| Author | Content |
earthling
Rowlett, TX
(Zone 8a)
April 14, 2007
10:12 AM Post #3390641
| We had a company come out yesterday to give an estimate on installing an on demand water heater. This is something I have wanted for a long time and it seemed the right time to investigate it now..
Very nice guy (owner) and his sidekick took a look around and then sat us down and here is what they said.
Since we have an all-electric house, the only heater he would install is a Bosch, but he is not keen on the electric units because he didnt feel they were as efficient as the gas ones. Said they heat 3 gal./ minute...that our ground water (in summer) comes into the house at about 75-80 degrees already ...Said if this were his place, he would install a timer that we could set to turn off at night and back on in the morning. the water heater only loses about 2 degrees of heat per hour so wouldnt be that much to heat back up in the morning. Also said the savings would be comparable as the on demand system...about 25-30% on energy bill.
So, we decided to do the timer thing, if it does not work out as well we can always go back to the on demand unit. The timer cost a little over $40, the unit would have been $1300, installed, plus a little more to have an extra 220 line wired in.
I appreciated what he told us, I especially appreciated his honesty, and all the info he gave us. Thought there might be some of you out there that would also like to consider this idea..Since we are just the 2 of us, we dont use that much hot water. I just hated to think how much that water heater had to work to keep that water hot while waiting on us to need it.
Not sure if this is the right forum, but I hope all this will help others if you are looking for a way to reduce your energy costs.
Kris |
darius
Marion, VA
(Zone 5b)
April 14, 2007
11:01 AM Post #3390778
| Kris, that's an idea worth investigating for this house here since I just installed new heating elements in the water heater. With so many other projects pending, a tankless system falls down the list...
Years ago I installed a programmable timer for my mother (the kind with pegs on a dial for on-off) but she took the pegs out after a few days because the heat cycle didn't suit her "whenever" to do laundry. |
earthling
Rowlett, TX
(Zone 8a)
April 14, 2007
11:25 AM Post #3390849
| Well, I have not used hot water for laundry since the '70's...so that doesnt bother me at all.
We just use it for showers and washing dishes..we run the dish washer couple times a week, but hand wash the cat dishes daily..DH just finished installing the timer and has it set to go off at 6pm and on at 6am...personally I think it should go off a little later and come on later, too, but we will try it this way. Thats 12 hours of it being off...hope I will see some drop in electric bill eventually..
Good luck, I thought it was a great idea, would not have thought about it, had the guy not mentioned it..
Kris |
victorgardener
Lower Hudson Valley, NY
(Zone 6b)
April 14, 2007
1:25 PM Post #3391226
| Sounds like a good idea to me. I suggest the following. Do a test to see exactly how quickly the water heats up. Take a temp with a thermometer after it has been off all night. Then turn it on and keep taking readings every 10 or 15 minutes until it reaches the final hot temperature. You might want to do the same for turning it off and seeing how quickly it cools down.
This way you can determine not only the best settings for the timer, but also might see if it's worth turning off if you're away during the day if it doesn't take too long to heat up. You should do this at different times of the year if the incoming water temp varies appreciably. |
bluekat76
Ijamsville, MD
(Zone 6b)
April 14, 2007
4:31 PM Post #3391857
| This is a good idea. We need to replace a heating element and I will bring up the timer idea. Thanks! |
mliga
Kingwood, WV
(Zone 5b)
April 14, 2007
4:32 PM Post #3391863
| Hi,
In our last place we installed a Bosch gas water heater. We liked the system in the summer, but in the winter time the water would never heat up to give you a decent hot shower. A friend who is a contractor (but he did not install our system), said that lately he has been telling people to leave the old hot water tank in place as a storage tank and then use the tankless as the heating unit. Just my .02
Michelle |
victorgardener
Lower Hudson Valley, NY
(Zone 6b)
April 14, 2007
4:36 PM Post #3391884
| I have one for about 7 years now and love it. It's not AS hot in the winter but plenty hot enough. Just wish the larger capacity ones were available when I bought mine - also a Bosch - natural gas with battery ignition. |
podster
Deep East Texas, TX
(Zone 8a)
April 14, 2007
5:05 PM Post #3392006
| The timer would be a good idea. I have a breaker panel in the pantry and throw the breaker easily to limit the water heating time. Shades of my Mom there. My youngest brother lived at home but worked away. He would always call her about 8-12 hours before he got home to ask her to turn on the water heater.
