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Seed Germination: When to sow spreadsheet!

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klstuart
Simpsonville, SC
(Zone 7b)

January 17, 2009
4:29 PM

Post #6016256

We've started a spreadsheet, with advice on when to sow each type of seed, in 'weeks before last frost date' format so that it can be interpreted for each area.

It's rough so far, but I'm hoping everyone might add their own info (weeks, and add seeds I don't have listed too!) in posts here, and I'll update the spreadsheet accordingly.

Here's the spreadsheet, I'll check back regularly to update it with information from posts. Suggestions welcome :)

http://spreadsheets.google.com/ccc?key=ptKk7FNDx_-LNbZM431UzDQ&hl=en

Another great resource suggested is http://www.backyardgardener.com/tm.html

This message was edited Mar 18, 2009 10:00 AM
Lala_Jane
North West, OH
(Zone 5b)

January 17, 2009
5:57 PM

Post #6016596

Kelly I replied to you re this topic in the cottage forum, but I'll post it here too. Just a couple posts down Debsroots was asking basically the same question. I would love to see a master list telling us when to start our seeds if we want blooms by such and such a date. I will happily give you all the information I've dug up thus far (mostly from Stokes site) and I would think that some commercial packets might give us that info as well. Some time this weekend I'll try to get my meager findings sent your way.
klstuart
Simpsonville, SC
(Zone 7b)

January 17, 2009
6:27 PM

Post #6016711

Thanks! I'm watching everywhere, just another reason to obsess over seeds :) Added a few columns. I'm going back and getting the temp. info off of the Summerhill seed packets I have now. They don't have weeks before frost info though, which is what got me started on this quest in the first place!
joannabanana
Calgary, AB
(Zone 3a)

January 17, 2009
6:42 PM

Post #6016757

Here's a little list from a few years ago

NEED LIGHT Don't Cover
Agreatum Feb 15
Balsam Apr 1
Begonias Jan 15
Black-eye Susan Vine Apr 1
Browallia
Clarkia
Coleus
Diascia
Dusty Miller
Eucalyptus (Chill Seeds 2 Days)
Evening Scented Stocks
Godetia
Impatiens
Kochia
Licorice Plant
Lisianthus
Lobelia
Mignoette
Nemesia
Petunias 10 weeks
Portulaca
Salvia
Scarlet Sage
Snapdragons
Strawflowers
Sweet Alyssum

SOME LIGHT, Barely Covered
African Dasies
Amaranthus
Anagalis
Aster
Brachycome
Candytuff
Celosia
Cleome
Cosmos
Dianthus
Marigold
Mimulas
Nicotiana
Nigella
Status
Stocks
Tithonia-Mexican Sunflower
Wishbone
Zinnia

TOTAL DARKNESS, Do Not Cover Seeds with Soil; Cover the Flat
Bells or Ireland (Alternate Chill Flat for 5 Weeks)
Calendula
Gazania
Livingstone Daisy
Pansies (Chill Flat for 1 Week)
Phlox
Salpiglossis
Schizanthus
Verbena
Vinca

NEED DARKNESS, Cover Seeds 1/4"
Bachelor Buttons
Dichondra
Globe Amaranth
Larkspur
Lavatera
Nasturiums
Nemophilla
Painted Daisies
Poppy
Sweet Peas



klstuart
Simpsonville, SC
(Zone 7b)

January 17, 2009
9:21 PM

Post #6017217

Whew, thanks Joanna, I've put it all in!

Anyone else ;-) I'm going to check the Stokes site, someone mentioned they have a lot of info available...
Lala_Jane
North West, OH
(Zone 5b)

January 17, 2009
10:25 PM

Post #6017380

Kelly you've got a great start! Could we add one more column? I'm particularly interested in the length of time from germination to bloom. Your first column tells how early to sow for setting the plants out, but setting out and blooming are usually 2 complete different dates.

Maybe I should explain. I'm thinking about growing a few plants for the local farmer's market next spring so it's important for me to know when the flowers will reach maturity and be in bloom. I need to know when to sow my seeds so that the plants will be marketable by the first week in May. I guess that's more the information I've been digging for as opposed to when the plants can actually be placed outdoors.
klstuart
Simpsonville, SC
(Zone 7b)

January 17, 2009
10:43 PM

Post #6017458

Ah, sure, that makes sense. Can add it. Let me know whatever info you have, or if you'd like to input it yourself!
dahlianut
Calgary, AB
(Zone 3a)

January 17, 2009
11:51 PM

Post #6017644

klstuart would you consider asking aAdmin to make your spreadsheet a sticky so everyone can refer to it easily? It's great! I really like Lala_Jane's idea of germination to bloom period as we all have different planting out dates so it will be useful for everyone.

edit: O some things do much better direct sown. So maybe that could be put in as a comment somewhere?

This message was edited Jan 17, 2009 4:52 PM
klstuart
Simpsonville, SC
(Zone 7b)

January 18, 2009
12:43 AM

Post #6017801

I've added the column for germination to bloom time.

I've put in the 'weeks before last frost' column if it's a direct sower, but only if it's not recommended to start inside... there are so many that can be planted different ways, and those ways are listed in the plant files. It's just the specifics of sowing inside that aren't included in the plant files, which seems lacking...

Not sure how to ask Admin... I'll look into it :)
dahlianut
Calgary, AB
(Zone 3a)

January 18, 2009
12:58 AM

Post #6017842

I did it. Hope you don't mind. Admin should chime in on this thread soon. Here's my request thread. http://davesgarden.com/community/forums/t/943926/
klstuart
Simpsonville, SC
(Zone 7b)

January 18, 2009
1:02 AM

Post #6017865

Ah! Thanks, I'd sent an email...
dahlianut
Calgary, AB
(Zone 3a)

January 18, 2009
1:09 AM

Post #6017890

Email works too :-) I only did it on Daves Garden cuz then other members know about it and I'm sure there will be many, many that will appreciate your spreadsheet.
ladygardener1
Near Lake Erie, NW, PA
(Zone 5a)

January 18, 2009
3:01 PM

Post #6019441

Kelly, Thanks for the Idea. I have been trying to do a spread sheet on my computer and make it easy access when I am in DG. When I saw yours, I went to Google and checked it out. I had it up and running last night and this morning I started a Sowing reminder calender also.
I placed a quick link to my spreadsheet in my DG Blog, I will add more information as I order seeds and start sowing in Feb.
I will be checking on yours to see your progress and help if I can.
If anyone wants to see what I am doing just click on my DG screen name and go to my Diary it is under Gardening 2009.
Thank you.


This message was edited Jan 20, 2009 8:06 PM
joannabanana
Calgary, AB
(Zone 3a)

January 18, 2009
6:14 PM

Post #6020166

Kelly,

Here's a thread in the Annuals forum that is very similar. May get a lot more info for your spread sheet.

http://davesgarden.com/community/forums/t/804677/

dahlianut
Calgary, AB
(Zone 3a)

January 22, 2009
4:21 AM

Post #6034766

This thread has been stickied WHOOO HOOOO! I think its a good idea to start another thread to chat on so we can keep the focus on the sticky for klsuarts spreadsheet. Did I mention WHOOO HOOO! Thanks everso Dave and Admin!!!
perenniallyme
Jamaica Plain, MA
(Zone 6a)

January 23, 2009
3:18 PM

Post #6040184

kl - a suggestion for the database. How about a column near the beginning for stratification. It would list yes/no, #days or months and possibly temp if there are different requirements. It would be easier to see than going all the way to the notes at the end and would be more in the order of what you have to do to get the seed to germinate.
Keep up the good work - and thanks!!!
klstuart
Simpsonville, SC
(Zone 7b)

January 23, 2009
3:27 PM

Post #6040225

Great idea! I've found myself sowing a few things that really needed stratification first, just because I didn't scroll over!
perenniallyme
Jamaica Plain, MA
(Zone 6a)

January 23, 2009
3:38 PM

Post #6040273

Easy for me to say. Harder for you to do, I realize, and much appreciated!!! Are you still having people email you info or is there a way for us to add info without making extra work for you?
dahlianut
Calgary, AB
(Zone 3a)

January 23, 2009
3:42 PM

Post #6040297

Great question perenniallyme. I have alot of things to add but it seems like alot of work for klstuart.
klstuart
Simpsonville, SC
(Zone 7b)

January 23, 2009
5:31 PM

Post #6040777

I haven't had many people actually send me info, oddly. If you'd like to add some, just dmail me your email address. I just have to add you to the list of people that can edit. We'd surely appreciate the help!
perenniallyme
Jamaica Plain, MA
(Zone 6a)

January 23, 2009
5:45 PM

Post #6040816

Will do, kl.
Lala_Jane
North West, OH
(Zone 5b)

January 23, 2009
6:27 PM

Post #6040980

Maybe it's because I've helped enter the data, but it's automatic for me to read all the way across the sheet for the seed I'm starting. I put all that information in the "notes" column...stratification, nicking, soaking...any oddball information that can't be found in the first columns is right there under "notes." There is really a lot of good info in that column!

(Kelly I think the fact that nobody is emailing you with corrections and additions is a sign that we've done a good. Take a bow girl!)
wineaux
Tucson, AZ

January 23, 2009
7:32 PM

Post #6041265

I just saw this spread sheet and haven't read all the posts but thanks!
What a great idea!
dahlianut
Calgary, AB
(Zone 3a)

January 23, 2009
7:33 PM

Post #6041269

Yes you have done very good. I have things to add but wanted to wait til we had the sticky (Thanks again Dave and Admin) and was worried about asking someone to do all the inputting. Edit access is the answer! Dmail coming your way klstuart.
dryad57
Scottsburg, IN
(Zone 6a)

January 27, 2009
5:57 PM

Post #6058101

Thanks so much for doing this Kelly. I vividly remember last year's Piggie Swap, we all were lamenting about how we couldn't get great seed starting info from the Plant Files, but none of us thought to pool our info into one spreadsheet. I've got this little puppy bookmarked :-)
klstuart
Simpsonville, SC
(Zone 7b)

January 27, 2009
6:21 PM

Post #6058207

:) I'm glad! I know it's helping me. I'll add more as time becomes available!
Lala_Jane
North West, OH
(Zone 5b)

January 28, 2009
4:36 PM

Post #6062154

Me too! I keep adding to it each time I start a new seed. I figure if I'm doing the research for myself anyway I might as well share the wealth. And with the huge pile of seeds I still need to start we'll have that baby filled out in no time. LOL!
;-)
CindyMzone5
Hobart, IN

January 30, 2009
12:37 AM

Post #6068518

Nice spreadsheet! Today's technology is so much better. A bunch of us on GEnie (15 years ago) would do individual seed germination spreadsheets to share but compilation was such a pain. I've done one every year because it's easier to refer to when I'm in a seed-sowing frenzy. I use 3 date columns - one for stratifying, one for sowing and one for germination. There was a program available several years ago called SeedPlanner but I don't know if it's still around.
Great job!
Pagancat
(Sheryl) Gainesboro, TN
(Zone 6b)

February 2, 2009
3:12 AM

Post #6081256

Kelly, if there's anything you are still looking for, I suggest Thompson and Morgan's seed site. Thanks for all of your work!
klstuart
Simpsonville, SC
(Zone 7b)

February 2, 2009
12:46 PM

Post #6082096

Thanks pagancat. We've gotten a lot of the information from there!
Pagancat
(Sheryl) Gainesboro, TN
(Zone 6b)

February 2, 2009
4:08 PM

Post #6082811

Day late, dollar short, lol... is there any plans to do veggies?
klstuart
Simpsonville, SC
(Zone 7b)

February 2, 2009
4:18 PM

Post #6082861

I hadn't thought of doing them, mainly because I've always started most of them outdoors, with the exception of tomatoes and peppers.
Pagancat
(Sheryl) Gainesboro, TN
(Zone 6b)

February 2, 2009
4:29 PM

Post #6082914

Gotcha - I'm in a slightly different situation - Farmer's Market selling.

