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Japanese Maples: New Leaf Acer Palmatum Shishi Yatsubusa

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Forum: Japanese MaplesReplies: 36, Views: 734
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davesnursery
Milford, DE

March 18, 2008
8:34 PM

Post #4679477

I do not know if this is the right name or not. It resembles Acer Palmatum Shishio Hime.
I thought I would share the remarkable colors.

Thumbnail by davesnursery
Click the image for an enlarged view.

mattlwfowler
Walhalla, SC

March 19, 2008
2:47 AM

Post #4680930

Cute one, how long does the color last?
davesnursery
Milford, DE

March 19, 2008
10:54 AM

Post #4681539

Well Matt this is one of the maples most complement on. If memory serves me right, I believe that the colors last at least two months and then the light green turns to a darker green and the red margins start to fade the a thinner margin.

Dave
doss
Stanford, CA
(Zone 9b)

March 20, 2008
3:23 AM

Post #4685167

What beautiful foliage. Stunning.
davesnursery
Milford, DE

March 20, 2008
10:53 AM

Post #4685732

Thanks. I have about 150-200 cultivars and I will try to show pictures of the ones that I think are interesting. It will take some time though do to the fact that they are still breaking bud from grafting and then I need to wait until the full color appears.

Dave
myrtnj
Collingswood, NJ

March 20, 2008
5:44 PM

Post #4687099

I am looking for ideas of maple(s) to plant. I live in NJ, next to Philadelphia. I have part sun in front yard and would like to plant a mid size maple or 2 dwarf maples that would complement each other. I want to plant partially grown maples, not twigs, since I will only be in the home 4 years. I saw a 5 ft butterfly maple and a similar size Sango Kaku maple at a nursery. They were lovely. Before I decide, I thought I'd ask for ideas. I am interested in year round color. Ialready have a 12 foot "standard" maple in my front yard -- it turns sort of bronze and is light or dark green other times of the year. It is graceful, but not unique. For my upcoming purchase, I want pizzazz -- like variegated or pink. Any ideas? P.S. i am on a river and can get some wind in winter, if that makes big difference to the type of maple selected.

THANK YOU
Davidsan
Springfield, IL
(Zone 6a)

March 20, 2008
11:04 PM

Post #4688118

Your siting will very much limit your choices or not ..Butterfly is a nice tree but needs siome shade ...best limited or filtered sun as do most variegates ...If you have never owned a JM I do not think a variegated JM is a good choice probably the best and easiest to grow is Oridono nishiki it has variable variegation ...but is really a pretty tree and can take "some" sun ...it also has pink orange and yellow new branches in winter...as far as sango ...don't get me started ..pure junk IMHO ...Many red cultvars have redish or orangeish branches especially in late winter ...not like the sango but at least they survive most areas I wouldn't even recommend the sango for container ...if you want to do container with that sort of tree try Japanese Sunrise ...A much better tree ...everyone here knows my hatred for the Sango so if I sound repetitious ...sorry ;>) David
wha
Pepperell, MA
(Zone 6a)

March 21, 2008
9:27 PM

Post #4692170

David I have to tell you that I think of you every time I see a sango. I just unwrapped mine out front today and it came through the winter in flying colors. The larger one out back as well. Then on the way to the dump today I saw a stunning one on someones lawn. If I had a camera with me I would have posted it for you. Just how many have died on you?

For someone down in the philly area I do not think they would have to worry to much about planting a sango. Maybe Davesnursery could chime in on it's survival chances seeing as he is in the Jersy area.
davesnursery
Milford, DE

March 21, 2008
9:50 PM

Post #4692234

As long as Sango Kaku is in a protected area away from the biting winds it should be fine. I have a friend where I cut the scion wood off of his 2 trees and they are approx. 10' high x 8' wide and his are in perfect condition. As others have said here before and I will say again move these plants a couple of feet and the conditions can change. Some maples are hardier than others, but if you can protect all from the heat of the day and the winds of winter, then there should be no problems.

