate by riding a bike or jogging alone at dawn/dusk in mountain lion country (as was the case of the last two persons attacked by mountain lions. In the last 100 years, only 14 fatal cougar attacks occurred on the entire North American continent. In that time, more than 15,000 people were killed by lightning; 4,000 by bees; 10,000 by deer; 1,300 by rattlesnakes. Yosemite National Park has cougars plus 3 million visitors a year. There has never been an attack in the park’s history. More visitors have died from rockslides.

The same applies to wolves. If you look at human-wolf interactions, even in areas where wolves can still be found, wolve attacks are rare.

The majority of timber jobs were in the mills that turned raw timber into lumber. We lost those jobs when companies decided to ship raw timber to be milled overseas under the guise of using cheaper labour to stay competitive (the strongest driver of the job exports is related to our corporate tax structure, not labour costs). I lived in one those small timber towns when American Fiberboard closed the mill. Wildlife issues had nothing to do with it.

I also have a lot of ranching friends here in the west who have been ranching the same land for many generations. Ranchers lose more cattle and sheep to poachers than they lose to wolves or coyotes.

If you make it a practice to eat locally produced food, you will not only be healthier, you will also help support the local farmers and ensure a local supply that is not dictated by other countries, and not require a large amount of fossil fuel to bring to market.

Lilypon

Lilypon
Moose Jaw, SK
(Zone 3b)

October 2, 2006
5:29 AM

Post #2777715

Very well worded Garden_mermaid (and I agree). Here stock loses are most often due to lightning strikes and very rarely to predation.

This message was edited Oct 1, 2006 11:30 PM

nanny_56

nanny_56
Putnam County, IN
(Zone 5b)

October 2, 2006
2:03 PM

Post #2778328

Good job Garden_ mermaid! I had been trying to find stats to respond. So tired of people thinking humans have more rights to the land than the native wildlife!
ASHL04499
Kamiah, ID

April 4, 2008
6:45 PM

Post #4757181

I find it very interesting that everyone who doesn't live in Idaho has such a strong opinion on allowing wolf packs to keep naturally growing without any management. Unfortunately these people have only a book perspective on what locals expience every day even near town. In our communities towns where built in the middle of the forest. We don't have to leave our home to find their's. We both live in the same space. The other intersting fact I see from this discussion is that many of you think we were involved in this reintroduction and even knew about it. Unfortunately when the wolves were reintroduced several years ago the government actually denied this fact. It was only after wolf sitings became regular and their hunting habits where greatly effecting other game populations and even domestic populations that agengies began admitting that they even existed in our area. Imagine how we felt when we walked down the driveway and were stalked by a wolf and when we told the authorities at Fish and Game their only answer was "we don't have wolves here". Now they can't deny it any more because we even see wolves not 200 yds from town. These wolves are taller than most dogs and I have seen several. I don't think many of you understand the culture and the perspective here in Idaho. We live in the woods, are kids live in the woods, our jobs are in the woods. I have had many friends barely escape deadly encounters with wolves and for some reason people think that they are just in the deep forest away from big towns and residential areas but that is just not a reality. Our cougar population has suffered as well as our elk population. 15 years ago we didn't worry about being out with the bears, cougars, and all of the other animals in our area. Now we all carry hand guns because the wolf danger has become so serious. I know most of you from this site will not agree with me and that is okay but I would just encourage you that before you sign a bill that affects an area you do not even live in that you would have the consideration to see how the locals feel about it and why they feel that way. I won't lie to you there are a few people here who feel as you do but I would say it might be 2% and they are new to the area.

Also to the person from Texas would be how do you feel about the reintroduction of jaguars into your local habitat. This is a current concern in that state and these animals where native to that area. Don't you think this reintroduction once it got a little out of control from lack of management would effect your local dynamics and economics?

I have to say that I am glad that this one bill will give back at least some rights to the people who live in and make their livelyhood in Idaho. We weren't involved in the creation of this problem but hopefully we can be involved in its solution.