I never wanted a gas water heater but always wanted a gas "on demand" heater. I can't help but feel it would be quite safe. Unfortunately, we have a HOT water shower fiend that lives here and if it won't heat adequately in winter I will never be able to sell him on it... |
mliga
Kingwood, WV
(Zone 5b)
April 14, 2007
5:11 PM Post #3392023
| When we had ours we were in coastal NJ (Zone 7a) and our water would come in the tap at aroun 40 to 50 degrees in the winter. The tankless heater will heat the water to about 110 degrees, sometimes lower then that, I like a hot shower. But the good thing about the heater is you could take a shower while washing clothes and doing dishes and still have a hot shower (at least in the summer).
Michelle
This message was edited Apr 14, 2007 8:18 PM |
victorgardener
Lower Hudson Valley, NY
(Zone 6b)
April 14, 2007
5:14 PM Post #3392034
| Pod, should be no problem in TX! Michelle, I can't do two hot water things at the same time. That's why I wish the larger one was available at the time. |
earthling
Rowlett, TX
(Zone 8a)
April 14, 2007
6:00 PM Post #3392189
| We got the timer yesterday, DH installed it today. He set to turn off at 6pm and on at 6am..I would have used different times, but we will work with this and see how it goes.
Thats still off for 12 hours a day, which (hopefully) will make a difference in the energy bills.
The idea of testing the temp of water at various times is a good idea, but I think here in Texas, it will not get cold enough even being turned off for 12 hours. The guy told us typically, a water heater loses 2 degrees per hour when turned off, which means it will drop approximately 24 degrees overnight.. I think we have the temp. set at 120 now so that would drop it to a little below 100 by morning...thats still nice and warm (IMHO)...in winter it might be a little colder, but it really doesnt get very cold here (like it does up north) or stay cold for long periods of time. We do the showering at night and only run the dishwasher a couple times a week, however, we do hand washing of the cat dishes throughout the day.
It will be interesting to see how this all plays out..I will update now and then, if anyone is interested..
Kris
|
victorgardener
Lower Hudson Valley, NY
(Zone 6b)
April 14, 2007
6:02 PM Post #3392199
| Yes, keep us posted. |
sugarweed
Jacksonville, FL
(Zone 9a)
April 14, 2007
6:09 PM Post #3392231
| I have a switch we flip to turn hot water heater off and on. If you are losing heat get your heater an insulation 'coat'. They are inexpensive and work. |
earthling
Rowlett, TX
(Zone 8a)
April 14, 2007
6:23 PM Post #3392288
| We will only lose heat when the unit is turned off...wondering if a coat would help..
Thanks for the suggestion, will check into it tomorrow..
Kris |
sugarweed
Jacksonville, FL
(Zone 9a)
April 14, 2007
6:25 PM Post #3392297
| You said it better than I did.
;) |
victorgardener
Lower Hudson Valley, NY
(Zone 6b)
April 14, 2007
6:27 PM Post #3392302
| Be sure to get one that has the foil too. Foil reflects radiated heat back in. The fiberglass, or other material, is for conductive heat loss. |
earthling
Rowlett, TX
(Zone 8a)
April 14, 2007
6:28 PM Post #3392307
| Michele, sorry I meant to comment to you..
The guy (Kent) said that an electric on demand heater will not heat enough water for 2 people to take showers at the same time..( I dont think he meant together..LOL) That was the main reason he really was hesitant about installing them right now. Said they will heat 3 gal/min and once they get up to 4 gal/min..thats when he will be more favorable to them.
He could not say enough good things about the gas units...we just dont have gas here where I live..