I know - any time I want to get started on it, lol!
scicciarella
Mona in Metcalfe, ON
(Zone 5a)

February 2, 2009
4:58 PM

Post #6083072

http://tomclothier.hort.net/index.html

this web site shows everything for annuals and perennials on how to grow
dryad57
Scottsburg, IN
(Zone 6a)

February 2, 2009
10:56 PM

Post #6084654

scicciarella, that's a great site. I've used it in the past. I'm sure Kelly's spreadsheet will eventually grow to include more things; I like the fact that the extra detail on her spreadsheet includes information provided by us - kind of more "tried and true" results, I think. And I've found I can never have enough things to look at when I'm wondering about a specific kind of seed - LOL!!
scicciarella
Mona in Metcalfe, ON
(Zone 5a)

February 3, 2009
12:18 AM

Post #6085060

cool I will have to take a closer look
Weezingreens
Seward, AK
(Zone 3b)


February 3, 2009
2:58 AM

Post #6085861

Just to add my 2 cents worth... growing in Alaska, my dates of planting are quite different from most. I am in a USDA Zone 3 climate, and most all seeds must be started indoors. I can set out plants safely on June 1st, and the season is pretty much over by September 1st. I realize this is an extreme, but it exemplifies that the 'When to Sow' list must be flexible. I have a small greenhouse business, and you would probably be amazed at the schedule of indoor planting I have to follow. Most seed, even lettuce have to be planted indoors and transplanted, or they would never reach maturity before the season is over.

This is probably not very interesting news to Southern gardeners, or even those who have a long hot summer, but, if someone else is working with a short cool season, I have a planting list (not spreadsheet) to offer... just email me.
econ_space
Carrollton, TX

February 3, 2009
3:15 AM

Post #6085923

This is amazing! I am new to Dave's Garden (and gardening), and this will be so much help! Thank you for sharing this.
dahlianut
Calgary, AB
(Zone 3a)

February 3, 2009
3:51 AM

Post #6086038

Great point Weezingreens. I have my own schedule too.
Weezingreens
Seward, AK
(Zone 3b)


February 3, 2009
3:54 AM

Post #6086046

I set a target date, then work back from that. My dates would be quite different from most, but I work from my 'set out date'.
Lala_Jane
North West, OH
(Zone 5b)

February 3, 2009
9:14 AM

Post #6086471

I so agree! That's why we added the "Length of time to bloom' column. I think the information in that column might actually be more useful due to all our different planting zones. We can just take the time span, count backwards, and apply it to our own particular climate.

Weez it's good to see you girl! If you have more information for that column I would LOVE to get my hands on it. I'm sure Kelly will hook you up or I can even add if need be. Most of what we've recorded so far was found on various seed websites which means we couldn't find anything on a lot of the not-so-common seeds.
klstuart
Simpsonville, SC
(Zone 7b)

February 3, 2009
12:57 PM

Post #6086788

So, does the 'weeks before last frost' not work for up north? I would think that would be your 'set out date'... Hmm, I guess you are saying that you need to have your plants larger than us southerners by the time you set them out, since it's a short season? We'd love any info that you'd like to add!
ladygardener1
Near Lake Erie, NW, PA
(Zone 5a)

February 3, 2009
1:33 PM

Post #6086864

Kelly, we do have to garden a bit different from the warmer southern areas. The last frost date is a good place for us to start but sometimes plants that take longer to mature have to get an earlier start. I started my petunias last year March 11th, this year I plan to bump the date up a few weeks to see if they will set buds by the time I get to set them out.
I started eggplants March 27th as an after thought, they did not start to set fruit till very late and the frost got to them first before there was any thing to harvest. I look for veg and flowers that mature fast.
I'm sure Weezingreens has it more extreme then I have dealing with her season, which just amazes me by the way.
Your spread sheet is a good source of reference and I view it often, I have also started my own for the seeds that I start for myself as I find it easy to set up, use and change the information as things develope from my personal experence.
Keep up the good work.
Chris
Weezingreens
Seward, AK
(Zone 3b)


February 3, 2009
8:53 PM

Post #6088835

Yes, Chris is right. Since my season is so short, plants must be further along. There is less time, and they seem to grow slower in cool summer weather. Last year was not a particularly good garden year here because the daytime temps couldn't seem to get above the 50'sF. This can also affect bloom time, and as a consequence, my seed collecting was affected. I've been working on my planting schedule for years, as I sell plants in the summer. I have to start early indoors, and many of the seeds that I plant indoors you would probably direct sow. There are some that I winter sow because they have such special germination requirements.

As far as my indoor planting goes, I plant most seeds in sterile medium and keep them moist in domed flats under lights. If certain trays require darkness to germinate, I cover the tray until germination begins. I'll be planting lobelia today or tomorrow, and it really should have gone in last week. I just got my order of artichoke seed, so it will need to go in now too. I don't keep the basement very warm, nor do I use heated germination pads. I find the heat from the fluorescent bulbs seems to do the trick.
dahlianut
Calgary, AB
(Zone 3a)

February 4, 2009
4:14 PM

Post #6092136

Have you gotten artichokes to overwinter in the ground Weezin? I'm trying them for the first time this year and was going to try to overwinter them in the ground.
scicciarella
Mona in Metcalfe, ON
(Zone 5a)

February 4, 2009
9:23 PM

Post #6093455

I actually ordered some for this spring it says that it is hardy to zone 4 but it also says that even when shipped to colder zone the results have been that the tubers are just a little smaller the first couple of years because of the shorter growing seasons so you will be fine they will come back this spring at first I thought you where talking about globes which I had trouble growing in zone 6b hahah
dahlianut
Calgary, AB
(Zone 3a)

February 4, 2009
11:12 PM

Post #6093923

Lilypon started them in SK last summer and I'm rooting for her overwintering success. I don't know if they are chinook hardy though.
dryad57
Scottsburg, IN
(Zone 6a)

February 4, 2009
11:20 PM

Post #6093959

That's something I've not had the nerve to start yet, but I have fallen in love with Cardoon: http://davesgarden.com/guides/pf/go/913/

I'm sorely tempted to try it in my front garden, but for the size...I'd have to dedicate about 15% of the front yard to it, with little things tucked around it...not sure I want to give up that much for something that just looks neat, know what I mean? Now if it were artichokes and I could actually eat something from it while it's looking neat, that's another story.

I'm losing my patience with my pansies...
scicciarella
Mona in Metcalfe, ON
(Zone 5a)

February 5, 2009
2:03 AM

Post #6094571

well my patience will have to start and so will the pansy this week end since my daughter picked them out saying they look like little of men so pansys we will grow lol

Mrs_Ed

Mrs_Ed
Whiteside County, IL
(Zone 5a)

February 15, 2009
6:39 PM

Post #6142552

Nice spreadsheet. Great for this indoor seed starting newbie. Or, maybe a wannabe. Not sure if I've got the guts!
scicciarella
Mona in Metcalfe, ON
(Zone 5a)

February 15, 2009
6:54 PM

Post #6142647

ok feeling better today my daturas are up and also my morning glories, columbines are getting first true leaves and many other have started to sprout wow I am impressing myself but I do feet better whent hey get the second set of leaves since it means they are well on there way
dahlianut
Calgary, AB
(Zone 3a)

February 15, 2009
7:13 PM

Post #6142763

Me too scicciarella. I always think they might be faking me out before that.
scicciarella
Mona in Metcalfe, ON
(Zone 5a)

February 15, 2009
8:35 PM

Post #6143083

ya well me to I always think I did something wrong and they will never come up but so far so good on most of them I now have a full tray of columbines - diff color barlows and orientals with the long tails and regulars, also delphiniums blue purple and two reds are up, also morning glories and moonflower, this morning I found daturas are making an apearance and many lisianthus, some violas are up and monkey flowers still waiting on many others but some can take 8 weeks so will have to be patient on those

I have to get the dampening off stuff at the gardening center lost a few babies of each not many but I am greedy and want them all

still have about 8 trays to plant but not till next month when these ones are more stable so I can start transplating them in pots
CindyMzone5
Hobart, IN

February 16, 2009
3:08 PM

Post #6146243

I have a question on starting morning glories indoors. I've read that they don't like having their roots disturbed (can't remember where I read it) and I've tried starting them early indoors in paper pots or peat pellets to minimize transplant shock. The plants quickly outgrow the container and don't seem to do well once it's warm enough to plant them out. Do any of the way-northern growers have any suggestions? I've seen garden centers selling large pots of them but have never purchased them (I'm too cheap).
scicciarella
Mona in Metcalfe, ON
(Zone 5a)

February 16, 2009
10:54 PM

Post #6148308

I started my in disposable beer cups so they are pretty big hoping that they will be ok till they go outside

I saw others using them in the morning glory thread but dont make the mistake I made I put in three seeds in each only put one since most of them come up so I hope I dont lose them when I moved some
CindyMzone5
Hobart, IN

February 17, 2009
12:28 AM

Post #6148754

Scicciarella -
Ahhhhh - bigger cups. By disposable, do you mean paper or plastic? If paper as in degradable, where do you find them? Or do you actually transplant them out of plastic cups? My apologies if I'm in the wrong thread/forum but saw some discussion on starting the seeds. Thanks for the suggestion!
scicciarella
Mona in Metcalfe, ON
(Zone 5a)

February 18, 2009
2:02 AM

Post #6153687

I use the plastic beer cups the large ones it works great for larger seeds used them last year for cucumbers and zucchini the fast growing stuff, so when I saw that on another thread they are using them for morning glories and moonflowers it clicked in my slow brain that it would work lol oh and its ok that they are not bio since I re use mine from last year just washed them and put the stack in the garage so many years of use and then if they break recycle

mona

Mrs_Ed

Mrs_Ed
Whiteside County, IL
(Zone 5a)

February 18, 2009
3:12 AM

Post #6154016

I used those Solo cups for sunflowers. And yah, they get reused too.
scicciarella
Mona in Metcalfe, ON
(Zone 5a)

February 18, 2009
3:18 AM

Post #6154048

well this week need to start my zanias and gazanias and also african daisies love the colors and man can they handle the heat and sun without much water my favorite is the white since the foliage is so dark they are so amazing
CindyMzone5
Hobart, IN