Dave
HoosierGreen
Danville, IN

March 22, 2008
12:25 AM

Post #4692770

If you have part sun, and want year-round interest, plant a weeping, cutleaf variety. Great branching structure and come in red or green. Depending on the nurseries in your area, selection might be limited, but look for 'Crimson Queen', Tamukeyama', Inaba Shidare', or 'Red Dragon' (all red) or 'Viridis' (emerges red, changes to green in summer, with brilliant orange color in fall). The better uprights, in my opinion, are good 'ole 'Bloodgood' and 'Emperor'. They can take some wind, in my experience. Just be sure to plant them in good rich soil, and mulch well. Keep watered in dry summer weather. There's lots of info on this site!
Davidsan
Springfield, IL
(Zone 6a)

March 22, 2008
12:28 AM

Post #4692780

What Dave says is true ..but I will tell you for every success story there are 10 w/o success .They are both NOT hardy to winter colds they don't like wind and hate sun in summer HUMMM great tree...with the many hundreds of varieties out there that are NOT so touchy why bother ...As I said the Japanese Sunsise is IMHO in every way a better tree but also not winter hardy...two out of three trunmps the sango ...but to each his or her own In a perfect area it will do ok ...those for most folks are few and far between.In addition there may be some "strains" that may be better or closer to the original or not bred with certain genetic flaws than others daves tree scions may be from such a tree descended more directly from the oringinal. This species has been over grafted to oblivian... Some will have success .Doss does ..but to recommend such a touchy tree and promote it is not a good thing.As I have said with so many other "special" JM's that will work in sun,wind, cold etc ...why bother.david
davesnursery
Milford, DE

March 22, 2008
10:47 AM

Post #4694211

I have to agree that there are many more interesting maples out there than to loose site on Sango Kaku. Do some exploring and you will be surprised.

Dave
maplecollector
Boulder, CO

March 23, 2008
6:13 AM

Post #4697860

Yes that is Shishi Yatsubusa. Shishi Yatsubusa is an outstanding Dwarf cultivar. One of my favorites. Outstanding star shaped leaves.

MapleCollector
terrimckyd
Omaha, NE
(Zone 5a)

April 10, 2008
2:38 PM

Post #4786725

wha: Just curious...why do you wrap your Sango?
wha
Pepperell, MA
(Zone 6a)

April 11, 2008
5:34 PM

Post #4792786

I wrap and spray with wilt proof several trees and shrubs to protect against wind burn. My neighbors have a side open front yard that resembles the serengeti so it winter winds can be tough. It seems to work hydrangea's that never flowered due to die back now thrive and the Sango Kaku is doing great. Here is a picture.

Thumbnail by wha
Click the image for an enlarged view.

terrimckyd
Omaha, NE
(Zone 5a)

April 11, 2008
8:02 PM

Post #4793481

wha- Gorgeous! I occasionally wrap the trunks to deter the whascully whabbits, but have never sprayed wilt proof on any of my j. maples or hydrangeas. Sounds like a good plan and I hope I remember to try that next fall. Do you think wilt proof would help in the heat of summer when it seems impossible to keep the hydrangeas hydrated?

Here is a pic I took today & just posted on my blog of my 8 yr. old 'never-been-coddled' coral bark maple.

Thumbnail by terrimckyd
Click the image for an enlarged view.

wha
Pepperell, MA
(Zone 6a)

April 11, 2008
8:38 PM

Post #4793690

terri - Very nice. Next time tell those neighbors to keep thier cars off teh street:)

Here is a picture of my eight year old never coddled and moved once coral bark maple. It really is eight.

