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Here's the dilemma. And I need to get opinions before I even continue entertaining the idea. My kitchen is small. Think 1980's. But fortunately is more open than having that ugly backside of dark cabinets on top and bottom facing into your breakfast area. Mine is open on top with just a peninsula of cabinets with counter below. So it doesn't look to bad. But the traffic area is small, maybe 8x8'??? Well behind one wall of the kitchen is a small W/D room. If we relocate the W/D when we gut this kitchen I can push that whole kitchen wall back, opening up the floor space maybe 5' more deep. I could also relocate the fridge at that time which is on a central wall and juts out because of size and is right in a walkway. So the walkway opens up.
The relocation of the W/D would be on an outside wall with a door going out from the kitchen (door already exsists in the corner).
The W/D room would now be more usable space, not so much bigger, just a better layout, and we'd add a little more room to have cabinets and a stand up freezer in it.
But it would be off the kitchen wall where there is a wide short window above the kitchen sink. The window has views of part of the drive (so you see when spouse pulls up) and the full backyard.
So I either:
1) leave the window to look into the W/D room (I've seen homes with an interior window before)
2) leave the window and add another window same size in the W/D room opposite so you have window looking out through window and thus can still see the backyard but not drive
3) sheetrock in the window, thus enabling yourself to have WAY more cabinets installed in the W/D room but now you don't have your American window over your kitchen sink (I've heard this is a desired feature for buyers looking at a home).
So do you want a more updated kitchen that's bigger, a bigger W/D room and NO kitchen sink window? Or do you leave it and just update cabinets in a smaller space to save the window?
If it were me I don't personally care. But I also don't plan on living here forever. Opinions.
Note: In pic you can see the micro/stove wall, that's what would be pushed back. On right you see the window over sink. Oh yeah, that small pantry, that'd also be coming out, so the light from the door in the corner would filter more into the room, we'd extend regular counter and cabinets where the pantry is now. Pantry would be larger and relocated.
Personally I've always thought the windows that look into an interior room are a little weird, it always reminds you that something was an addition rather than a planned part of the house, then buyers start to look at it with a more critical eye, and it's all downhill from there!
I agree that I'd like a window in the kitchen, but if the window is really in the laundry room, and you're having to look through one window through the laundry room and then through the window to outside, to me that's not the same thing. (although I'd still put the window in the laundry room...never hurts to add light there either!)
Is there a way to build the laundry room so that it doesn't extend all the way out along the kitchen? Then you could make a normal window from the kitchen looking outdoors, and your laundry room would just be a bit smaller. That would be the best way to do it in my mind, but since I don't know your floorplan I don't know if that would work. Or I'd leave the kitchen as-is with the window. Before you make that call though you ought to take a look at other houses in your area that would be in a similar price range as yours. If they all have bigger kitchens, then that may not be a good option. But if their kitchens are mostly the same size as yours, then it may be fine to leave it the size it is. You might also consider getting a local realtor to come out and take a look and let you know what their recommendation would be based on what they know about your area--most realtors will be happy to come out and do things like that.
Nope, no other way to extend an addition except along the kitchen wall outside. It is in the furthest most corner of the house. The opposite side of house has patio that would be ackward to go out for a laundry room off a formal area.
Other homes have similar size kitchens and most of those people just paint the cabinets and put on a new counter top. Cheesey fix I think. I want nicer cabinets. We sell homes in this neighborhood in about 3 months time but are still competeing with new builds a few more miles out from us. Granted, in time that we sell those "new" homes will be several years old to.
Not so concerned with getting my money out of the renovation but thinking seeing a BIGGER kitchen that doesn't look the age that the home is.
So you'd like a window in the kitchen but does it need to be over the sink for value?
Because in the pic you see, the yellow wall in the background corner, a window can be added right there. But there are no other windows on that side of house and view would be of driveway and privacy fence. Could add plantings. To the right of the sink there is breakfast area with 2 large windows. Light filters in even with the wood blinds closed.
If you were keeping your home I'd say do whatever you want. But since you are thinking of selling in a few years and asked for feedback, I'd say keep the window over the kitchen sink.