February 18, 2009
9:35 PM

Post #6157137

Mona/Mrs Ed -
I can do plastic beer cups and reuse. Just washed/sterilized 200 9 oz. cups for planting up seedlings. Do the morning glories resent transplanting though as I had read or can I stop obsessing?
scicciarella
Mona in Metcalfe, ON
(Zone 5a)

February 18, 2009
9:46 PM

Post #6157176

ok stop obsessing just put one seed in the cup off center I use kabob sticks the longest ones sold at the dollar store I think its about 18 inches or so in the center of the cup a sunny south facing window sill and you are in business

I soaked my seeds in warm water for about two hours and carefully planted the seed about a quarter inche down and they came up in three days

so now take all this info and grow the best MGs ever ok

mona
CindyMzone5
Hobart, IN

February 18, 2009
9:52 PM

Post #6157210

Mona -
Yes ma'am. Hey, what do you do when you run out of vining space on the skewer? I've had that happen and all of the individual cups of MG started co-mingling. What a mess. Can you pinch back MGs?
scicciarella
Mona in Metcalfe, ON
(Zone 5a)

February 18, 2009
10:01 PM

Post #6157242

yes you can which will make it bushier which is good so when you transplant out they send up so many more shoots but remember to give them enough space dont plant them to close I give mine 18 to 20 inches lol I dont measure but about that

and what happens is at they go up they also shoot off to the sides so the colors get mixed I love that

I also use a small paper write the name and tape it to each cup so I know what i am planting out to co ordinate colors

and when I plant I use mulch to keep moist so the bottom leaves dont die off as they grow make a better looking plant

Mrs_Ed

Mrs_Ed
Whiteside County, IL
(Zone 5a)

February 19, 2009
2:19 AM

Post #6158498

How warm do you think it has to be to germinate? I have grow lights in the basement that my coleus are under and they are doing well. But concerned not warm enough for seed starting.
CindyMzone5
Hobart, IN

February 19, 2009
2:19 PM

Post #6160044

Thanks for the input. Years ago when I first dabbled in seeds, I planted both traditional 'Heavenly Blue' MG and moon flowers together right in the scrawny dirt in full sun, growing up the supports of a 2nd story deck. I ended up with vining monsters, easily 20 ft. They twined around the railings of the deck and I had huge blue flowers during the day and huge white flowers at night. They definitely thrived on neglect. I spent a lot of time cleaning up the dropped spent flowers off of the deck as there were so many that it presented a slipping problem. I'll probably wait a few more weeks before planting seed since they can't go out until second half May.
dahlianut
Calgary, AB
(Zone 3a)

February 19, 2009
5:29 PM

Post #6160978

I have unwound clothes hangers to use as MG stakes so they had something to climb on and not get mixed up together before I could get them in the ground.

Mrs_Ed

Mrs_Ed
Whiteside County, IL
(Zone 5a)

February 19, 2009
6:05 PM

Post #6161107

nice!
CindyMzone5
Hobart, IN

February 19, 2009
6:26 PM

Post #6161187

Dahlianut -
Nice indeed. I'll have to see if I still have my secret stash. I have used them in the past for small plant supports in the garden. I use plastic hangers but have saved the metal ones from dry cleaning. Have also used them (in smaller clipped pieces) to anchor soaker hoses too.
dahlianut
Calgary, AB
(Zone 3a)

February 19, 2009
7:21 PM

Post #6161394

I use them for peony support too.
Indygardengal
Brownstown, IN
(Zone 5b)

February 19, 2009
8:42 PM

Post #6161680

Can someone please answer Mrs_Ed. I need more info on germination temps also.
dahlianut
Calgary, AB
(Zone 3a)

February 19, 2009
8:54 PM

Post #6161724

O I missed that question. Different seeds have different optimum temperatures for germinating but I find that 70 is optimal for most warm germinators. Some use heat mats to maintain higher temperatures for specific seeds. I group seeds with similar germination requirements in the same flat so I can move the trays around to meet their needs.

Mrs_Ed

Mrs_Ed
Whiteside County, IL
(Zone 5a)

February 19, 2009
8:56 PM

Post #6161727

The spreadsheet says 68-72. I'm wondering if that is "ideal" or MUST. I'm sure it's only 65 or something in the basement.
dahlianut
Calgary, AB
(Zone 3a)

February 19, 2009
9:01 PM

Post #6161748

Most things will germinate at slightly lower temperatures but with a much lower success ratio. Can you use a little heater to get them going? Once they've germinated you can turn it off as cooler temperatures are better for most seedlings I find.

Mrs_Ed

Mrs_Ed
Whiteside County, IL
(Zone 5a)

February 19, 2009
9:04 PM

Post #6161765

Okay, I can probably find something. I'll put thermometer down there today and see what the temp is.
Weezingreens
Seward, AK
(Zone 3b)


February 19, 2009
10:16 PM

Post #6162072

I'm sorry I have checked watched threads lately. Dahlianut, I grow artichoke varieties that can fruit in the first year, as wintering them over isn't an option for me. It would be too costly to keep the greenhouse heated. I believe Imperial Star is one of the varieties: http://www.reimerseeds.com/imperial-star-artichokes-pvp.aspx

Concerning the temperatures for germination and seedlings, I have found that my light racks help to keep the shelves warm for indoor germination. If the germination temps need to be lower, I start them on the lower shelves closer to the floor. If they need lower temps after germination, I move those trays down to the lower shelves. It seems to work fine for me.
joannabanana
Calgary, AB
(Zone 3a)

February 19, 2009
10:33 PM

Post #6162129

Mrs_Ed,

Your lights will generate heat so you are probably ok
scicciarella
Mona in Metcalfe, ON
(Zone 5a)

February 20, 2009
12:47 AM

Post #6162686

I just put them in a south facing window with the heat went under that shelves it is just right everything I planted has some up and more everyday it is so exciting
jenepat
North Richland Hills, TX
(Zone 8a)

February 20, 2009
9:13 PM

Post #6166302

how much risk is there of keeping the soil too warm? i've been using a heat mat and have it set to stay around 78-80 degrees. i've sowed many different types of seeds in these trays, so i'm hoping it usually doesn't hurt to have the temps this high.
klstuart
Simpsonville, SC
(Zone 7b)

February 20, 2009
10:49 PM

Post #6166798

The recommended temperatures really vary. I'm keeping mine around 70 for the large part of things I'm sowing now. Earlier I had a bunch that liked it a little warmer. Just trying to group by preferences... Then there are some that say 60... don't need a heat mat in my house for that at all.
scicciarella
Mona in Metcalfe, ON
(Zone 5a)

February 20, 2009
11:00 PM

Post #6166842

I dont ever use one I just put a dome on the tray and that is it till I see babies then I open one end for a few days and then more till most are up and strong enough to be in open air
Weezingreens
Seward, AK
(Zone 3b)


February 22, 2009
7:04 AM

Post #6172510

I would be cautious about high temps for germination. Check the germination recommendations for your seeds. Many of the seeds I germinate are recommended at less than 70F, and some at less. I winter sow those that are recommended to start at 40F.
scicciarella
Mona in Metcalfe, ON
(Zone 5a)

February 22, 2009
3:57 PM

Post #6173389

jan and feb are great for germination since the sun it not hot enough to burn anything my was lol most days we only see the sun behind a haze of kinda clouds that make it perfect
my house is kept at about 65F to cheap to heat it more so most of my stuff does very well so far out of a dozen flats only one has not germinated and it said 6 to 8 weeks and it has only been four so I have to be patient

if they need cooler I also use the unfinihed part of the basement its about 55 to 60F down there brrrrr

Mrs_Ed

Mrs_Ed
Whiteside County, IL
(Zone 5a)

February 22, 2009
4:17 PM

Post #6173517

Well that's good to know. We keep our house at 65 too. I'm encouraged !
scicciarella
Mona in Metcalfe, ON
(Zone 5a)

February 22, 2009
5:23 PM

Post #6173823

almost all seeds germinate in spring when the weather is in the sixties during the day and as cool as high 40s or low 50s at night

it is harder to germinate if the temp is to hight since everything dries out
even lisianthus that I was told would need 80f to grow is growing for me and it germinated withing the 10days specified no maybe they will not grow as fast now past the germination point without warmer temps I will see that but I was also told they seem to take forever to get going .

all most plants need is moister and above freezing temps and as much light as possible
pgt
Chalfont, PA
(Zone 6b)

February 26, 2009
11:04 PM

Post #6195015

Thanks so much for this wonderful spreadsheet. Very helpful!!!
wineaux
Tucson, AZ

March 10, 2009
7:09 PM

Post #6247932

Anyone have info on Virginia Creeper? Direct sow now? Also planting peanuts? Do I just put the raw peanuts in the ground, full sun? Thanks
scicciarella
Mona in Metcalfe, ON
(Zone 5a)

March 10, 2009
7:14 PM

Post #6247950

http://tomclothier.hort.net/index.html

this site will tell you everything you need to know about planting annuals perennials vines vegies and anything else check it out
wineaux
Tucson, AZ

March 10, 2009
7:38 PM

Post #6248051

WOW scicciarella, thanks. Really does have everything you need to know...and then some LOL!
scicciarella
Mona in Metcalfe, ON
(Zone 5a)

March 10, 2009
8:13 PM

Post #6248199

glad to be of help have been using that site for many years and I have always found everything to be good and acurate for indoor and outdoor panting its just amazing
dahlianut
Calgary, AB
(Zone 3a)

March 12, 2009
3:10 AM

Post #6254482

My Bible too.
scicciarella
Mona in Metcalfe, ON
(Zone 5a)

March 12, 2009
3:16 AM

Post #6254517

love to read stuff on that site check stuff out and google the pictures and then add them to my must have list which is two pages long now hahahahah that mean turning my dinning room into a green house again next year

Thumbnail by scicciarella
Click the image for an enlarged view.

Mrs_Ed

Mrs_Ed
Whiteside County, IL
(Zone 5a)

March 12, 2009
12:29 PM

Post #6255398

wow,look how nice and organized you are!
scicciarella
Mona in Metcalfe, ON
(Zone 5a)

March 12, 2009
2:16 PM

Post #6255757

I have been growing plants from seed for about 20 years and seriously for about 15 I refuse to pay those rediculous prices at the garden center I only get a few things that I cant find seeds for then I collect the seeds and never have to buy it again

Mrs_Ed

Mrs_Ed
Whiteside County, IL
(Zone 5a)

March 12, 2009
2:27 PM

Post #6255802

awesome! such patience.
scicciarella
Mona in Metcalfe, ON
(Zone 5a)

March 12, 2009
8:20 PM

Post #6257417

patience and so cheap hahahah I will not pay those prices

Mrs_Ed

Mrs_Ed
Whiteside County, IL
(Zone 5a)

March 12, 2009
8:54 PM

Post #6257584

I know! I am going to have to find more patience and get better at doing this! ;-)
scicciarella
Mona in Metcalfe, ON
(Zone 5a)

March 12, 2009
9:29 PM

Post #6257713

use flats with domes and put it in bright light most things will germinated within a couple of weeks I find that if it say two weeks they start to come up in one so I guess they know most people dont have any patience and double the time
now some plants are erratic just like people and they will sprout a few and then couple of more days a few more with those I pick out the babies and transplant them in pots and keep the dome on till most are up or as many as what you want lol

at this time I am sprouting poppies and then I am doing japanese morning glories
they the veggies I have already so many on the go no more space to add new flats so the weather had better co operate lol or we will have to more out hahahhahahah

Thumbnail by scicciarella
Click the image for an enlarged view.

