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I am removing grass from an area and putting native plants in. I dug out the existing grass sod and placed it in other areas of my yard that were low or thin. Since removing the sod now the area is lower than the surrounding grass. I want to fill it back in but don't want to mess up my native soil too much. It is currently acidic and clayish. I am in the process of hand digging and picking up rocks. I was thinking about adding bags of plain topsoil. I don't know about peat moss??? Since the current soil is clayish it doesn't really need anything to help retain moisture, but should I use something organic to lighten it up a little? I am a little confused. I know I am not supposed to use fertilizer because it makes the soil too rich---not good for natives. I don't have access to compost. Anyone have any ideas for me?
Hi Julie,
I have clay soil too and I'm also raising many native plants here. I've been working in peat moss and, so far, everything is growing great and seems quite happy. I haven't seen where it has increased the moisture retention to a great degree. I' know there are some folks who don't like using peat but it's working great for me.
fertilizer in just the right amount doesn't overdo the soil. nitrogen gets used up and needs to be replenished every year. You need organic matterial in the soil to help the clay not be so heavy. Toop soil you buy is full of sand, i would use soil conditioner from lowes, it's 2.77 per bag, in nashville. It conrtains small shredded pine that works well in the soil. YOu say it's acidic have you had a soil samp,e if so, shoot those numbers out and i can translate them to you.
Julie, you can buy mushroom compost at Walmart. It is not expensive. You can also shred (by hand) leaves and add to the mix. That is -your native soil, compost and leaves mixed together. In my zone I always add peat moss. I have dry hard red clay and we are in a drought. I hope this helps if not send me a post. Smokey
I have been killing myself turning the soil shovel by shovel and picking rocks out of the clay. Arrrrgh! I hope it is worth it! Once this is done I will add the peat moss / leaves / something organic ??? AGAIN turning it shovel by shovel. What a job. I want to do it right the first time, though.
Julie,
If you're not putting out any plants till next spring, you could do a lasagna bed. That way by spring, you'd have a beautiful patch of organic soil. After you get your rocks dug out, you can layer cardboard, newspaper, grass clippings, straw, vegetable scraps, etc. and just keep building it up over the winter. It will break down into organic matter that you can plant directly into come spring--no more hard digging required :-).
I took NatureLover's advice and added some peat moss and I found some soil conditioner by just getting out and looking around in the back lot at Lowes. So, thanks kitten for that...
This is a picture of my area during the sod removal process.
Here it is with the grass totally removed. It is about 25 feet long and about 10 feet wide. I tried to make it somewhat asymmetrical. Now for the fun part, picking out the plants.
Isn't amending the soil for native plants kinda like looking for cactus that grow well in the wetlands?? I guess i don't understand why you want to grow natives.
Often the soil in a yard is poorer quality than what a plant would have in nature because of things like the ground getting compacted and most of the good topsoil being stripped off when the house is built, lawn chemicals killing beneficial microorganisms in the soil, etc so adding some amendments like leaves, etc could help make the soil healthier and bring it closer to what the plant would experience out in nature. Depending on what plants they are you could probably get away without amending too, but it wouldn't hurt anything to do it.
Len123, I will share some of my rationale for establishing this native area. I wonder what my neighbors think about this process, too. Digging up my yard! haha
I am on the end of a cul-de-sac with beautiful woodland covering half of my property. I would like to add some balance to my yard by moving some native plants to the relatively barren lawn on the opposite side of my property. The lawn was spotty and weedy anyway, full of clay and stones. When I removed the grass, I took out a good four or five inches off the top, so it needed to be filled in. I took care not to add any fertilizer, but I added the peat moss, topsoil, and some chopped up leaves from the woods.
I hope that when it is complete it will look more natural like the other part of my property. This is a sunny area, so I have transplanted sumac, yucca, black-eyed susans, and daylilies so far. I have also hauled some fairly large rocks up from the woods. All freebies! Just a lot of sweat labor!
Julie, i wish you more success than i have had in trying to establish natives. My native is the prairie, i never had much luck unless the natives were already here. I tilled and planted about $1200 worth of seeds, prairie grasses and wildflowers, but I only have a few mexican hats to show for it and maybe a couple of wild gaura. That was a couple years ago. I have bought a few native plants from the prairie center that should survive. I never bought any black-eyed susans because a few were growing wild on the west side, and wouldn't you know it they jumped around to the front of the house last year,lol. I had better luck with the birdseed growing than any native seed i've bought. But then again, i suppose if the natives were that adapted, they would still be here, so something has definitely changed. Roses and iris' are the new natives!
Len123-- Yikes! That's a lot of money for not much result. I bet that broke your heart. Maybe you have some biennials that haven't shown themselves yet. (?)
julie, that's what they said, if they don't come up the first year they usually will the second, but the second has come and gone,lol. Yes it makes me sick, because i could have bought a lot more roses for that kind of money. It certainly taught me a lot, along with many other plants that i've wasted money on.
Len123,
When did you plant all your natives--spring or fall? I've had much better luck with fall planting, especially when I'm digging plants up from the wild to move to my yard. I also try to duplicate the conditions they had in the wild. Things like oak leaf hydrangea grow out of nasty looking clay banks in our woods so I put some down by the creek and they are doing great so far. Ditto for some evergreen ferns I found that I've found growing in the same nasty looking clay banks as well as in the more fertile, organic soil under trees out in the woods. I did amend the soil when I planted all my plants but not quite as much as I do for things I buy at the nursery.
Julie,
I've blown my budget on wildflower seeds (hubby and kids are on a rice and beans diet now that food $$ are spent) so I have no way to amend the soil with much peatmoss besides what little I've got, plus a pile of mulched grass clippings.
In March I plan to prepare the site with roundup on the lawngrass, then tilling in what mulch I have to a depth of a couple inches. I also live at the end of a cul-de-sac with the property on old pasture but with 530' (1/10 mile) of our property line adjacent to some beautiful white oak-hickory hardwoods (not on our property, darn it). I planted an orchard with serviceberries and hazelnuts near the woods edge, and will run a strip about 2 tiller passes wide for wildflowers for the 530 feet plus about another 200' up the other property line inside a fence. I'll widen the strip to include all of the serviceberries/mulberries to reduce mowing around them since they are closely-planted.
I hope I can keep the flower seeds watered well enough to establish the wildflowers; I hate to think of all the money I spent at Americanmeadows and ebay shriveling up and dying! Should have done this in the fall, but timing was off. Len123, thanks! You've given me great resolve to keep the strip watered and do my darndest!
Well, if the flowers don't make it, at least I'll get alot of exercise with all that tilling!
Any recommendations would be greatly appreciated! Great thread!
JuneyBug Dongducheon CpCasey South Korea (Zone 4b)
Thanks JuneyBug!
Great idea, but the woods are not on our property and I don't want to be caught trespassing... I will see if a stable across town has some manure they want to get rid of, although we only have a van to transport it. I sure miss our truck!
I will direct sow the wildflower mixes I got from American meadows, and most of the annuals and some perennials I got on ebay, and pray for rain this spring while spending all dry spring days using the hose where I soaker hoses don't reach.
For backup, tho, I also bought seed starter trays and 200 - 3 1/2 inch pots to baby some of the more expensive perennials along this summer. Could I get 2 batches of plants out of these 200 pots if I get the early germinaters started in March? Not sure how long it will take the plants to get a root system developed if they're kept in morning sun at the side of my house.
This project sure will keep me busy and off the streets ;-)
If I don't finish this summer, and I won't with all the seeds I bought, I can then start the hobby of winter sowing this winter!