As they are fond of saying on HGTV (and whatever faults they may have, which are many, they ARE good on keeping an eye on what sells mainstream), you have to do the buyers' work for them. Anything eccentric or personalized is a hard sell. There's nothing wrong with a good paint job on old cabs; as long as it looks brand spanking new people are happy. A lot of folks pay $$$ to buy painted glazed cabs - think Diane Keaton's kitchen in "Something's Gotta Give" that folks on the GW Kitchen forum were swooning over! Many people labeled it their dream kitchen.
Well you can't judge a book by it's cover and if you were to open these cheap original cabinets you would see plywood and sawdust build up as you open and close drawers over time. I always think with a mind to resell a home but even I wouldn't want just a covered paint job. We did note the kitchen needed remodeled but everything else was just what we were looking for.
You only see a clip of the peninsula counter on the right lower corner but would it help if I relocated the sink and DW to there, overlooking the breakfast nook? That way buyers aren't drawn to look at a sink with a wall behind it? My last house, built new, was designed with sink overlooking the living area instead of an outside wall. We liked it... seemed to be a popular floorplan for the neighborhood to.
Not trying to argue that yes I must have no window. Just trying to consider all my options to make this space look updated and spacious. I know most new homes tend to be connected room to room with big open spaces and large kitchens. This home is pretty open except for this small corner kitchen.
Again, would a window added to the side (be the back wall that is somewhat sunlight in the pic), help? Or is it not about added daylight but an "american dream" value that a window over a sink has? I'm not sure, so asking.
Oh, I see - you sound right to be concerned about the quality of the cabs themselves. Only the cabs are sound is it worth keeping them. You know your local market best, so if you can redo the cabs without excessive cost (DIY some RTA cabs?) you'd probably get 50-60% of the value back at resale.
If you can relocate the sink to a peninsula without too much trouble, that would be a good alternative to a window/sink pairing. Good luck!
Can you take a couple more snapshots from other angles? Honestly, from the one photo you posted, your kitchen has a lot going for it: it's light, bright, clean and neutral. Perhaps a little dated, but still in good shape. Side note: the glass mosaic tiles are a nice touch (I'm a sucker for interesting tiles)
Just my opinion, (and I don't think this is what you're suggesting, but just in case...) I think the era of over-the-top kitchens in nearly every level of home prices is about over. People are starting to realize they're sinking $25,000 to $100,000 (or more) to achieve a certain "look" in a room they rarely get the full use from (if your idea of cooking is to bake a frozen lasagna, you can do that in any cheap oven just as well as a top-of-the-line convection oven ;o)
If the housing market continues to "correct" itself, the custom cabinets, built-in commercial-grade appliances and gorgeous granite countertops won't necessarily command a premium price.
Of course, if you truly want/need a bigger kitchen, a re-do *can* at least partially pay for itself in resale. But only if it's done right. (I agree the inside window thing is an indicator of a DIY add-on - I wouldn't do it if that's the only option.)
So my humble opinion is this: unless you're in a much sought-after neighborhood where people are still willing to gut the insides of the homes and spending tens or hundreds of thousands to update them, I'd probably leave the kitchen alone. I know 8x8 is small (mine is either 8 or 9 x 20, which includes the breakfast nook, so I feel your pain - it's the smallest kitchen I've ever had.)
The cabinets look to be in decent shape in the photo - did you notice they were cheap when you were buying the house, or is this something you discovered after you moved in? If it was after, that's another reason to leave well enough alone, hard as that is when we get the itch to make changes!
We knew the cabinets were sub par. But we were comparing them to our NEW ones from home we were leaving. But we wanted an older home for the big trees in the neighborhood. So we take the lemons with the lemonade. :)
We are DIYers here so we'd buy and install our cabinets ourself. The only help would be a professional to install a real wood floor to match the rest of the downstairs. We likely would pick a simple one to order from HD that isn't top of the budget with bells and whistles. They would look nice, and better than the low end ones cookie builders install (as had in the first house) but even the insides of those are WAY nicer, they have the tracks on the drawers for easy sliding and the smooth veneer surfaces inside for easy wipe down.
Cost would be in a nice floor, replacing sink with a nicer one, and hardware. We'd replace the white fridge only because it's the oldest but we'd keep all appliances. We'd like stainless for ourselves but wouldn't recoup the cost or even sell faster with them.
Thanks for the compliments. We noted the kitchen is clean and bright to when we were looking!