Mrs_Ed

Mrs_Ed
Whiteside County, IL
(Zone 5a)

March 12, 2009
10:03 PM

Post #6257855

yah, but then there's that whole dampening off thing. Too wet, not wet enough. grrrrr. Oh and hardening off. sheesh. It's been years since I did this and that is why. Winter sowing is more my speed. LOL.

scicciarella
Mona in Metcalfe, ON
(Zone 5a)

March 12, 2009
11:23 PM

Post #6258214

I do some of that to I fill the actual flat with dirt and sow poppy and columbines and other things that so better outdoors and put a dome on good luck to them lol had to do that had to many flowers I wanted to grow and not enough room
Pagancat
(Sheryl) Gainesboro, TN
(Zone 6b)

March 13, 2009
12:37 AM

Post #6258599

Scicciarella, I thought poppies hated to be transplanted - you have good luck with them? I've been waiting to direct sow mine 'cause I didn't want to kill 'em by transplant, lol...
scicciarella
Mona in Metcalfe, ON
(Zone 5a)

March 13, 2009
1:27 AM

Post #6258871

ok the big secret with poppies is to move them early before the root get to long the reason they do not like to get moved is that they have a tapered root and if the end get broken they do not recover so the plan is to move them early into a 3 inch pot so they then go directly to the permanently spot I use biodegradable pots so I only pick them out so they dont wilt with the dome since they do not all come up at the same time
Pagancat
(Sheryl) Gainesboro, TN
(Zone 6b)

March 13, 2009
1:34 AM

Post #6258914

Ah, gotcha. Thanks much!
scicciarella
Mona in Metcalfe, ON
(Zone 5a)

March 13, 2009
1:51 AM

Post #6258998

be very carefull with the babies they are very small but all worth the headach to see those poppies bloom
Pagancat
(Sheryl) Gainesboro, TN
(Zone 6b)

March 13, 2009
3:24 PM

Post #6261076

Aren't they gorgeous?
scicciarella
Mona in Metcalfe, ON
(Zone 5a)

March 13, 2009
5:06 PM

Post #6261467

yes I love poppies I got into trouble a few years back because I was growing so many poppies that one day the police stopped at my house to ask what I was growing them for hahahhahah I answered well look at how beautifull they I thought it was obvious lol but after an hour of talking I was informed to please cut off most of the seed heads as soon as the petals fall off so people dont think its a drug lab lol hahhahahaha

Mrs_Ed

Mrs_Ed
Whiteside County, IL
(Zone 5a)

March 14, 2009
12:50 AM

Post #6263281

AS IF those were the type of poppies~!

scicciarella
Mona in Metcalfe, ON
(Zone 5a)

March 14, 2009
12:55 AM

Post #6263304

ah yes they are all perennial poppies are
only the small annuals like the artic poppies are not

Mrs_Ed

Mrs_Ed
Whiteside County, IL
(Zone 5a)

March 14, 2009
1:10 AM

Post #6263397

are you kidding?

sheesh.

dahlianut
Calgary, AB
(Zone 3a)

March 14, 2009
2:02 AM

Post #6263665

No she's not unfortunately Mrs. Ed. There is a new trend towards opium (somniferum) poppy grow-ops for drug trade in Ontario now believe it or not. It is probable that they will ban seed sales soon in Canada and already we are not supposed to trade/buy across the border. Alot of us are being very conscientious about seed saving against an eventual ban to ensure that these beauties don't disappear from our gardens. We will be outlaws because we will share seed for sure. If I end up in prison down the road, please send a cake with a file. Oh and pics of birds too please.
dryad57
Scottsburg, IN
(Zone 6a)

March 14, 2009
2:05 AM

Post #6263675

OMG - that's incredible. Seems like they could at least let you grow a few... If you end up in the slammer we'll visit with pictures, cake, and cold beer :-)
dahlianut
Calgary, AB
(Zone 3a)

March 14, 2009
2:26 AM

Post #6263770

Thanks dryad57 because I might practice 'civil disobedience' on this issue soley for ornamental purposes of course. The funny thing is I'm so honest I'll probably turn myself in LOL. The sad thing is that my poppy guru is retired RCMP who has been collecting from all over the planet and he will probably destroy his if it becomes illegal. I hoping that because of their ornamental value and the small numbers that we have in our home gardens that there will just be a ban on growing large numbers. We shall see.
scicciarella
Mona in Metcalfe, ON
(Zone 5a)

March 14, 2009
2:27 AM

Post #6263773

and more poppy seeds you can say they are for your bagels hahahhahahah
scicciarella
Mona in Metcalfe, ON
(Zone 5a)

March 14, 2009
2:29 AM

Post #6263777

well I have millions of seeds lol and some plants already in the garden got them on sale last august but I have three flats full of them growing already and will sow many more since I just love them and they are very hardy and dont need to be watered so great plant to have
pgt
Chalfont, PA
(Zone 6b)

March 14, 2009
10:08 AM

Post #6264676

I winter sowed a bunch of poppies, and they are starting to come up. If I transfer them to 3" pots, will they survive the cold? (It still sometimes gets to
(for some reason my whole post didn't show)
I was saying (It still sometimes gets to
Pagancat
(Sheryl) Gainesboro, TN
(Zone 6b)

March 14, 2009
7:58 PM

Post #6266600

Hmm - I wonder ... . seems like it would take an AWFUL LOT of poppies to do anything illegal with them.
scicciarella
Mona in Metcalfe, ON
(Zone 5a)

March 14, 2009
11:41 PM

Post #6267516

are those poppies protected right now and what are nightime temps
pgt
Chalfont, PA
(Zone 6b)

March 15, 2009
10:49 AM

Post #6269397

scicc, they are protected in their milk jugs. Night time temps have been between 30F and 38F.
klstuart
Simpsonville, SC
(Zone 7b)

March 15, 2009
12:33 PM

Post #6269660

Poppies are amazing! This is my first year WSowing, and it got down to 19 after they were all well up, with no problems in any of the 9 different jugs. They also got snowed on, where they snow covered them for 2 days. At that point I had just transplanted some babies to my garden, and they did fine too!
scicciarella
Mona in Metcalfe, ON
(Zone 5a)

March 15, 2009
10:18 PM

Post #6272081

ok i would not move them to pot put them in the final spot in chucks since they are not easy to transplant
I would carefully devide it into four chunks for each mild jug and just put them in the ground they will do fine
pgt
Chalfont, PA
(Zone 6b)

March 15, 2009
11:03 PM

Post #6272313

Thanks! I'll transplant and pray.
scicciarella
Mona in Metcalfe, ON
(Zone 5a)

March 15, 2009
11:13 PM

Post #6272352

do it at the end of the day, its easier on the plant if done in the evening
Weezingreens
Seward, AK
(Zone 3b)


March 16, 2009
5:06 PM

Post #6275712

I'm on week 10 of my planting schedule. The closer the target date, the smaller the bags of seeds seem to get. I keep the seeds in 2 gallon zip lock bags in a tote and pull out the bags by the weeks until my target date for setting them out. I'm already getting second leaves on some plants, so I'll need to start transplanting soon.
scicciarella
Mona in Metcalfe, ON
(Zone 5a)

March 16, 2009
10:05 PM

Post #6276941

yup second set mean time for space and lots of bright light unless they are shade plants my astilbe, heuchera and columbine are doing great in the bay window on the north side they get early morning and late evening sun and they are growing like crazy
Weezingreens
Seward, AK
(Zone 3b)


March 16, 2009
10:16 PM

Post #6276990

Seward is not a haven of sunlight in the early spring months, so all my seedlings have to grow under lights. I went downstairs awhile ago, and I see many, many trays that need transplanting. I've got a full schedule today, but tomorrow, I've got to get started.
scicciarella
Mona in Metcalfe, ON
(Zone 5a)

March 17, 2009
2:25 AM

Post #6278314

yup many tidius hours of back braking work lol I took me 4 to 5 hours day for a week to get them of done and then I re seeded all the flats for the second batch

some seedling seem to take forever to grow like lisiantus seeded that one first week of january and they are only now having a second set of leaves

I keep telling myself patience is a virtue I am old enough and have experienced enough to wait for what I want lol
Weezingreens
Seward, AK
(Zone 3b)


March 17, 2009
6:14 PM

Post #6281027

Everything seems to be popping up and getting second leaves, so I should be in the basement right now clearing a place to fill flats with soil. I do my transplanting in my livingroom at a folding table in front of the TV. I go at it for hours, stopping only to take flats downstairs and bring up more trays of seedlings. By early April, I usually have over a hundred flats of seedlings in the basement and I'm prepping the heated greenhouse to start moving them out. In spite of all this, I am sitting here answering e-mails, D-mails & visiting on the forums... ah, procrastination!
scicciarella
Mona in Metcalfe, ON
(Zone 5a)

March 17, 2009
7:56 PM

Post #6281432

hahahahha I started in early january with the ones that need three to four months before they can go out and five to six months to bloom lol wont be doing that again some are now just getting the second set of leaves invisible seeds and micro plants are not my thing
Weezingreens
Seward, AK
(Zone 3b)


March 18, 2009
1:09 AM

Post #6282612

I finally got down to the basement and cleaned up some shelves to put things away. Then I got some soapy bleach water going in the laundry tub to wash flats and 4 packs. I opened a 3.8 c.ft. bag of potting soil and filled some flats. I'll do more tomorrow. I called it a day and came upstairs to clean up before a friend picks me up to go down to the American Legion for corned beef and cabbage. I'm pretty tired, but I can't miss the St Patty's Day fare.
phfurballs
Mississauga, ON
(Zone 6a)

March 18, 2009
1:52 AM

Post #6282801

I found a wealth of information at the following URL.. though I don't know what the chap who compiled the information would think of it being incorporated into another data base. But you could always ask him. He has a very large website, in some ways it is similar to DG, but the germination information page is available to anyone, not just members of his site, and in fact I found his site by finding that page, not the other way around. The site is called Backyard Gardener, and the page is the Propagation page. But as I said, I ran across it on it's own and followed a link to find the rest of the site. Check this URL - http://www.backyardgardener.com/tm.html
klstuart
Simpsonville, SC
(Zone 7b)

March 18, 2009
1:58 PM

Post #6284518

Wow! That's a great find. I think I should include that link in the first post. In the off season I will try to incorporate as much as possible into my own spreadsheet if they allow me!
scicciarella
Mona in Metcalfe, ON
(Zone 5a)

March 22, 2009
6:18 PM

Post #6304010



http://tomclothier.hort.net/index.html

for all growing informatin
check out this site it has almost every plant grown by man or woman
Weezingreens
Seward, AK
(Zone 3b)


March 22, 2009
6:37 PM

Post #6304104

I've used the tomclothier site for years, but I have to say, I do disagree with some of the germination requirements, at least with the need for light or darkness. Never-the-less, it has saved my bacon on several occasions.
scicciarella
Mona in Metcalfe, ON
(Zone 5a)