Thumbnail by wha
Click the image for an enlarged view.

mattlwfowler
Walhalla, SC

April 12, 2008
1:30 AM

Post #4795160

Wish we could grow blue spruce down here :(
doss
Stanford, CA
(Zone 9b)

April 12, 2008
4:12 AM

Post #4795960

I grow bird's nest spruce but it's just not the same - I love all of the evergreens that don't grow well here.
terrimckyd
Omaha, NE
(Zone 5a)

April 12, 2008
4:06 PM

Post #4797506

I guess we are never happy all the time! There are so many plants I would like to grow that you southerners and Californians can! Your coral barks are really fine, wha. I am jealous. I am trying a new cultivar from California, J. palmatum 'Beni kawa', that I planted last spring...so far it looks very good this year. I am encouraged because we stayed very cold all winter and a late winter bud break has been my toughest issue with J. maples. The picture is from last fall. Has anyone grown this cultivar and have any advice or comments? Thanks!

And...wilt proofing in summer heat for hydrangeas and/or J. maples? Good or bad idea?

Thumbnail by terrimckyd
Click the image for an enlarged view.

doss
Stanford, CA
(Zone 9b)

April 12, 2008
5:44 PM

Post #4797950

It's beautiful. I hope that it does well for you. I haven't tried wilt-proofing my hydrangeas or my JM's but may try it on my hydrangeas this summer. All of my maples do pretty well and leaf burn is minimal so I think that I can get away with not doing it to my maples. Most of them are pretty big to spray anyway.
terrimckyd
Omaha, NE
(Zone 5a)

April 13, 2008
1:16 PM

Post #4801262

Doss-Thanks, but it is in desperate need of shaping. I will do it this week, maybe today. I have enjoyed the color quite a bit and have not wanted to diminish it.

So your maples are big? Mine are lots of sizes, but none really large yet. I have a 14' Sherwood's Flame and an Ukigumo a bit taller than that, but here in the Midwest I contend with tip die-back most springs. Your must have some dormant time...do they color well for you in the fall there?
doss
Stanford, CA
(Zone 9b)

April 13, 2008
9:09 PM

Post #4803235

A 14 foot Sherwood Flame must be beautiful. None of mine are tall - just mature. No dormant time for them here but JM's seem to thrive on that. We are having a problem here with trees that grow much larger than the common consensus because they've only really been growing them in this climate since the 70's There is a seedling planted at the nursery that is easily two stories tall. I've had to learn to prune to keep things where I want them but it's been a fun process. No tip dieback here.
terrimckyd
Omaha, NE
(Zone 5a)

April 14, 2008
1:44 PM

Post #4806472

Well, Doss, it was 23 degrees here last night and I am happy the trees have not broken bud! Pruning is one of my favorite activities with the JMs, they respond beautifully and it sounds like you like it too. Do you bonsai any? I would like to pot one up sometime and try that.

I have one two year old seedling in the garden and I have a little wire beehive shaped cage over it. To give you perspective, at two years it is about 5 inches tall is all!


Davidsan
Springfield, IL
(Zone 6a)

April 14, 2008
2:04 PM

Post #4806592

You guys point out very valid observations ... that there is a big =differnce in growing JM's in borderline areas and JM perfect or suitable areas. A seedling at dosses may grow a foot or more a year in the right place ...not so her in central Illinois oe NE...same with grafted cultivars which is one reason I advise folks to save their money and buy a bit larger starter JM...It usually takes one -three years for JM's to really take off here if planted out so a 6" plant will likely be 4-5 years past planting to really show it's stuff . in containers it is faster.If your in your 20's I guess that is ok ...your 50-60's that is a really long time to wait to enjoy a purchase. In addition the root system is small and subject to winter kill wetness etc. Folks that give 3 foot gowth of seed grown cultivars in less than perfect conditions in 1-2 years are just NOT correct...Even under perfect conditions that is rare but possible with alot of pushing ( fertlizer). Hopefully folks will see that each area is differnt ...microclimates create exceptions and the actuality in colder zones between success and failure can be measured in feet .David
terrimckyd
Omaha, NE
(Zone 5a)

