| Author | Content |
Lily_love
Central, AL
(Zone 7b)
February 14, 2008
12:00 PM Post #4537193
| I purchased this tree for its attractive silvery bark couple of years past. It's a fast growing tree, but has never yielded any type of flowers... 
Click the image for an enlarged view.
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Lily_love
Central, AL
(Zone 7b)
February 14, 2008
12:02 PM Post #4537202
| Up higher on the branches... 
Click the image for an enlarged view.
|
Lily_love
Central, AL
(Zone 7b)
February 14, 2008
12:03 PM Post #4537213
| Close up to reveal some wicked thorns, or 'spurs'? Please I.D. 
Click the image for an enlarged view.
|
Soferdig
Kalispell, MT
(Zone 4b)
February 14, 2008
12:22 PM Post #4537307
| Its a prickly pear cactus. I dunno. |
Lily_love
Central, AL
(Zone 7b)
February 14, 2008
12:28 PM Post #4537333
| LOL, thanks for trying anyhoooo. :-) |
HoosierGreen
Danville, IN
February 14, 2008
1:24 PM Post #4537586
| With those thorns, I would think it a variety of hawthorn, probably Crataegus viridis (Green Hawthorn). Dirr says that older stems get silver-gray and finally exfoliating to expose orange-brown inner bark. At its size, it should be flowering, but is it in a lot of shade? The best way to identify would be to see the leaves later this spring. |
Lily_love
Central, AL
(Zone 7b)
February 14, 2008
1:35 PM Post #4537641
| If indeed it's a hawthorn, I may need to move it to a sunny site, should it not putting forth flowers? I'm excited to know the possibility. I love this tree, even only for foliages. Ooooh, and the charming single white flowers and berries. My birds are going to get a treat beside many other berries available in the yards. Thank you.
[HYPERLINK@davesgarden.com] |
Equilibrium
IL &, MI
February 14, 2008
8:42 PM Post #4539464
| Nope, don't think it's Crataegus spp.
Maybe Gleditsia spp.? |
Lily_love
Central, AL
(Zone 7b)
February 14, 2008
9:00 PM Post #4539549
| Equil; the leaves are large on these, and somewhat rounded, not compound, little leavelets like that of Locusts.
Kim |
Equilibrium
IL &, MI
February 14, 2008
9:15 PM Post #4539601
| I have a Gleditsia out back that is about 5 years old and it has bark very similar to that which you shared. I'm pretty familiar with Crataegus and have some specimens of those all over the place but not all obviously as I favor the natives. What else can you remember about the leaves? Acacia was another one that came to mind for me as being thorny but the bark is all wrong for that and those thorns you photographed look pretty darn long. What about Maclura? |
Lily_love
Central, AL
(Zone 7b)
February 14, 2008
9:19 PM Post #4539618
| Not the compound leaflet of Acacia either. The leaves were shiny, leathery maybe oval rather than round, pointed ends? The bark when cold appear dark, but as the sun shines, it's really silvery smooth. No sign of fissures or crackling of the bark right down to the trunk. I'll take some more picture of the tree tomorrow for better inspection? |
Equilibrium
IL &, MI
February 14, 2008
9:39 PM Post #4539691
| Go online and see if you can spot what you remember about the leaves. They were large right? What's large to you? Those thorns look really long. How long are they really? Also too, those fissures and crackling you mentioned can come with age. |
Lily_love
Central, AL
(Zone 7b)
February 14, 2008
9:42 PM Post #4539705
| 2 1/2 " x 2" size leaves, maybe, lol I can't estimate on my pure memory, alone. The thorns are 1 1/2 - 2" long I think.
Kim |
Equilibrium
IL &, MI
February 14, 2008
10:46 PM Post #4540018
| Maybe wait for somebody else to post? Most of the trees that have thorns coming to mind for me have leaves similar to Gleditsia. Might as well sit back and wait for spring, it's right around the corner anyway and once you post the leaves somebody will probably nail it for you. Until then, just go with sofer's Opuntia. |
Lily_love
Central, AL
(Zone 7b)
February 15, 2008
9:52 AM Post #4541267
| I'm eager to know what this beauty is. I'm yearning for flowers as spring is approaching. Here is how the young tree looks at close up glance. Note the silvery muscular type of appearance of the bark. 
Click the image for an enlarged view.
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Lily_love
Central, AL
(Zone 7b)
February 15, 2008
9:55 AM Post #4541276
| Up high on the trunk with study branches, and many thorn-like "spurs" like that of Wisteria's spurs (inflorescents). 