March 22, 2009
6:52 PM

Post #6304175

it has always worked for me
wineaux
Tucson, AZ

March 24, 2009
9:56 PM

Post #6314398

hmmmmm is it difficult to germinate bacon?
dahlianut
Calgary, AB
(Zone 3a)

March 24, 2009
10:00 PM

Post #6314407

snicker
perenniallyme
Jamaica Plain, MA
(Zone 6a)

March 24, 2009
10:58 PM

Post #6314616

Looks like you've germinated a snicker, wineaux.
wineaux
Tucson, AZ

March 24, 2009
11:09 PM

Post #6314656

tee hee
scicciarella
Mona in Metcalfe, ON
(Zone 5a)

March 24, 2009
11:13 PM

Post #6314669

I got a great surprise today I have been trying to germinate lemon orange gallardia
I put some seeds and they did nothing so I added more and some water and the dome and tried it again we today when I checked I found that they all came up so I will have about 100 plants lol so lots of blooms for the garden

I just love the colors in this one and its a perennial so many years of blooms
they also sell first year plants at 15.99 each so jackpot

Thumbnail by scicciarella
Click the image for an enlarged view.

wineaux
Tucson, AZ

March 25, 2009
12:25 AM

Post #6314990

Love gallardia! I have that same color that has been blooming now
all thru the winter. Congrats, simply gorgeous.
scicciarella
Mona in Metcalfe, ON
(Zone 5a)

March 25, 2009
12:30 AM

Post #6315016

I cant wait to see mine bloom, are the colors as bright as the picture
Pagancat
(Sheryl) Gainesboro, TN
(Zone 6b)

March 25, 2009
12:52 AM

Post #6315133

Very pretty!
wineaux
Tucson, AZ

March 25, 2009
3:29 AM

Post #6315807

better!
scicciarella
Mona in Metcalfe, ON
(Zone 5a)

March 25, 2009
1:36 PM

Post #6316860

my gayfeather (liatrice) is coming up that is one to grow for new gardeners since it is up in like 4 days and at 100 per germination
on the pic it is purple but the one I germinated is a mix of purple, pink, and white seeds that I collected
hummingbirds love them and so do the bees

Thumbnail by scicciarella
Click the image for an enlarged view.

Mrs_Ed

Mrs_Ed
Whiteside County, IL
(Zone 5a)

March 25, 2009
3:15 PM

Post #6317272

i figured that must be an easy one to germinate because my sister always gives me a bunch of seedlings that spread. I have a white one that I dont' even know where it came from.
dahlianut
Calgary, AB
(Zone 3a)

March 25, 2009
4:57 PM

Post #6317771

I seeded white liatris a week ago. (I already have purple but I need pink) and gaillardia 'Goblin' to replace mine that finally pooped out. I was hoping to direct sow a few things outside this weekend but NOT now that we had another dump of snow sigh.
joannabanana
Calgary, AB
(Zone 3a)

March 25, 2009
5:16 PM

Post #6317871

dahlianut,

I have pink liatris if you want a division when spring arrives
dahlianut
Calgary, AB
(Zone 3a)

March 25, 2009
5:44 PM

Post #6317994

Yes please Jo South. Thanks :-)
scicciarella
Mona in Metcalfe, ON
(Zone 5a)

March 25, 2009
6:04 PM

Post #6318072

the only problem I have is that the seeds are all mixed so now I wont know which color is which till they bloom lol
but I am use to planting stuff and not knowing what the are, so when they bloom I will mark them and move them in the fall so they will be in the right place next year but is there really a bad place for flowers I think not hahhahahah
jordanj78
Gates Mills, OH

March 25, 2009
6:15 PM

Post #6318114

any advice as to appropriate time to transfer foxglove, delphinium, or lupine seedlings from peat cells to 4" pots? Lupine are approx 2.5" tall and just sprouting primary leaves.
My foxglove peat cells are each packed with a cluster of sprouts...any suggestions as to thinning them out to transplant them? A garden center manager advised once the cell is completely rootbound, cut it in half, and replant in the 4" pot? Sounds sensible, but this is my first time doing any seedlings? All were planted 03/01/2009
scicciarella
Mona in Metcalfe, ON
(Zone 5a)

March 25, 2009
6:29 PM

Post #6318176

ok so as soon as they have a full permanent set of leaves they can be transplanted just remember to not handle the stems grab the leaves and be carefull not to break the roots so do it with care, that is why I dont use those peat things I hate them I just start my seeds in flats full of soil so it is easier to pick them out or for the large seeds I use a pot to start so no transplanting for those at all three inch pots fit in a flat and the dome fits on top so it works really good and I put four seeds in each and they are fine till they go out then I split as I plant out
jordanj78
Gates Mills, OH

March 25, 2009
7:02 PM

Post #6318352

thanks for the tip about peat cells. makes sense to skip that step and just start in pot. do the foxglove clusters need to thinned in order for them to sprout permanent set of leaves? Right now they look like a bunch of bean sprout microgreens?!?
Weezingreens
Seward, AK
(Zone 3b)


March 25, 2009
7:03 PM

Post #6318354

Good info, Scicciarella!
scicciarella
Mona in Metcalfe, ON
(Zone 5a)

March 25, 2009
8:01 PM

Post #6318612

thanks and what I would do with the foxglove is cut off the netting and plant the whole thing into a six inch pot and wait some will grow enough to be handled and a few will not make it but if you try to take it apart now you will loose to many maybe try to loosen it a little before planting it and water from the bottom to increase the root system to make them stronger
CindyMzone5
Hobart, IN

March 25, 2009
8:04 PM

Post #6318625

Whenever I sow foxglove seed or other fine seed, I always get more sprouts than I need. I usually thin out seedlings before they get their first true leaves by just cutting them out with little cuticle scissors or these nifty embroidery scissors with a hook on the end for cutting out stitches. It's easy to just hook onto the stem of the unwanted seedling and snip it off at ground level. Then I don't have to worry about transplanting clumps or stressing about root damage prying the seedlings apart. Normally, I use one cell for each plant that I want. If I want 12 plants, I use 12 cells and thin to one seedling per cell. Even if I start seeds in a plastic tub (my first year experimenting with this), I still thin out any over-abundance with the scissors. Makes transplanting a little easier.
scicciarella
Mona in Metcalfe, ON
(Zone 5a)

March 25, 2009
8:13 PM

Post #6318681

I was just looking at my seedling and my daturas have buds on them lol but they are only six inches tall this is crazy must be the new fertilizer I got since my morning glories are also making buds at six inches the flower is going to be bigger than the plant ahahahh
oh well at least ill know what color they are hahahhaha
klstuart
Simpsonville, SC
(Zone 7b)

March 25, 2009
8:17 PM

Post #6318700

I have a Datura question, do the flowers smell like the leaves? My seedlings are about 4" tall, and stink horribly. I thought the flowers were supposed to smell good on some of these, but I'm not thinking this is a very good sign...
jordanj78
Gates Mills, OH

March 25, 2009
8:43 PM

Post #6318859

thanks so much. i will thin tonight. i have 32 cells of foxglove, and will thin 10 cells to one seedling/cell; 10 I will thin approx 2/3 of sprouts, 10 I will thin 1/3 of sprouts, and the last 2 i will let go 'au-natural...this being my first year doing seedlings, guess I just want to "hedge" my bets, and see what method is best from seed to outside flowering plant!
Pagancat
(Sheryl) Gainesboro, TN
(Zone 6b)

March 25, 2009
10:28 PM

Post #6319399

klstuart - nope, you're lucky there. The leaves do stink (a good thing, really - considering that they're really poisonous, it keeps both the animals and kids away from them). Depending on the type you're growing, I'd guess, they get a light scent - just barely sweet, it almost smells like a manufactured scent to me.

I used to get a good rush from this plant when it opened at night - even with all these blooms, the scent was not overwhelming.

Thumbnail by Pagancat
Click the image for an enlarged view.

scicciarella
Mona in Metcalfe, ON
(Zone 5a)

March 26, 2009
12:28 AM

Post #6319951

most animals will not eat daturas and what is really dangerous is the seeds that why the pods have spines on them
and yes they have a smell but only if I sniff them lol and the flower usually have a scent but not strong the one that have a stronger scent smell nice the lilac colored ones smell like lilacs I have that one this year and the triple white, triple purple with white inside and the triple golden queen and the large white those grow so big it looks like a tree amazing flowers just love them
its funny to have them bloom when so small
klstuart
Simpsonville, SC
(Zone 7b)

March 26, 2009
12:36 AM

Post #6320014

Thank Goodness. I have a pretty hyper sense of smell. Just brushing them when I water the flat is horrid! I'll put them behind something else, so I don't touch the leaves when they're outside, and look forward to some blooms! I've got the double purple, and the black currant swirl, as well as a white started. Have seed of yellow ballerina, commercial, yet it hasn't germinated :(
scicciarella
Mona in Metcalfe, ON
(Zone 5a)

March 26, 2009
1:08 AM

Post #6320197

the yellows take the longest for some reason started all of mine at the same time and the yellow ones are just two inches tall lol but they will catch up when they are outside the scent comes out in the flowers in the evening some people dont like the smell and some people go crazy for it, I like the plants since I use them to compensate for the lack of bushes and small trees that I dont have and I cant afford to buy hahahhah and you know its great since I can plant these at a different spots every year which is not possible with shrubs hahahhahaha
blueyedkitty04
Kelowna
Canada

March 26, 2009
8:07 AM

Post #6321184

Thank you for your time and efforts in compiling a database! I appreciate all your time! Keep up the wonderful work. Wish I had some info, but I am new to gardening and seed starting. Thanks again!