Kris |
AYankeeCat
Fairfield County, CT
(Zone 6b)
April 15, 2007
8:51 AM Post #3394184
| Good timing on this thread as I am in the process of converting from oil/electric heating to gas. In my research I found a boiler that also provides domestic hot water. My contractor is looking into it for me - it is a Trinity Ti150c or 200c. Here is a link into the tech and specs [HYPERLINK@www.houseneeds.com] . Any thoughts / comments on this boiler? |
darius
Marion, VA
(Zone 5b)
April 15, 2007
11:20 AM Post #3394583
| Looks good, and the efficiency rates look good. Personally, I have NO experience with them though. |
AYankeeCat
Fairfield County, CT
(Zone 6b)
April 15, 2007
12:44 PM Post #3394860
| darius - thank you for looking at it for me. I value your opinion. |
sugarweed
Jacksonville, FL
(Zone 9a)
April 15, 2007
1:40 PM Post #3395044
| Yankee, I'm a boilermaker and I was astonded as to how physically small they are. In our world, we would call them "Toy Boilers", LOL
What is the price you were quoted?
;) |
Dyson
Rocky Mount, VA
(Zone 7a)
April 15, 2007
1:42 PM Post #3395049
| Sidney, I tried to e-mail you a music file, yahoo would not let it go through, Guess I'll have to burn a CD & send it snail mail. |
AYankeeCat
Fairfield County, CT
(Zone 6b)
April 15, 2007
4:10 PM Post #3395540
| sugarweed - I haven't got a quote yet - still doing homework. From the houseneeds website [HYPERLINK@www.houseneeds.com] the 150000 BTU rated system is $3k and the 200000 BTU is about $4k. There are other vendors including one on eBay for these boilers. Do you have an opinion on them? |
sugarweed
Jacksonville, FL
(Zone 9a)
April 15, 2007
4:27 PM Post #3395583
| No, but I will ask around at work tomorrow and see if any of the guys have any knowledge of them.
We are repairing the East Bend Generating Station at Rabbit Hash, Ky
It's about 150 feet high and the other measurements are also comparable.
I'll post after work.
Sidney |
AYankeeCat
Fairfield County, CT
(Zone 6b)
April 15, 2007
5:04 PM Post #3395716
| Thank you so much. |
victorgardener
Lower Hudson Valley, NY
(Zone 6b)
April 15, 2007
5:14 PM Post #3395766
| They look nice and the efficiency is very good. You have hydronic heating? |
AYankeeCat
Fairfield County, CT
(Zone 6b)
April 15, 2007
5:21 PM Post #3395794
| It is baseboard with hot water running through it. Is that hydronic? |
victorgardener
Lower Hudson Valley, NY
(Zone 6b)
April 15, 2007
5:30 PM Post #3395822
| Yes. Good luck with the new boiler. Keep us posted - especially concerning the change in heating cost. |
darius
Marion, VA
(Zone 5b)
April 15, 2007
9:06 PM Post #3396503
| My sister (when she finaslly sells the other house and moves hyere) and I are somewhat seriously considering hydronic heating in the floors. It will have to be plumbed above the existing sub flooring and under whatever finished flooring that we can agree upon.
Probably an outside boiler. Any thoughts? |
summerkid
Kankakee, IL
(Zone 5b)
April 15, 2007
11:49 PM Post #3396607
| Darius, I have water-heated baseboards that seem to function well, though I can't adjust it from room to room, so I sleep in a hotbox. Given a choice as I remodel would it make sense to get rid of that style of heating? |
podster
Deep East Texas, TX
(Zone 8a)
April 16, 2007
6:12 AM Post #3397234
| Darius ~ an outside boiler should be good lower insurance rates.
I would love hydronic heating in the floor of our slab. It is silent (no fan noise) and will put the heat on the lower portion of the room where you are.