Click the image for an enlarged view.
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Lily_love
Central, AL
(Zone 7b)
February 15, 2008
9:56 AM Post #4541281
| A little more higher up ... 
Click the image for an enlarged view.
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Lily_love
Central, AL
(Zone 7b)
February 15, 2008
10:01 AM Post #4541300
| A similar shrub in the backyard and their multiple trunks which make these plants looks shrubery...I must have liked the bark structure quite alot. I've plant these and another with two trunk...pic. is coming up next. 
Click the image for an enlarged view.
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Lily_love
Central, AL
(Zone 7b)
February 15, 2008
10:03 AM Post #4541311
| A dual trunk of another similiar tree. All of which has lots and lots of spurs (thorns). 
Click the image for an enlarged view.
|
Resin
Northumberland
(United Kingdom)
(Zone 9a)
February 15, 2008
10:40 AM Post #4541445
| How about Prunus mexicana?
Resin
|
Lily_love
Central, AL
(Zone 7b)
February 15, 2008
10:48 AM Post #4541480
| I'll keep that in mind, and watch the trees as the season progresses. Thanks Resin.
[HYPERLINK@davesgarden.com] |
Equilibrium
IL &, MI
February 15, 2008
11:10 AM Post #4541581
| Leftwood is pretty darn good at winter tree identification and he hasn’t weighed in so maybe contact him privately and ask if he’s seen this thread? I don’t think you’ve been able to provide enough information for anyone to sink their teeth into other than to take stabs at the ID based on what you can remember. More photos of the bark may or may not help. You remembered a simple leaf that wasn't lobed so that was a big help. Are there any leaves around the base of the tree that you can look at to see whether the leaf margins have teeth or not? You’d be surprised what you might be able to pick up from the ground even at this time of year so maybe there are some leaf clues waiting for you to pick them up? You were able to share that the thorns were very long which was a big help too. An inch and a half is a pretty darn long thorn. I still don't think you've got Crataegus spp. but possibly maybe run with Resin’s Prunus spp. or a Rhamnus spp. based on the leaves you described from memory? All the Rhamnus I’m familiar with usually have a tell tale dot dash pattern to the bark though but their thorns can be as long as what you photographed. The thorns on the Prunus that I am familiar with are considerably shorter but then I don’t have P. Mexicana out back either. Maybe some good photos of the branching as well as crisp photos of the leaf buds and leaf scars? In other words, really good photos of the twigs to give people more to go on for this time of year.
Another thought, maybe you could go online and find some sort of a dichotomous tree key and follow it along to the best of your recollection and see where it leads you? |
Resin
Northumberland
(United Kingdom)
(Zone 9a)
February 15, 2008
11:27 AM Post #4541689
|
| Quoted: | | enough information for anyone to sink their teeth into |
Just as long as I don't have to sink my teeth into those thorns . . .
;-)
|
Equilibrium
IL &, MI
February 15, 2008
11:52 AM Post #4541824
| They're so long they'd end up in your sinus cavities.
Did you get a look at those thorns? They're wicked! |
Lily_love
Central, AL
(Zone 7b)
February 15, 2008
11:54 AM Post #4541836
| Ok, this is my dire attempt to prove my recollection of the leave(s) But I could be wrong. Added here are more pictures for us to look at. Next come the fallen leave (maybe just maybe since there others in the area). 
Click the image for an enlarged view.
|
Lily_love
Central, AL
(Zone 7b)
February 15, 2008
11:57 AM Post #4541851
| Ventral pic. of the fallen leave...(can't be sure if this is it - but as I remembered it). 
Click the image for an enlarged view.
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Lily_love
Central, AL
(Zone 7b)
February 15, 2008
12:02 PM Post #4541875
| Posterior view. 
Click the image for an enlarged view.
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Soferdig
Kalispell, MT
(Zone 4b)
February 15, 2008
12:26 PM Post #4541988
| I agree with Resin. Some kind of prunus. Oops (on malus) The spikes are the smaller fruit buds from the sterile plant. Note buds on end. Large type fruiting buds. A good leaf picture is in the above posted #4541267. Who knows?
This message was edited Feb 15, 2008 1:39 PM |
Lily_love
Central, AL
(Zone 7b)
February 15, 2008
12:37 PM Post #4542050
| Hummm, I was gearing toward the Hawthorns...now I need to study the Malus. Thanks all.
|
Equilibrium
IL &, MI
February 15, 2008
12:50 PM Post #4542118
| Resin thought possibly Prunus.