~M~
scicciarella
Mona in Metcalfe, ON
(Zone 5a)

March 26, 2009
12:32 PM

Post #6321577

M do remember that mr google knows all and always cross check so do not take what it says as gold check a few website and see if the info is consistent
also I use this site for seed germination information

http://tomclothier.hort.net/index.html

and if you hang around with us long enough you will know all hahhahahahahah
I started to clean out flowerbeds yesterday got a good section of the backyard done to find that I have some crocuses that are just about ready to open yes my fist outdoor blooms for this year
CindyMzone5
Hobart, IN

March 26, 2009
2:11 PM

Post #6322018

Jordanj - Know what you mean about hedging your bets on the thinning. You may find that some of the multiples may need to be thinned again in a couple of weeks as the seedlings grow. It's always been easier for me mentally to thin early than to discard the overabundance later in the compost pile, especially because it only takes a few minutes to do.
Weezingreens
Seward, AK
(Zone 3b)


March 26, 2009
4:17 PM

Post #6322595

If you plant seeds to propagation trays, tiny seeds can be added sparingly to clean coarse sand and sprinkled on the medium. Quite often, small seeds require light to germinate. By surface sowing with sand, the seeds get light through it but are less likely to wash away with misting. The sand also affords a more even distribution so you are less likely to have 'wads' of seedlings.
scicciarella
Mona in Metcalfe, ON
(Zone 5a)

March 26, 2009
7:37 PM

Post #6323335

I totally agree with that yes you are right
CindyMzone5
Hobart, IN

March 27, 2009
12:11 AM

Post #6324493

I always wondered how the seed gets evenly distributed throughout the sand and would be totally bummed if I waited 3 weeks for seeds to germinate only to discover that a particular cell got sprinkled with pure sand. Just curious.
Weezingreens
Seward, AK
(Zone 3b)


March 27, 2009
5:09 AM

Post #6325669

I broadcast the seeds in sand into propagation trays, and I mix the seed and sand first.
scicciarella
Mona in Metcalfe, ON
(Zone 5a)

March 27, 2009
2:33 PM

Post #6326835

it works good for certain seeds, certainly the one that require light since the sand will allow light to get to the seeds its a very small amount of sand to seeds maybe like like four or five grains to one seed I dont put alot
dahlianut
Calgary, AB
(Zone 3a)

March 27, 2009
8:28 PM

Post #6328359

Best way to direct sow poppies IMPO.
scicciarella
Mona in Metcalfe, ON
(Zone 5a)

March 30, 2009
12:02 AM

Post #6337550

yup that is why when I did my perennial poppie seeds I did only about one quarter indoors and the rest will be seeded directly in the location I want them in I just did a few indoors to see about finding better ways to transplant them withotout loosing them
an experiment to say that didnt do well since it didnt matter what I did differently still lost most of them so outside is still the best way directly sowing them

mona
phfurballs
Mississauga, ON
(Zone 6a)

March 31, 2009
3:32 AM

Post #6343299

Found another very good web site with some great information on it for seed growing. It's called The Seed Site ! From a gardener in the UK, and it's a bit unusual. The gardener mentions only seeds he/she has grown, and usually in multiple batches, totaling between 1500 and 2000 batches. Wow !. There are pictures of nearly 700 new seedlings with ID for each, and graphs showing how & when each type of seed was sown, & how many batches were sown. Other pages with all kinds of tips and info, including stuff for kids and of course an explanation of the graph key. It's different from others I've seen, but I got some very useful tips from it, so I think it's worth looking at. There is a specific request not to duplicate the info elsewhere without permission, totally understandable, there has been an awful lot of work put into this site. There's a link to contact the site owner. Have a look, here's the URL.
http://theseedsite.co.uk/index.html
scicciarella
Mona in Metcalfe, ON
(Zone 5a)

March 31, 2009
12:28 PM

Post #6344252

I checked it out interesting info, I usually can tell what family a seed is from but example it still doesnt give me which poppy seeds are what color lol that is for the plant to tell me when it blooms

Mrs_Ed

Mrs_Ed
Whiteside County, IL
(Zone 5a)

March 31, 2009
11:21 PM

Post #6347021

Question on this spread sheet. When the instructions read "do not cover", is that don't cover with soil or is that don't cover with plastic or plastic dome?
klstuart
Simpsonville, SC
(Zone 7b)

April 1, 2009
12:03 AM

Post #6347200

Its meant as do not cover with soil. Generally this means that the seeds need light to germinate.

Mrs_Ed

Mrs_Ed
Whiteside County, IL
(Zone 5a)

April 1, 2009
12:03 AM

Post #6347203

That's what I thought, but I wanted to make sure. thanks
scicciarella
Mona in Metcalfe, ON
(Zone 5a)

April 1, 2009
12:40 AM

Post #6347378

it is very common for extremely small seeds to not cover them since they sprout so small they would not have the strenght to make it out of the soil, so when they germinate the root finds the soil and attaches itself as it grows it goes deeper into the soil when it is strong enough the seedling stands up, it is amazing to watch with a magnifiying glass
I thought it was way cool

mona

Mrs_Ed

Mrs_Ed
Whiteside County, IL
(Zone 5a)

April 1, 2009
12:49 AM

Post #6347419

Thanks Mona,

I'm such a newbie at starting seeds indoors. I haven't done it since I was in High School (long time ago). Do all perennial poppies have to be cold stratified? Probably too late to winter sow now? I can't tell you how nervous I am about this. And that's kind of funny to me too!

scicciarella
Mona in Metcalfe, ON
(Zone 5a)

April 1, 2009
1:18 AM

Post #6347556

poppies are better directly sowed where you want them to grow this is what I do and it works everytime, pick the spot and fix the soil even add a little of the good stuff and rake it fine then add the seeds spritz it till it is real moist and use a dome put it on and use rocks of bricks on the edge to keep it in place or soil whatever and it will only take about a week and then when you see then are up remove the dome

now do this when the soil has warmed a bit so they will come up right away or you can do it now and they will come up when they are warm enough

Mrs_Ed

Mrs_Ed
Whiteside County, IL
(Zone 5a)

April 1, 2009
1:30 AM

Post #6347610

and if they weren't cold stratified, it's okay to direct sow?
scicciarella
Mona in Metcalfe, ON
(Zone 5a)

April 1, 2009
1:41 AM

Post #6347676

now is the perfect time since it is still cool enough at night to do the job so get to it and grow them poppies hahahahha I am doing some on the weekend I will be able to get into the shed to get my outside domes, ice and snow was blocking the door till yesterday

Mrs_Ed

Mrs_Ed
Whiteside County, IL
(Zone 5a)

April 1, 2009
1:56 AM

Post #6347775

Okay, thanks for the help again. I don't have the all the beds ready yet!! I'll have do do some improvising about where I'm putting stuff I guess!

blomma

blomma
Wyoming, WY
(Zone 4a)

April 1, 2009
5:45 AM

Post #6348437

Just a thought. Since most perennials have their particular month to bloom, depending on soil, air temperature, lenght of daylight, sunlight, and climate, can't that information be used to judge when a plant will bloom from seed.?

For instance, Gysophila (baby's breath) begins to bloom in June from a sowing the previous year. Aubrieta (Rock Cress) blooms in early spring from a early spring sowing during the previous year. At least they have for me in zone 4. Each variety of perennial have an internal clock to tell them when to bloom, and that is when conditons are right for them in daylight, soil and air temperature. This is the reason why the same variety may not bloom on the same month across the US.

I think for annuals, a chart would be useful since they bloom according to maturity (given reasonable care) and are not dependant on inviromental factors to bloom, as is the case for perennials.
scicciarella
Mona in Metcalfe, ON
(Zone 5a)

April 1, 2009
1:09 PM

Post #6349036

poppies sowed this year will not bloom till next year unless they are annuals but perennial poppies are worth the wait since the blooms are so huge and beautifull and they bloom when not much else is blooming just after the spring stuff is finished and the summer stuff is not there yet I ususally put mine with something taller behind them and something infront that will hide the foliage since it looks pretty dead at the end of july till september when the new green comes up I usually keep cuting the really ratty stuff as they dry up

This message was edited Apr 1, 2009 9:13 AM

This message was edited Apr 1, 2009 9:14 AM

Mrs_Ed

Mrs_Ed
Whiteside County, IL
(Zone 5a)

April 1, 2009
1:12 PM

Post #6349046

Yah, I don't care if things bloom this year, I just want them to germinate! LOL.

scicciarella
Mona in Metcalfe, ON
(Zone 5a)

April 1, 2009
1:17 PM

Post #6349062

home depot has plastic bells they are like one foot by one foot it maybe easier to find a square foot in the garden and they are very cheap and made for just this since they have a hole at the top to let out the extra heat usually sell for a couple of bucks I was using them at my other house since space was limited and I didnt want to start a really large patch but many patches of different color and I started them later in the season like mid to end of june and they bloomed the next year so you could do that but make sure if its later in the season to use the bells with the hole or they will cook

Mrs_Ed

Mrs_Ed
Whiteside County, IL
(Zone 5a)

April 1, 2009
1:25 PM

Post #6349096

hmm. I didn't think starting later in the year was an option on the poppies since they wanted coolness to germinate.

I'll have to look for those bells. I am definitely limited on space.
scicciarella
Mona in Metcalfe, ON
(Zone 5a)

April 1, 2009
1:51 PM

Post #6349204

actually its funny because the seeds are spread by the end of july and germinate and bloom the next summer I never cool mine unless the package says it has to be like the blue ones the hamalayans need the cold but I just plant mine and they grow I have also planted them when the seeds have been many years old and they still come up if the can grow in the middle east in sand and no cold lol they can grow anywhere

Mrs_Ed

Mrs_Ed
Whiteside County, IL
(Zone 5a)

April 1, 2009
3:59 PM

Post #6349726

well all right then. That makes more sense to me! I won't stress about getting them into the ground. I have a butterfly and hummingbird garden to build first!

phfurballs
Mississauga, ON
(Zone 6a)

April 2, 2009
3:07 AM

Post #6352908

You can always use a fridge to simulate a cold period, to stratify seeds. I've also read that some hardy seeds can be put in the freezer to simulate going through a harder winter, so they'll flower from seed the first year instead of the second, but I don't recall what species it was said to work for. Just a note - I recently got some seeds from Australia where I saw frequent mention of smoke being used to help break dormancy on certain hard to germinate seeds. Interestingly, to me anyway, this apparently works on a number of seeds that are not necessarily from areas where bush or grass fires are common either. I found a US supplier who sells 'smoke paper', basically small pieces of special paper impregnated with smoke compounds, that you dissolve in water. Then you use the resulting 'smoke water' to soak the seeds. It depends on the type of seed of course, but it apparently can give much better results on some hard to germinate seeds. I'm not sure if this spreadsheet is intended to include information for tree or bonsai type seeds, or if it's mainly meant to address flowers and vegetables, but I sure found this information about smoke treatment fascinating. It appears it can sometimes replace or else shorten the period of stratification for some of the seeds it's effective with, which is what prompted me to mention it here.
CindyMzone5
Hobart, IN

April 2, 2009
1:55 PM

Post #6354127

phfurballs - That is interesting. I would have thought that some seeds required the heat, much like you see in controlled burns, rather than the chemical emission. Unless it's acting like gibberellins, which I've never used. Also interesting is putting seeds in the freezer rather than the fridge. Older recommendations said never to put in the freezer but I'm very curious about this. Do you have any reference link? Thanks for the posting.

blomma

blomma
Wyoming, WY
(Zone 4a)

April 2, 2009
10:57 PM

Post #6356346

Cindy I have germinated all my seeds this year in a moist kitchen paper towel. Those that needed cold, I stuck in the fridge for 2 weeks. Putting seeds in the freezer don't accomplish anything except perhaps crack the seed, whick can be done by nicking.

In order for low temp of the fridge to work (stratification), it has to be combined with moisture. Sticking seeds in the fridge without it defeat the purpose. Seeds naturally wake from dormancy with a combination of cold and moisture in nature. Then sprout with warmer soil temp.

Some seeds, like tree seeds, have a double dormancy and require cold, warmth, cold, and warmth again, to sprout.

CAPTION. These are Aquilegia (Columbine) sprouting in a moist kitchen napkin prior to transferring to a seed flat. These were sown Feb 17, then in the fridge for 2 weeks. They germinated March 18 in room temp. Those that have no roots have swelled and ready to sprout.