I know my choice for flooring also. I really like the laminate floating floor. A friend used this flooring and it feels like walking on carpet rather than a slab. It has more give. |
garden_mermaid
Sunnyvale, CA
(Zone 9b)
April 16, 2007
8:55 PM Post #3400293
| My hydronic heating pipes are actually in the ceiling, with an electric fan that blows the heat through the same vents as the air conditioning unit. We use the ceiling fans for cooling mostly, but when the weather gets in the 100's, the AC is needed. There is a limit to how long one can sit in tepid water to cool down the body temperature. |
fremar
Comer, GA
(Zone 7b)
April 17, 2007
6:33 PM Post #3403306
| OK finally a subject i feel like I know something about.After 20 plus years of plumbing I can safely say STAY away from an electric on demand heater,if you have access to propane I would definetly recommend a tankless water heater for residential use I've installed more than 30 in the last 5 years and to my knowledge not one comlaint,the main issue is the gas supply,because of the high BTU rating a normal gas supply isn't suffecient for the tankless heaters. You don't need any recirculating system or storage tank(because a storage tank would cool and you would waste that water trying to get hot water not to mention heating water that would be stored only to cool again. thanks for a chance to finally post here |
podster
Deep East Texas, TX
(Zone 8a)
April 17, 2007
6:50 PM Post #3403355
| Fremar ~ Thank you for sharing your expertise. I, for one, appreciate it. Are you saying that the tankless heater is most efficient with propane? Even more so than natural gas? Interesting. pod |
earthling
Rowlett, TX
(Zone 8a)
April 17, 2007
7:07 PM Post #3403427
| Well, yes, thats what MY plumber said about gas vs. elelctric...the gas was a lot more efficient..which is why he recommended we stay away from the electric ones. |
fremar
Comer, GA
(Zone 7b)
April 17, 2007
7:10 PM Post #3403436
| not more efficient but someone stated they didn't have access to gas and propane is an alternative that can be trucked to the site,my experience with electric has been that you cant adequately heat water as used with electricity.Had soooooo many complaints from them.the problem with most installers is that they don't know that more BTU's require a higher volume of gas and they don't repipe the gas to manufacturers requirements,also the venting is a larger size(most times but not always),the gas heaters can be installed almost anywhere in the house and take up very little space. most manufacturers say that you wiill recover your initial investment in 2 to 2 1/2 years but expect a little over 3 years to pay for it |
darius
Marion, VA
(Zone 5b)
April 17, 2007
7:14 PM Post #3403444
| So, does a propane installation also require larger diameter piping? |
fremar
Comer, GA
(Zone 7b)
April 17, 2007
7:21 PM Post #3403463
| possibly Darius,most propane piping is significantly smaller since propane is a high pressure fuel,manufacturers make information available for any number of installations and would be glad to help you find a certified installer in your area. i've even had sales reps come out to look at my installs and offer insight into proper installation |
darius
Marion, VA
(Zone 5b)
April 17, 2007
7:25 PM Post #3403475
| Thanks... if I eventually switch to tankless it will likely be a DIY project. I'm pretty handy. |
fremar
Comer, GA
(Zone 7b)
April 17, 2007
7:28 PM Post #3403486
| Darius I believe you can do this,just please pay close attention to your venting,it really is a fairly simple install for anyone mechanicaly inclined and willing to follow instructions |
darius
Marion, VA
(Zone 5b)
April 17, 2007
7:37 PM Post #3403511
| Thanks, I will be most careful. I had hoped to install one this summer (as money permitted) but have just replaced the heating element in the current water heater, and a new 200 amp panel box (plus wiring out to the barn) so dollars are tight. |
podster
Deep East Texas, TX
(Zone 8a)
April 18, 2007
4:11 AM Post #3404010
|
| Quoted: | | you will recover your initial investment in 2 to 2 1/2 years but expect a little over 3 years to pay for it |
This would indicate that the electric water heater in a LARGE power hog. Fremar, approximately how much cost would this be?