Bring the leaves inside and place them on your kitchen table and try to take another photo backing off of the leaves a little bit. You're way too close. Can't even make out leaf margins or veining. Try some twigs the same way so folk can get a peek at the buds and such. |
Lily_love
Central, AL
(Zone 7b)
February 15, 2008
12:56 PM Post #4542154
| You're making me earn this one aren't ya? lol. Ok, ok but wait 'til the temp. warms up some. Much obliged!
|
Equilibrium
IL &, MI
February 15, 2008
1:02 PM Post #4542175
| Work woman work... or risk waiting until the tree leafs out to get an ID! |
Lily_love
Central, AL
(Zone 7b)
February 15, 2008
1:24 PM Post #4542252
| The tree orientation of branches... 
Click the image for an enlarged view.
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Lily_love
Central, AL
(Zone 7b)
February 15, 2008
1:27 PM Post #4542259
| The wicked thorns on its trunk, which are shorter, stubbier thorns. 
Click the image for an enlarged view.
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Lily_love
Central, AL
(Zone 7b)
February 15, 2008
1:29 PM Post #4542266
| Thorns appear to be longer on lateral branches... 
Click the image for an enlarged view.
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Lily_love
Central, AL
(Zone 7b)
February 15, 2008
1:30 PM Post #4542271
| The various leaves that I collected, hopefully they're the right leaves. 
Click the image for an enlarged view.
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Lily_love
Central, AL
(Zone 7b)
February 15, 2008
1:31 PM Post #4542277
| another view... 
Click the image for an enlarged view.
|
Lily_love
Central, AL
(Zone 7b)
February 15, 2008
1:34 PM Post #4542285
| and this...nonserrated edge, though slightly lobed? 
Click the image for an enlarged view.
|
HoosierGreen
Danville, IN
February 15, 2008
6:01 PM Post #4543411
| What a curious puzzle. I think it'll be solved when this tree leafs out in a few weeks. Does anyone think it might be a flowering pear? |
Leftwood
Saint Bonifacius, MN
(Zone 4a)
February 16, 2008
4:28 PM Post #4547099
| No more insight from me. Doubt it's a pear with a branch habit like that. Three different kinds of leaf samples. Wonder which it is? |
Equilibrium
IL &, MI
February 16, 2008
4:40 PM Post #4547166
| You know, I was in a slap happy mood last night and had about 20 mittens and gloves all laid out on the couch set aside hoping to find matches for them. I took a photo of them with thoughts of teasing with Lily_love a little bit and decided against asking her which mittens and gloves went to which kids because the poor thing went out and collected all those leaves then photographed them. That being said, you done good getting the photos Lily_love even if you can't go beyond the match phase. Between everyone posting here, you'll get an id on that tree sooner or later. It just may be after it leafs out though. Who knows, when it leafs out you may be able to figure it out by yourself. Just don't forget everyone back here if you do and come back and share what your mystery tree is. |
Lily_love
Central, AL
(Zone 7b)
February 16, 2008
5:53 PM Post #4547516
| Arrrrrrgh! Got to give me the credit for trying. LOL, At this point if I would guess, I'd say it's a Hawthorn. Someone has hawthorn in your back yard, please come and help me please.
|
Equilibrium
IL &, MI
February 16, 2008
5:55 PM Post #4547521
| I have several hawthorns in my back yard and I can't help you because something doesn't seem quite right. Wish I could help you, but I can't. I even went outside in my slippers trudging through a couple feet of snow to take a look at the one closest to my house. |
Lily_love
Central, AL
(Zone 7b)
February 16, 2008
6:51 PM Post #4547712
| Equil, we owe you a boat ride, whenever you get to visit our neck of the woods. Tehehehehe. Stay warm. 
Click the image for an enlarged view.
|
Equilibrium
IL &, MI
February 16, 2008
7:17 PM Post #4547822
| I am going to get down to explore Alabama one of these days. There ya go again posting that lake down in AL! Your lake and dock are very inviting. I could see floating around in an inner tube with my body parts dangling out into that water on a warm summer's day. For now, I guess I have to make do with what I have and about the only thing that comes close would be our jet tub upstairs with a bunch of white walls. It will fit an inner tube but you wouldn't exactly be able to dangle your body parts over the edge an into the water. (sign) must make do with what one has. |
Soferdig
Kalispell, MT
(Zone 4b)
February 16, 2008
8:09 PM Post #4548003
| I too would like to visit Alabama. But I don't speak their language. Anyway I hate the new "Bama" football coach. Nick Saban left we poor Michigan State Spartans on our way to a bowl. Then he left LSU to go to Miami Dolphins, then he left them to go to Alabama. Yes he is good but look out when you are going for the national championship he will retire. Ahh that felt good to vent. LOL |
Equilibrium
IL &, MI
February 16, 2008
8:11 PM Post #4548012
| I don't follow football. What exactly is wrong with their new coach? |
Lily_love
Central, AL
(Zone 7b)
February 16, 2008
8:12 PM Post #4548015
| You're welcome here at any time, I may even cook breakfast for you. Just to prove our Southern hospitality.