There are some seeds that benefits from smoke. Here is an excellent seed data base with lots of information. Also sells seeds. Somewhere on this website smoke is mentioned. Just look around. It also mentions the G. acid.

http://www.jlhudsonseeds.net/index.htm

Thumbnail by blomma
Click the image for an enlarged view.

scicciarella
Mona in Metcalfe, ON
(Zone 5a)

April 3, 2009
12:45 PM

Post #6358518

I see roots on those seeds they are more than ready to plant wow I have to try that just to see the roots come out I usually soad mine for a bit and then just plant them and they come up when ready
CindyMzone5
Hobart, IN

April 3, 2009
2:20 PM

Post #6358865

Blomma - Thanks for posting the link. I've heard of Hudson on and off for years but never checked out their website but have now bookmarked it. Just about all of my seed starting falls within the range of stratifying, nicking, soaking or no special treatment. I've never delved into the "special" treatments like GA-3 (which Deno mentions often) and others so I found the smoke treatment interesting. Even more interesting is Hudson's notation that it can be accomplished by using Liquid Smoke. I'm wondering if plants commonly grown east of the Miss just don't have those "special" requirements.
Great explanation on stratifying. I generally stratify Aquilegia for about 3 weeks which is just short of sending out the root and they generally sprout about 10 days after sowing. Some roots can develop so fast during stratifying that I have found myself struggling to dislodge them from the substrate (usually unbleached coffee filters) without doing damage.
scicciarella
Mona in Metcalfe, ON
(Zone 5a)

April 3, 2009
2:39 PM

Post #6358950

but you cant do that with poppies they have a tapered root like a dandy lion and will die that is why it is better to just plant them where you want them so much easier than loosing most or all of them and yes you can just put them in the cheese or butter section of your fridge to make them them react as if they got cold and it will not hurt the seeds one way or the other and will guarranty that if they did need it well its done so put them in the fridge till you are ready to sow them on the surface never cover them with soil they need the light to germinate

this is one patch I started last summer I think it was in june

Thumbnail by scicciarella
Click the image for an enlarged view.

blomma

blomma
Wyoming, WY
(Zone 4a)

April 4, 2009
6:16 AM

Post #6362338

Cindy You are welcome. Glad you found the site interesting. I have a whole bunch of seeds I want to order from them for next year.

Try kitchen paper towels instead of coffee filters. They are softer, and easier to squeeze moisture from. Also provide more even moisture, and hold it. I cut one in half, then fold it, fold it again until you have a square. I place the seeds inside the square and fold one end over.

After placed in a ziplock baggie, I close it, leaving a 1/2" opening on one end. I blow air into the opening to form a balloon. The air will stay in the bag if the runners are lined up correctly on the baggie. This way the plastic isn't laying over the seed package.

I know what you mean about seeds sprouting so quickly. The roots can actually grow right into the paper. I have had to cut the sprouted seed out and plant it with the paper.

What I really find so interesting in sowing seeds this way is that I really get to see how its done. Each variety of seeds have a character all its own. It's like giving birth.
CindyMzone5
Hobart, IN

April 4, 2009
3:00 PM

Post #6363184

Mona - I've never had much luck with poppies here, even buying the plants (CA poppies maybe?). Do you put the seed packet in the fridge or do you use some other container? That butter compartment is great for stashing seeds - otherwise they'd get lost in the fridge. What's the minimum time you have to keep the poppy seeds in the fridge? I've gotten lots of free packets of poppy seeds but always give them away since I don't have much luck with them.
Blomma - I've stayed away from other paper substrates for my stratified seeds because of the bleaching process. I think I had read in one of Deno's books to use unbleached papers. And then I use a spray bottle of distilled water (avoiding the chlorine in tap water) to spray my coffee filters so I can control the amount of moisture I add. Always have the spray bottle around for ironing anyway (ugh). I'm going to check out the seed list to see what I might want to order from them. I really need to expand my seed sources.
scicciarella
Mona in Metcalfe, ON
(Zone 5a)

April 4, 2009
6:00 PM

Post #6363821

if you bought the seeds and it those not say to cold stratify them then you can just plant them anytime just remember since they are surface sowed to use a dome or bell or the birds will eat them all and mist to keep moist for a few days

perennial poppies are easy to grow if you directly sow them
klstuart
Simpsonville, SC
(Zone 7b)

April 4, 2009
7:29 PM

Post #6364111

I've never had much luck with poppies here either until this year. I winter sowed about a dozen containers worth, and all but 2 came up! Next year I'll get even more brave and try direct sowing... transplanting all that success was a pain!
CindyMzone5
Hobart, IN

April 5, 2009
12:48 AM

Post #6365231

No domes or bells here but clean glass jars should work. My neighbors will think I've planted a "different" type of garden with a dozen glass jars sticking up. Afraid plastic bottles will just blow away with the spring winds.

blomma

blomma
Wyoming, WY
(Zone 4a)

April 5, 2009
2:47 AM

Post #6365721

CindyI have never worried about paper towels being unbleached or not. Neither did all my sprouted seeds. I really don't see why it should make a difference. I don't use distilled water either. I use tap water and never had a problem. My plants and I both drink it. I think that some things you read in books are overrated.
CindyMzone5
Hobart, IN

April 5, 2009
6:13 PM

Post #6367886

Blomma - you're probably right about over-emphasis on procedure. Just read a tip on breadmaking - never use chlorinated tap water when starting out the yeast. DH is the bread maker so I don't know if that tip is accurate or not.
scicciarella
Mona in Metcalfe, ON
(Zone 5a)

April 5, 2009
11:27 PM

Post #6369219

california poppies are warm weather poppies and do not need any cold none of the annual poppies need cold just spread seed on fine soil and spritz use dome or bell so bird dont get the seeds for lunch that is the biggest problem with poppies most people think they did something wrong its just a finch or a dove had a meal on your money
and it will only take about three day for the seeds to start to come up as soon as they are about an inch or two tall take the bell or dome off and they will as annuals bloom the first year and if it is good since patch without mulch will reseed itself for many years to come so enjoy
phfurballs
Mississauga, ON
(Zone 6a)

April 6, 2009
2:32 AM

Post #6369987

Here's a link to the site I found that sells Smoke paper, they call it CAPE, I think. Thanks for the link to Hudson's, I hadn't seen them before - very interesting. And I can't find whatever it was I read about putting some seed in the freezer, but with all the searches I've been doing recently, looking for bonsai seed and information on germinating said bonsai seeds, pretty much everything I've read on breaking dormancy agrees with what Blomma said. The URL I mentioned is as follows.. http://www.seedman.com

And, for what it's worth, about chlorinated water and yeast ? I made my own bread for decades and always used tap water. Ours is chlorinated enough so that in summer you can sometimes smell it as water runs from the tap, even though the city swears it's long gone by the time it reaches a tap. But it never caused a problem with yeast. Bread yeast is much more sensitive to salt and temperature. Temps too hot kill it, too cold slows it down dramatically and direct contact with salt can kill it too. Salt in bread is not there only for flavor, it also helps to control the yeast action. I do filter my drinking water so it will taste and smell better. I only use distilled water for my CPAP machine, because minerals build up in the humidifier tank where it's impossible to safely clean.

As my father, who was a chemical engineer, explained to me once, chlorine is 'volatile'. Essentially, that means that once it contacts air it turns into a gas and goes into the air. Before they came up with modern dechlorinating chemical tablets, aquarium keepers always had to 'age' tap water before it could be used for a fish tank. Aging simply allowed the chlorine in the tap water to gas off into the atmosphere. That's why we had the huge evacuation in my home town when the train derailed with tanker cars full of chlorine..[ google Mississauga Train Disaster if you're interested]. Too much chlorine in air will kill us, and not much of it in water kills fish, who are extremely sensitive to it, as are some plants, for that matter. I kept fish for years and drove Mom nuts with big buckets of water left out to age. Now you buy tablets at aquarium stores and get chlorine free water in no time. Therefore, no need to worry about chlorine in bleached paper because by the time it's dried at the manufacturers, the chlorine's gone. Which is no reason not to switch to unbleached paper anyway, because the chlorine effluent from the pulp/paper plants does so much environmental damage, particularly to aquatic life. If you want your water without chlorine for watering plants, you can get it by aging it a few days, just like I used to do for the fish water.
scicciarella
Mona in Metcalfe, ON
(Zone 5a)

April 6, 2009
2:48 AM

Post #6370084

I dont need to google it I lived it was at a friends house very close to the accident they came to the door and told us to leave the area

it was kind of scary
CindyMzone5
Hobart, IN

April 6, 2009
2:19 PM

Post #6371728

We get a chlorine odor to our city water in the summer. Our water comes from Lake Michigan. In the Nashville area, the chlorine odor is very strong due to their water source. So strong that I was looking for alternative beverages. As for the bread, a lot of cooks must have their trade secrets whether factual or not.
Had some CA poppies once, bought as plants. I don't think they liked the one and only sunny bed they were in since I had to water it fairly frequently for some of the other plants in the same bed. I think they died out by the second year.

blomma

blomma
Wyoming, WY
(Zone 4a)

April 9, 2009
6:18 AM

Post #6385396

I grew up with chlorinated tap water and never minded it. I still prefer it since unchlorinated water tastes "flat" to me even 30 years later.
evelyn_inthegarden
Sierra Foothills, CA
(Zone 8a)

April 10, 2009
5:25 AM

Post #6390143

I am curious. what would be John Innes seed compost? I assume it is a brand of compost from England, but what are the ingredients? Peat & perlite?

Evelyn
phfurballs
Mississauga, ON
(Zone 6a)

April 10, 2009
9:57 PM

Post #6392800

There's lots of info about the Innes mixtures online. This URL has good explanations and recipes for all the mixes. http://www.gardeningdata.co.uk/soil/john_innes/john_innes.php

John Innes isn't a company. He was a man who left his estate to further horticultural research, and the John Innes Institute was named after him. They came up with various standardized soil mixes for just about all common growing requirements. A note, if you look this up. The last mix is called 'ericaceous'. It just means it's good for growing members of the heath family, which like acidic soil conditions, like Rhododendrons and azaleas do.
evelyn_inthegarden
Sierra Foothills, CA
(Zone 8a)

September 15, 2009
9:48 PM

Post #7068065

Phfurballs, thanks for the info. I guess all of those who live in the UK are born with green thumbs and have gardens when they are children. I did get to sow some carrot seeds when I was small and gardening with my parents in their veggie garden. (Victory Garden!)

So, it has stuck with me until I had a good place to garden. I did run across a book explaining the different John Innes' soils, but now I am going to look him up as he must have contributed a lot to horticuture. I appreciate the info!

Evelyn
scicciarella
Mona in Metcalfe, ON
(Zone 5a)

September 16, 2009
2:07 AM

Post #7068899

http://tomclothier.hort.net/index.html

here is a web site that gives you all the information

ROSES_R_RED

ROSES_R_RED
Mount Bethel, PA
(Zone 6a)

October 13, 2009
4:31 PM

Post #7164923

I am planning to winter sow lots of seed outside in February. Does anyone have a list of the best flower seeds to sow this way? Does anyone have a list of which seeds need stratification?