I find propane to be most efficient. We have a large tank and purchase our propane annually trying to do so when prices are at the lowest. We have a gas furnace ( would not do that again as opposed to gas space heaters ) and a gas range and spend only $200 - $300 annually. I know we are in a warmer climate compared to many of you but the people in this area that heat with electric are being consumed with high bills. I have always been wary of gas water heaters but this truly sounds like the solution. Thanks for the good info. |
AYankeeCat
Fairfield County, CT
(Zone 6b)
April 18, 2007
4:36 AM Post #3404099
| podster - I am putting in a gas boiler/water heater - switching from oil and electric. While I am at it, I am going to have all the plumbing done for a gas range and clothes dryer but not actually change out my appliances yet.The gas company has marked the street for the line but not yet called me to tell me when they are going to dig up my front yard for the line to the house. I'm supposed to tell them what size of meter I need - but I have no clue. |
podster
Deep East Texas, TX
(Zone 8a)
April 18, 2007
4:43 PM Post #3406455
| Are you putting in the gas boiler yourself? If not, maybe the service man doing the installation or the gas companies may have a technician who can advise you on the size of meter needed. Natural gas is a little different than propane. Ours is regulated at the tank and I have no idea what is required. Perhaps someone with knowledge on this can weigh in here. |
victorgardener
Lower Hudson Valley, NY
(Zone 6b)
April 18, 2007
4:45 PM Post #3406468
| I can't believe the customer is expected to specify the meter! That's crazy. |
AYankeeCat
Fairfield County, CT
(Zone 6b)
April 19, 2007
6:31 AM Post #3408039
| I have a contractor who is handling it for me. He is a friend and does much bigger jobs - so he will fit me in when he can. He needs to talk to the plumber about the boiler I picked. Yes, the gas company told me I had to tell them what size meter to install when I told them I was going to run a tankless system. |
fremar
Comer, GA
(Zone 7b)
April 19, 2007
2:27 PM Post #3409348
| Podster not sure what you meant by cost,generaly a tankless heater could cost between $400 to $700 depending on brand. Lowes has them now so I don't know if that may have driven down prices or not,if you're asking about cost for using the water heater that would depend on what your electric co. charges per therm but most electric water heaters have an estimated cost of about $150 per year,that would be why your recovery of cost would take so long,it's really not about a great saving in heating cost but more about an endless supply of hot water,the efficiency is in not using utilities to heat water that sits idle in a tank when not in use.someone earlier mentioned using a timer on an electric water heater,an excellent idea considering the majority of people spend less time at home than away and hot water is actually only used for such a small mount of time ie:10 minutes for a shower,15 minutes if you run a dishwasher, anyway I think you get my drift. |
podster
Deep East Texas, TX
(Zone 8a)
April 19, 2007
4:11 PM Post #3409657
| Fremar thank you! You answer my question exactly. |
BlackMax
April 20, 2007
1:39 PM Post #3412611
| The *great* thing about tankless heaters where I live is that you don't have a hot water heater taking up space in the house.
I appreciate the discussion; I've been suspicious that the tankless heater wouldn't be efficient if you like long, hot showers or baths. I see "endless hot water" as a great way to make people forget there ever was such a thing as water conservation.
I think I like the idea of a solar water heater better. |
Dyson
Rocky Mount, VA
(Zone 7a)
April 20, 2007
2:43 PM Post #3412796
| [HYPERLINK@www.motherearthnews.com]
[HYPERLINK@www.motherearthnews.com]
There are more on the site. |
victorgardener
Lower Hudson Valley, NY
(Zone 6b)
April 20, 2007
3:59 PM Post #3413034
| Max, there will never be a shortage of dumb people who waste good ideas. |
darius
Marion, VA
(Zone 5b)
April 20, 2007
4:36 PM Post #3413149
| I'm actually hoping to do a "summer" solar water heater which I have mentioned before, maybe even on this thread. It's cheap and easy. |
Dyson
Rocky Mount, VA
(Zone 7a)
April 20, 2007
4:40 PM Post #3413167
| sounds like DW #2 (ooops sorry). |
victorgardener
Lower Hudson Valley, NY
(Zone 6b)
April 20, 2007
4:42 PM Post #3413174
| Been talking with my solar guy about the water systems. Don't seem worth it to me (or him for that matter) - at least where we live. He is high on the pool heater ones though. |
darius
Marion, VA
(Zone 5b)
April 20, 2007
5:00 PM Post #3413234
| The pool systems are the same system. |
victorgardener
Lower Hudson Valley, NY
(Zone 6b)
April 20, 2007
5:15 PM Post #3413371
| Yeah but you don't have to raise the temp that much for the pool. Also, there is usually more area to work with at the pool vicinity. It can be made part of the pool deck. |
MQN
Salt Lake City, UT
(Zone 6a)
April 24, 2007
2:33 PM Post #3426579
| I live alone and use HOT water Very Rarely, what I have done is just set it to its lowest setting and turning up 1 hour ahead of time - as needed. I also have wrapped it with the insulating blanket - this has saved me $ for sure.