If you are DIY'ers and can buy stock cabinets and install them yourselves, and then maybe upgrade the countertops, I think you can have a really wonderful kitchen without spending a ton of money. But if you want to spend even less, you'd really be amazed what a coat of paint can do for cabinets--if you're only looking towards improving impressions for resale, if you do a nice paint job and move the knobs on the cabinets to a normal position rather than in the middle of the cabinets, the buyers probably won't notice (or care) that the cabinets aren't the highest quality. Or you could also consider refacing instead of replacing--you choose a new color of wood and a new style of doors, then you basically just buy new doors, and they put a veneer over the cabinet frames, and your cabinets look brand new for a fraction of the price (I'm not sure if refacing saves you that much money vs DIY putting in new cabinets though, the real savings is vs someone else installing new cabinets)
We did gut our kitchen when we moved in (ours as a mid-70s ranch with on-site built (made from dark, cheap paneling) cabinets. Still had the old laminate countertop and avocado wall oven and separate cooktop to add to the charm. (The chicken wallpaper above the dark paneling "wainscoting" was a nice touch too ;o)
We ordered our cabinets through Home Depot, and installed them ourselves. (They're a warm-stained hickory or pecan wood, which have held up nicely. And in a small kitchen, I splurged with the pull-out drawers in most of the cabinets to maximize the limited storage space - I've never regretted spending the little extra on those.
We had the countertops measured and installed professionally. They're laminate, but one of them is a huge "u" shape that would have been nearly impossible for us to install ourselves. I'm glad I did. I also went with a deeper sink (American Standard, which has unfortunately cratered, and will need to be replaced soon), and a nicer pull-out faucet. We - like you - wanted to limit the $$$ we were putting in (it's a modest house, in a neighborhood of similar age and style homes, all on big lots - one of the big selling points.) I wanted the kitchen and baths to be updated, but I wasn't willing to spend a fortune on them, because the resale value just won't be there for the high-end stuff.
Terry, I agree with you wholeheartedly! Exactly what we are looking to do! Upgrade to a nice workable attractive kitchen, DIYer style while still staying in budget with the neighborhood. There is one home for sale that went over the top and they are asking almost 50 grand MORE than any other home (we call it the "diamond" of the neighborhood). The exterior doesn't look grand but they put a lot inside and it's been on the market almost a year. Here we have a white porcelain since, last house stainless. I didn't have a preference until using both. I'd rather have the light scratches from abrasive cleaning the stainless than the pit marks our sink has :(.
Ecrane, good tips, possibly for another situation though. As I said, these cabinets are just sawdust inside so surely not worth the effort to sand, stain, paint or anything. Relatives looked into having their newer cabinets resurfaced by HD and the price was 16 grand. I kid you not! WOW! (But HD was also way overbid on an AC/furnace replacement we've already had to do here to). So speaking of such, perhaps we'll have to look more into distributors for cabinets? I've seen the prefinished stock ones they have on hand...could almost use them. They look nice inside and out but they are an orangy oak color (in our market) and I'm just not sold on the color...but they are quite affordable.
Not looking so much for "impressions" for resale as far as----how to just make this look good to the EYE----but how can I make this kitchen something WE like to cook in, staying in a good budget, while not elimating a feature (sink window) that a potential buyer might frown on.
Really wondering if an educated buyer (as we were---looking at several homes in the same area) with an educated realtor (who really knows the area) could overlook the loss of a window, still see the area has a lot of light, has new cabinets, floor and counter (likely formica given the budget of the area---higher end cabinet and floor, lower end counter) and is also a larger kitchen than most any other home in the neighborhood. Without raising the price of the home much more than the others are asking (we will have several years to enjoy the kitchen).
I've seen several homes paint what are obviously these same cabinets (same face front with the hardware in the center lol) and put on a silestone or granite counter after painting the cabinets. I think that investment is so sad!
I really appreciate all the feedback I've gotten on this. I'm brainstorming ideas. Thinking of how I could alter the location of the WD addition without crunching out the window but just not sure there is space...and there are NO other places in the layout to put them that wouldn't look really bad...thinking...
Edited to say: we'd want a pantry almost the length of it in cabinets put here since it's out of the walking space of the actual kitchen and more central to the breakfast nook. This would eliminate the need for that sheetrocked small pantry (blocking view of light and making it a sharp turn out the backdoor) seen in the first pic.