Sincerely,
Ms. Lineberry
Kamiah, ID
ASHL04499
Kamiah, ID

April 4, 2008
6:48 PM

Post #4757190

I can say I do feel proud to be the only Idaho resident on this discussion and hope some of you can see things from our perspective for just a moment before you try to be the driving force in changing our home.
Jsorens
Buffalo, NY
(Zone 6a)

April 5, 2008
2:29 AM

Post #4759176

We could use a few wolves out east. Help take care of the rampant deer, rabbits, & feral cats.
ASHL04499
Kamiah, ID

April 18, 2008
6:36 PM

Post #4827839

Please take ours!
2gonefishing
Milwaukee, WI

June 28, 2009
10:57 PM

Post #6750976

What A Wolf! Here in the city-at last one of the most beautiful keen intelligent creatures God created! 35 years of gardening and down the alley he came--his keen mind scent knew I was watching him and within feet he stopped, turned his head, and then on his way he went! What Threat? Nonsense! Perhaps humans will not be content until all the world is a concrete jungle, with nothing left but a human! and the color gray! Milwaukee Wisconsin
grik
Saint Paul, MN

June 30, 2010
1:25 PM

Post #7933407

Wolves have managed to live in Minnesota just fine with people.
The only "reason" they were extirpated from areas of this country was just plain old ignorance and fear. Yes they do take occaisional livestock, yes they will kill dogs just as coyotes will. There has never been anyone killed in Minnesota by wolves and we have had them always. Problem individual wolves and or packs can be managed and yes that sometimes means killing them, not wholesale slaughter.
psudan
Mentor, OH

July 1, 2010
4:08 PM

Post #7936270

This is a very emotional issue and I can understand both sides having strong feelings. I personally like things "wild". I archery hunt in Pennsylvania for deer every Fall and even though I am deathly afraid of snakes and bears, I get an eerie, tingly,fearful enjoyment knowing they are around. Like many other hunters,I have been a little upset at the Pa. Game Commission for giving out more and more antlerless deer permits each year. I mentioned this to a farmer and WOW did I get an earful. I will attempt to paraphrase what he told me. He said " Most hunters are only concerned about deer for a few weeks each hunting season. As a farmer, I give them free room and board 365 days a year. I have lost many young livestock to coyotes,bears and dogs and some years I lose 1/3 or more of my crops to deer damage. This is no different that some thug standing outside your workplace every Friday and taking 1/3 of your paycheck. This farm is not a hobby, this farm is my living. There are too many deer and something needed to be done". After I picked myself up off the ground (LOL) I could see his point. I guess my point is that it's sometimes very easy to suggest what someone, someplace else should or shouldn't do as long as we are not involved directly. After my "chewing out" by the farmer, I guess I'm better off keeping my nose out of things that don't directly impact my life,especially some issue 2000 miles from me. Sorry for turning this into a "novel".
psudan
Mentor, OH

July 3, 2010
5:53 PM

Post #7941207

Oooops ! Just noticed that this thread was recently resurrected from four years ago. Still, a good debate.
Fill2

(Zone 7a)

June 2, 2012
8:47 PM

Post #9149800

I realize this is an old debate... but I read a blog about gardening near the pacific north west. Her picture today was a pasture full of elk. And how she will keep them from tearing down her fences. So it seems elk are doing very well out in that part of the country. Balance is very important in nature.
grik
Saint Paul, MN

June 8, 2012
2:20 PM

Post #9157303

You are right. It is all about balance. In Minnesota they are now opening up both a hunting and a trapping season on wolves. The deer are decimating the plant communties along the north shore due to overpopulation yet the hunters claim the wolves are eating all the deer.

It is totally ridiculous that the wolves leave protected status and the very next year it is open season. Even more outrageous it isn't even a small number. Minnesota has 3000 wolves and the goal for the state DNR is a winter wolf population minimum about half that -1600.

It makes me sick.

This message was edited Jun 8, 2012 8:39 PM

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