This summer I plan on going under the house (crawl space/bungalow) and wrapping my hot water pipes. Something I do not look forward to due to my aversion to spider webs or spiders touching me. But I have noticed that it takes awhile to get truly hot water to the kitchen sink & dishwasher (the bathrooms are in very close proximity to the hot water heater - so not such a problem) hoping I will have less heat tranference in the winter when running the dishwasher (yes only if its full and on water miser).
Side note was interested the hear about the floating floor being nicer to walk on - yes I have floor renovations in my future...I have totally trashed hardwood floors everywhere but the kitchen and the bathrooms, the bathroom - tile no biggy, but carpet glued down in the kitchen YUUUUUUUUUCK... |
Dyson
Rocky Mount, VA
(Zone 7a)
April 25, 2007
5:55 PM Post #3431149
| My hot water started leaking - hence the partially flooded bedroom and bathroom, which was a shocking surprise when I awoke on Monday and first left my comfortable, warm bed.
I have purchased a "tankless", on-demand electric for a replacement and have removed the old unit.
I am doing the installation my-self, including the necessary re-wiring etc and have been taking pictures of the process.
When it is complete, (and I have hot water again, besides stove top), I will start a new thread to chronicle the process, costs, results, etc. And will post a link here. |
victorgardener
Lower Hudson Valley, NY
(Zone 6b)
April 25, 2007
6:11 PM Post #3431237
| Good luck Dyson! You don't have gas to your house?? |
Dyson
Rocky Mount, VA
(Zone 7a)
April 25, 2007
6:30 PM Post #3431329
| Everything here is electric, no gas, no oil.
What I wouldn't give too see My meter run backwards !!!!
This message was edited Apr 25, 2007 10:31 PM |
garden_mermaid
Sunnyvale, CA
(Zone 9b)
April 25, 2007
9:08 PM Post #3431818
| MQN, if you are redoing your floors, something to keep in mind is that the laminates (Pergo etc) are hard on the joints, like walking on concrete. So if you have any friends or family members with arthritis, they will do better on a flooring with more give. |
podster
Deep East Texas, TX
(Zone 8a)
April 26, 2007
4:02 AM Post #3432179
| G_M ~ I am surprised. I know someone that had it installed. He said it floats ~ not put directly on the slab. They both love it making the comment that it was like walking on carpeting.
MQN ~ you might get a chance to look at some that has been done and see what you think... |
garden_mermaid
Sunnyvale, CA
(Zone 9b)
April 26, 2007
7:04 AM Post #3432822
| Podster, are you sure it was laminate and not hardwood?
Hardwood has cushion. It's the glue and layers in the laminate floors that take the cushioning effect away. It was my understanding that the laminate is installed over an 1/8" moisture barrier (usually blue or pink coloured). So far, everyone we know who has installed the laminate, and has seniors in the house, has removed it after a year or so. My DH has done redone a lot of floors because of this issue.
darius? what has your experience been on these?
|
darius
Marion, VA
(Zone 5b)
April 26, 2007
8:11 AM Post #3433099
| I've walked on them in a flooring showroom, wouldn't have them in MY house. |
victorgardener
Lower Hudson Valley, NY
(Zone 6b)
April 26, 2007
12:36 PM Post #3434010
| I put laminate in my sons' room. I paid extra for a real thick padding. Believe me - you would much rather walk on this than hardwood. The rest of my house is hardwood and when I step into their room, it's like being on a carpet. It's also very quiet. |
podster
Deep East Texas, TX
(Zone 8a)
April 26, 2007
6:20 PM Post #3435117
| Yes, I am sure theirs was laminate as he brought some pieces to show me. The only laminate floor I walked on was in a dept store and when you walked onto it, my feet/legs sighed. The rest of the store was concrete and the laminate was laid on it but almost spongy feeling after walking the concrete.