Sincerely yours,
Kim |
Lily_love
Central, AL
(Zone 7b)
February 16, 2008
8:14 PM Post #4548019
| Oooops, football and I? Is just about like me and the trees that I try to get I.D.'ed. lol, gotta get my hubby to answer that question. lol.
|
Soferdig
Kalispell, MT
(Zone 4b)
February 16, 2008
8:21 PM Post #4548048
| He is climbing a ladder that leaves everyone behind. It is probably what he should do but I don't honor such people. |
Lily_love
Central, AL
(Zone 7b)
February 16, 2008
8:33 PM Post #4548093
| Like I mentioned, gotta invite hubby here for the debate. But he's busy watching the Nascar Race...
"I've no trouble with Nick Saban, he's probably is the best coach Alabama has hired in a long while...but I do know he doesn't stay much longer than 5 years- term anywhere. The media tend to write negative about him, because he isn't very tolerance of repeated questions being asked in many different ways". That is in a nut shell, what hubby said. I'll stay clear of any comment since I don't follow the game. Back to my gardening. :-) |
Equilibrium
IL &, MI
February 16, 2008
8:56 PM Post #4548219
| OK, think I'll go back to gardening stuff too, I never did understand why grown men grabbed footballs out from between each other's legs at a start of a game anyway and then they all pile on top of each other during the game and some of the injuries some of those players must have to deal with for the rest of their lives must be incredible. |
Soferdig
Kalispell, MT
(Zone 4b)
February 16, 2008
9:08 PM Post #4548260
| We men were born and created Warriors. Now with all the laws and governments we have no battles left. Therefore football. Iraq and all of the current wars are too far from home to get involved and not threatening to our families. The Greeks, Romans, Egyptians, and any other advanced civilizations built their identy on the battle. Now we are reduced to sports to bind together. |
Lily_love
Central, AL
(Zone 7b)
February 16, 2008
9:15 PM Post #4548287
| Ya know, I understand the theory of men and wars. But if women and men were to battle, I bet you WE win hand down. lol,lol. (I believe Equil. will take my side on this one). Common girlfriend, it's time we do some women-bonding. lol,lol.
Kim |
Equilibrium
IL &, MI
February 16, 2008
9:24 PM Post #4548326
| Fair enough sofer but please explain why I can hear my MIL hooting and howling all the way on the other side of the house when her football team is winning? I still don't get into football or basketball. Way too many injuries. Watching golf is about as exciting as watching paint dry. I do like hiking and snowshoeing though but most people don't. Canoeing is another really great sport.
I don't know that we'd win with me on your team unless they gave in to us to shut us up. I don't run all that fast anymore and I've always been a klutz (sp?). I suppose I'd have a fighting chance if I could stay off the injured list for one full season but my track record hasn't been all that great as of the last few years. Gardening is a tough sport but somebody's got to do it. |
Lily_love
Central, AL
(Zone 7b)
February 16, 2008
9:31 PM Post #4548351
| Very diplomatic approach. But, you do make a good point. :-) I understand your feeling about injuries in sports.
Our son plays soccer. But when he last sustained an injury it was when he ran down the stair with a basket of laundry. lol,lol. |
Equilibrium
IL &, MI
February 16, 2008
9:38 PM Post #4548382
| It wasn't diplomatic but sort of telling the truth. If you had any idea how many body parts I've broken and how I broke them in the last few years you'd be reduced to gasping for air while grabbing onto something to stabilize yourself so you didn't fall over from laughing so hard. Although I have girlfriends who would be great on an X team, I can assure you that you wouldn't want me.