April 14, 2008
4:51 PM

Post #4807367

Oh Yes! In feet and in the vagaries of the unpredictable weather! I have had the best success with trees of all sizes planted on the South downhill sloped side of my garden that is protected from fierce North winds and there is a good wind break on the South side to protect from the desiccating summer winds. Yet, I confess to a loss of 10-20% in branch death and tree death in an average/year. I have some incredible successes here though as well, my oldest tree is a green weeping dissectum of indeterminate cultivar planted in 1989, now 5' tall and at least 7' wide. It is a star in my fall border. And an Inaba Shidare that faces North and is in a wind tunnel by the garage that is spectacularly healthy

Thumbnail by terrimckyd
Click the image for an enlarged view.

doss
Stanford, CA
(Zone 9b)

April 14, 2008
5:34 PM

Post #4807561

You are right. That is a spectacular tree. Beautiful
digger9083
Dahlonega, GA

April 22, 2008
6:16 PM

Post #4847525

terri, what is that beautiful shrub behind and to the left of jm?
mattlwfowler
Walhalla, SC

April 23, 2008
1:02 AM

Post #4849338

Purple smoke tree perhaps?
digger9083
Dahlonega, GA

April 23, 2008
12:11 PM

Post #4851345

looks like something i need a coupla of ,for background . i'll look them up .
davesnursery
Milford, DE

May 15, 2008
11:33 PM

Post #4956916

Update on Acer Palmatum Shishi Yatsubusa. 2 Pics. with second flush of growth and color.

Dave

Thumbnail by davesnursery
Click the image for an enlarged view.

davesnursery
Milford, DE

May 15, 2008
11:34 PM

Post #4956920

The other one.

Dave

Thumbnail by davesnursery
Click the image for an enlarged view.

doss
Stanford, CA
(Zone 9b)

May 16, 2008
12:13 AM

Post #4957119

Beautiful foliage Dave. I can see why you are happy about this one.
terrimckyd
Omaha, NE
(Zone 5a)

May 25, 2008
1:46 PM

Post #5000470

Sorry I have been so busy planting I have neglected the forum! The plant behind and to the left of the JM is indeed a smokebush...one of the older cultivars, 'royal purple'. I cut them back hard every spring to get all new branching that is vertical and 18' tall or so with all new colorful leaves and no flowers. The leaves from the new wood also color better in the fall. There is a newer cultivar named 'grace' that is even more lovely in my opinion.

I am so sad. Remember the inabe shidare I was bragging about that I had on the NW side of my property in the wind, etc.? It suffered terribly this cold spring and is just now starting to try to leaf out. I think I may have lost half of the tree or more and it may not survive. My only hope is that it responds like my 'autumn moon', also on the north side, that I have decided not to prune until June 1. It's dead looking branches are now leafing after it put on a huge spurt of new growth below the dead-looking parts. Here is a pretty pic of another baby 'autumn moon' elsewhere in the garden fronting a magnolia 'butterflies'. Anyone have any advice on my slow leafing inabe?

Thumbnail by terrimckyd
Click the image for an enlarged view.

doss
Stanford, CA
(Zone 9b)

May 25, 2008
6:58 PM

Post #5001651

What a shame. It's so hard to see damage to a beautiful tree like that.
Davidsan
Springfield, IL
(Zone 6a)

May 25, 2008
8:00 PM

Post #5001870

It likely suffered wind/cold damage to some branches causing die back NO big deal it will regrow .I have some die back on alot of my trees even in mild winter sometimes cause of late fall bust of growth..the slow leafing is probably the fault of root death from cold or too wet ...if it leaves out you will be fine ..I'd probably mulch heavier next winter.and not fall water..root death on planted JM would require a very severe cold winter...yours was probably just damaged and as it regrows the top will releaf( not the dead branches) with it getting proper nutrients which with a damaged or destroyed RS it will not ...if it is beginning to leaf you are probably ok ...just wait and see. David
maureen1952
Worcester, MA

May 28, 2008
7:11 PM

Post #5016175

I am trying to ID a dwarf japanese maple for an elderly couple i know. I don't have a picture of the whole tree but I do have pictures of the leaves. They tell me that they get a bit darker as the sumer goes on, but each stays multicolored.

Thumbnail by maureen1952
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