Victor ~ you mentioned quiet. It is also sound absorbing like carpeting? |
earthling
Rowlett, TX
(Zone 8a)
April 26, 2007
6:22 PM Post #3435121
| I installed laminate flooring in my entire house and would not switch it out for anything. |
darius
Marion, VA
(Zone 5b)
April 26, 2007
6:24 PM Post #3435132
| So, maybe the answer is different qualities, different manufacturers, and different substrates? |
earthling
Rowlett, TX
(Zone 8a)
April 26, 2007
6:30 PM Post #3435153
| That could be, Darius, all I know is mine is Pergo and Armstrong and was laid on the regular padding and right on the concrete slab...
Mt son (who owns the house next door) did the garage into a room and used the laminate flooring ...bought it at the local Habitat for Humanity, so its a no-name brand...it also is very good, so not sure what the differences are except in $$$$$. |
garden_mermaid
Sunnyvale, CA
(Zone 9b)
April 26, 2007
9:26 PM Post #3435724
| So there you have it...different bodies, different tastes in flooring.
I have as yet to experience a laminate floor that had more cushion that the hardwood. Guess I'll have to come visit you, earthling & victor, to try out the flooring.
:) |
MQN
Salt Lake City, UT
(Zone 6a)
April 27, 2007
8:47 AM Post #3437033
| Not quite done yet - what about the gasing off effect of varnish vs. laminate - any thoughts? |
darius
Marion, VA
(Zone 5b)
April 27, 2007
9:23 AM Post #3437150
| laminates, like all plywood products, are made with formaldihyde (sp?). |
garden_mermaid
Sunnyvale, CA
(Zone 9b)
April 27, 2007
8:08 PM Post #3439388
| And since most building products give off something, you'll want to read the book "How to Grow Fresh Air" and then select your houseplants appropriately.
[HYPERLINK@www.amazon.com]
|
MQN
Salt Lake City, UT
(Zone 6a)
April 30, 2007
2:25 PM Post #3448423
| Good thought garden_mermaid - I have been trying to sell that theory for years. Owned a plant maintenance company in Calgary for 10 years. Sometimes plants would get bugs (go figure) - fungus gnats whatever, people just wanted me to spray whatever on it and make it go away. I tried explaining to them whatever I spray they are going to breathe also and if its not good for the bugs what makes them think its going to leave their lungs alone?
I would tell them spider plants are the most ferocious eaters of indoor pollution and that (well back then) indoor air pollution was more of a problem then outdoor. Heck, back then I think you could even smoke indoors.
One of the floors in a downtown shopping mall (its been a long time - 80's -thinking it was Toronto Dominion Bldg) was an atrium and ice rink. They got an infestation of spider mite, the maintenance firm (a friend of mine) introduced lady bugs, people that went in there to eat their lunches complained. So they nuked the bee jeezes out of it. Nobody in my industry would go in there again but no pesky lady bugs...takes all kinds. |
garden_mermaid
Sunnyvale, CA
(Zone 9b)
April 30, 2007
8:07 PM Post #3449597
| Hard to imagine disliking the lady bugs. Then again, we have some fellow gardeners at our community garden who think earthworms should be killed "because they move".
When you compare the cost of eliminating "sick building" syndrome from a mechanical approach versus a botanical approach, the plants win. Wolverton was able to address the problems in a number of "incurable" buildings through strategic use of plants.
I gave potted spathyphyllums (peace lillies) to several coworkers in the office once. After a few months they picked up some fungus gnats from a plant down the hall. One women nuked hers with pesticide to get rid of the ants. I couldn't enter her office without sneezing and chocking up. I finally took it upon myself to douse every plant in our section of the building with a bT solution every week to get them under control and prevent further pesticide spraying. |
victorgardener
Lower Hudson Valley, NY
(Zone 6b)
May 6, 2007
10:18 AM Post #3468851
| pod, sorry for the delay - I was away. No, it does not have the same sound absorbing quality in the room like a carpet. It is, after all, a hard surface. |
podster
Deep East Texas, TX
(Zone 8a)
May 6, 2007
2:30 PM Post #3469600
| Ahhh then you meant quiet as in no squeaks I take it... |
victorgardener
Lower Hudson Valley, NY
(Zone 6b)
May 6, 2007
2:34 PM Post #3469614
| That and but in my case it was installed on the second floor. When people walk in that room it is much quieter downstairs compared to the hardwood floor rooms. |