Ours do soccer too. No injuries so far but had one screw himself up royally at a dance showing off for a girl. He had knee surgery and was good as new in about 6 months. You know what gets me? When they go rock repelling. I can't even watch. The new thing is to do something called splunking (sp?). That's where they go into these narrow caves with... are you sitting down... oxygen tanks. Yup, oxygen tanks to get to some of the deep dark recesses of some caves. They call it a sport. I can't get the visual out of my head of one of them accidentally slicing their oxygen line. They call me the fun police. |
Lily_love
Central, AL
(Zone 7b)
February 16, 2008
9:46 PM Post #4548416
| Sports to me is all good, over others that young people may like to get engaged on these days..., minus serious injuries ofcourse. In my younger years, I tried rock climbing. What an ecredible feeling it's when you get up on top of the rocks...then looking down. Needless to say, I didn't stay with the sport very long. But glad that I did it. Then when daughter announced that she has signed up for rock-climbing lessons recently. I nearly have a heart attack. So there. Me too, another fun police mate. :-)
|
Equilibrium
IL &, MI
February 16, 2008
9:49 PM Post #4548432
| A fellow fun police officer I can certainly relate to! |
Lily_love
Central, AL
(Zone 7b)
February 16, 2008
9:53 PM Post #4548449
| Ok, back to my mysterious tree. You have Hawthorn and they don't look anything like it??? |
Soferdig
Kalispell, MT
(Zone 4b)
February 16, 2008
9:55 PM Post #4548455
| Injuries are a serious problem in any sport. But if there were none ,like golfing, nobody would watch. Man is a animal who likes to battle. Sports are a way to do that outside of war. Women too enjoy the battle but in a different way. They identify with the win and feel attached to that. I like football because I played football and relive the experiences that were valuable to me and helped develop my moving to manhood. There is one book that explain all of this, "Fire in the belly". It explains the reason for men to get into such silliness is to allow them to pass from childhood to manhood much like the first battle. Also you can go back to the Civil War and the first battle of Bull Run. There were more people (men and women) watching the battle than were fighting it. Spectators are those who emotionally are attached, in what ever way to the outcome of the sport. Hiking, caneoing, etc are participatory sports not spectator sports. They only attract ones to partake in it, not watch. You need to understand that as men we need to go through a process lacking in today's society. We are not taken and initiated by our male elders on what we are expected to do and be. This initiation is bypassed by drinking and sports.
Your tree is not a hawthorn. The bark is not at all like hawthorn.
This message was edited Feb 16, 2008 6:58 PM |
Leftwood
Saint Bonifacius, MN
(Zone 4a)
February 16, 2008
10:39 PM Post #4548656
|
| Quoted: | | please explain why I can hear my MIL hooting and howling all the way on the other side of the house when her football team is winning? |
She would be a cross-over. I'm one too, and darn proud to be one(in that respect). Don't care about following sports.
------------------------------
Note to self:
No running with scissors
No running with a basket of laundry
------------------------------
Spelunking. Not too crazy about it either, but, to each their own craziness. I'm sure your hubbies would say the same thing about us spending all this time trying to identify a tree. . .
Rick
Hawthorns just don't have those swollen branch nodes that are so prominent in your pics, at least the ones I've seen. Gotta remember, we're northerners.
This message was edited Feb 16, 2008 8:40 PM |
Lily_love
Central, AL
(Zone 7b)
February 16, 2008
10:47 PM Post #4548694
| I thought hawthorn fares better up North? At one point I thought certain tree won't bloom adequately if they didn't get so many chilled-hours in the season? |
Equilibrium
IL &, MI
February 16, 2008
11:12 PM Post #4548780
| I understand an initiation process exists, not that I fully understand the process but I know it exists and try my best to be respectful of whatever it is. This is why I try to stay out of their way but I do still have heart failure from time to time and that repelling gets to me so I won't watch. I do wish they'd be more interested in sole operator sports rather than team sports but I could really do without them repelling and splunking.
My MIL is really something else but I've got personal girlfriends who are also equally wrapped up in football. I still don't get it, best for me to re-fill their chip and dip bowls.
I haven't stabbed myself with scissors... yet. |
Leftwood
Saint Bonifacius, MN
(Zone 4a)
February 17, 2008
10:10 AM Post #4549744
|
| Quoted: | | I thought hawthorn fares better up North? |
In general, I'd say yes. But that doesn't mean there aren't hawthorn species that might be common farther south that I wouldn't know about. |
Lily_love
Central, AL
(Zone 7b)
June 18, 2008
10:23 AM Post #5122134
| Thanks everyone for your interests, and help. I went back to the Nursery that I purchased the tree from. Indeed they confirmed that it was a Washintonian hawthorn! Leftwood, since I discovered its identity. I've seen many more in the surrounding area. Just like purchasing a new vehicles -- all a sudden you see similiar car just about every where. lol. Thanks all, it was a fun ride...
Kim |