Thanks

Teri
Weezingreens
Seward, AK
(Zone 3b)


October 13, 2009
5:51 PM

Post #7165160

Teri, the Tom Clothier site Scicciarella posted will offer you information concerning which seeds require stratification. Perhaps you should make a list of the seeds you plan to sow and start looking them up on his site. It would be much easier to get help determining which of your seeds need cold treatment than for someone to try to list all the plants that do.
Debbie2007
Port Vincent, LA
(Zone 8b)

October 13, 2009
9:33 PM

Post #7165830

Hi Teri, this may help you, I'm not sure. http://flowergardens.suite101.com/article.cfm/fall_sowing_of_seeds_in_the_flower_garden
Pagancat
(Sheryl) Gainesboro, TN
(Zone 6b)

October 13, 2009
11:19 PM

Post #7166106

I think there might also be a "winter sowing" forum, somewhere here...
scicciarella
Mona in Metcalfe, ON
(Zone 5a)

October 19, 2009
1:54 AM

Post #7184334

when winter sowing I like to use milk jugs but I cut the bottoms off and sink them into the grown where I want the plant to grow that way in spring I just remove the jug top and voila there is the plant and it is a great way of doing poppies without having to transplant them since they do not like it

and perennial poppies are easier to start in august since that is when the seed is ready and is naturally spread and it germinates and stays green under the snow for the winter for flowers the next spring

what is important is that you know your calender for your area first your last frost date then on the calender count back the weeks four, six, eight, ten, twelve and so on then sort your seeds by the number of weeks before last frost do not forget to calculate and include the amount of time to germinate which is usually a week to two weeks some longer, then sort the seeds by how long to germination and size of seed it makes it easier if you are using flats, so annuals small seeds all in one flat, then medium then large, same for perennials so you can use a done to keep in humidity which is more important than temperature if indoors the dome will keep the humidity constant so the seed germination is not dried out which kills more seeds than anything else, start with a moist not wet soil for germination, then use a spray bottle to spritz to keep the right moister, and it will happen

I have grown plants from seed for most of my life and I find it totally amazing every year to start off with these little seeds and end up with the most beautifull flowers

started this lisianthus last january it was a long road since they take a very long time to grow, and the seedling so small that I was not seeing them at first but just one bloom would have been worth the effort but I got eight different colors and lots and lots of blooms

Thumbnail by scicciarella
Click the image for an enlarged view.

meadowyck

meadowyck
Brooksville, FL
(Zone 9a)

October 19, 2009
2:58 AM

Post #7184581

I love your idea of just putting the seeds where I want them then put the jug over them. That would also keep the squirels out of them and let me know exactly what is where.

1 problem for DH will not let me put milk jugs out in the front or back yard all over the places that I want to put the seeds... He has finally agreed that I could line them up outside in the area that we will be putting up a greenhouse in.

Thanks

Janet
scicciarella
Mona in Metcalfe, ON
(Zone 5a)

October 19, 2009
3:03 AM

Post #7184606

ah but the secret is to do it just before it is going to start snowing and the jugs will be buried all winter so what does it matter if he cant see them hahhahaha and in the spring by the time the snow is all gone the seeds will have sprouted and the jug can be removed since perennials as soon as they have a second set of leaves can take some chilly nights and be just fine
Debbie2007
Port Vincent, LA
(Zone 8b)

October 19, 2009
3:13 AM

Post #7184654

That sounds wonderful scicciarella. What other seeds can I plant outside with the milk jug?
scicciarella
Mona in Metcalfe, ON
(Zone 5a)

October 19, 2009
11:23 AM

Post #7185296

any perennial seed that needs stratafication

so columbines
delphiniums
angelica giga
perennial holy hocks
day lilies
heuchera
astilbe

pretty well anything that is a bi annual or a perennial even some annuals that say they will reseed can be done like that

hidden to keep DH happen I would do the ones that take a long time to germinate and grow big enought to see like heuchera, astilbe those do take longer

if the plant is easy to transplant I use the vegie garden since with the jug they will be up and ready to transplant before the vegies go in its a great place to put them
Debbie2007
Port Vincent, LA
(Zone 8b)

October 19, 2009
5:54 PM

Post #7186645

Thank you so very much for the info. I'll get the hang of it sooner or later. And don't kid yourself. If your husband is like mine, he knows exactly what you have , and where it is. They really don't mind, they just have to act big sometimes. It helps to keep their male ego in tact. Cause you know, we ladies have a way of getting around it constantly. Let's them think they are still in charge. Poor babies. LOL
scicciarella
Mona in Metcalfe, ON
(Zone 5a)

October 19, 2009
7:24 PM

Post #7186972

yup men are interesting creatures, mine actually thinks he is king of his castle but he cleans toilets, and also peels patatoes hahahahah and vaccums

so cute

meadowyck

meadowyck
Brooksville, FL
(Zone 9a)

October 19, 2009
8:15 PM

Post #7187184

i would love to see the spread sheet but you have to join google to see it and don't really want to do that.

is there any other way to see it?
Janet
stormyla
Norristown, PA
(Zone 6b)

October 19, 2009
10:25 PM

Post #7187664

Mona, Do you keep the cap on or off of the jug? Do you put air holes in the jug? Do they heave or blow away?
klstuart
Simpsonville, SC
(Zone 7b)

October 19, 2009
10:43 PM

Post #7187721

Janet, what spreadsheet do you want to see? The seed germination sheet should be viewable by all, no joining necessary, just click on the link in the first post.

meadowyck

meadowyck
Brooksville, FL
(Zone 9a)

October 20, 2009
12:30 AM

Post #7188160

I clicked on the link but it doesn't come up unless I join so have never been able to view it.

Janet
Pagancat
(Sheryl) Gainesboro, TN
(Zone 6b)

October 20, 2009
2:08 PM

Post #7189697

Janet, I have the options of downloading it as an HTML doc, a .pdf or a text doc (although it seems like a text doc would really mess up the formatting, dunno). If you care to send me an e-mail addy, I will forward it on to you. I don't think I can do it through D-mail.

Mrs_Ed

Mrs_Ed
Whiteside County, IL
(Zone 5a)

October 20, 2009
2:19 PM

Post #7189728

I think if you save it as a text doc, it might add commas as the delimiters, then you can import it into excel. Otherwise a PDF is probably the best bet.
Pagancat
(Sheryl) Gainesboro, TN
(Zone 6b)

October 20, 2009
2:26 PM

Post #7189744

I agree. I just tried to send it via D-mail, but looks like they're looking for a .jpg or another image file, so the .pdf didn't go through.

Mrs_Ed

Mrs_Ed
Whiteside County, IL
(Zone 5a)

October 20, 2009
2:56 PM

Post #7189803

oh yes. you'd need to have a JPG, PNG or GIF for Dave's. And I doubt you want to make oodles of screen captures of that sheet!

meadowyck

meadowyck
Brooksville, FL
(Zone 9a)

October 21, 2009
3:30 AM

Post #7192311

PDF is the best way to send any docs these days, it condenses most files to allow them to travel on e-mail without the receiver having too many problems downloading...

Janet
scicciarella
Mona in Metcalfe, ON
(Zone 5a)

October 21, 2009
3:41 AM

Post #7192336

I leave the caps off and I sink them in about four inches and they stay put
Debbie2007
Port Vincent, LA
(Zone 8b)

October 21, 2009
3:46 AM

Post #7192346

Thanks Mona, for the info. I was wondering that myself. Thank you so much.

Debbie

Another quick question, does it have to be milk jugs or can I use the empty 2 liter coke bottles?
stormyla
Norristown, PA
(Zone 6b)

October 21, 2009
3:50 AM

Post #7192355

Thanks, Mona. We don't get much snow cover. Do you think they'll still be warm enough? It can get down to about 10F here and windy.
LynnPhillips
Buckley, WA
(Zone 7b)

October 21, 2009
4:02 AM

Post #7192396

I winter sowed last year for the first time. In fact, I had never planted seeds before! It was so easy and fun. I used milk jugs, juice bottles, take out containers, Starbucks cups with the domes, anything that would hold approx 2 inches of MG and have "head room" for the seedlings to grow. I poked holes in the bottom for drainage, holes in the top to let in rain (except for bottles, took the caps off). I set them outside, Feb-April, and did nothing with them until Mother Nature told them to sprout. Only then did I protect them from the occasional freeze by throwing a moving blanket over them. I did over 300-400 containers, and most of them germinated. It was so exciting to see these grow. It was even more rewarding so see them bloom in the garden.

meadowyck

meadowyck
Brooksville, FL
(Zone 9a)

October 21, 2009
4:23 AM

Post #7192435

Lynn...

I was just going to say what in the world did you do with all those plants from the seeds... don't know if I would have been up to planting all of them... OMGosh... you do have energy...send some my way please.

Janet
Debbie2007
Port Vincent, LA
(Zone 8b)

October 21, 2009
4:33 AM

Post #7192446

So Lynn, Mona said that some of the seeds can be planted where I want them to grow. So then from what you are saying about the containers, I can use the 2 liters, right? That would be so cool to do.
LynnPhillips
Buckley, WA
(Zone 7b)

October 21, 2009
4:35 AM

Post #7192451

I planted some at my mom's. We live on 5 acres, and had no landscaping at all until 1.5 years ago. I was a planting fool!!! Also, some of the containers in that count were the coffee cups and other odd ball plastic containers. I planted in "chunks". I still have about 10 containers that I never did get into the ground.

Here is a picture of part of my plastic garden. DH did not like it, so I put wire closet shelves on top of cinder blocks, and hid them behind a white plastic fence. It wasn't very attractive, but it was so worth it in the end.

I now have lots of seeds to share in the Piggy Swap! Or if you want seeds, just let me know, and I will send you some.

Thumbnail by LynnPhillips
Click the image for an enlarged view.

LynnPhillips
Buckley, WA
(Zone 7b)

October 21, 2009
4:42 AM

Post #7192460

I am going to try Mona's technique this year. The only drawback that I can see, based on my little 1 year experience, is protecting them from a freeze after they have germinated. With all of them huddled together, it was easy to throw a blanket over them, and to make sure they got enough water before I planted them out. Of course, if they were already in the ground, and protected with their plastic container, then they should already be ok and not need the blanket. It sure would save a lot of time, no transplanting.
stormyla
Norristown, PA
(Zone 6b)

October 21, 2009
4:48 AM

Post #7192476

Lynn, Love that photo. It looks so promising. Yes, I really like the idea of sowing them where they will eventually live. I've winter sowed indoors and also direct sowed in the spring, but have never done the January planting outside. I've been saving milk jugs and am ready!! What seeds do you have?
LynnPhillips
Buckley, WA
(Zone 7b)

October 21, 2009
5:12 AM

Post #7192528

Here is a partial list, cuz I am brain dead tonight.
Love Lies Bleeding
Hobi Red Dye Amaranth
Becky Shasta Daisy
Licorice Mint Agastache
Red & Yellow Marbles 4 o'clocks
Limelight 4 o'clocks
Yellow 4 o'clocks
Poppies (Shirley and another kind, but the seeds got all mixed together)
Grandpa Otts Morning Glory
Heavenly Blue Morning Glory
Pot of Gold Marigolds
French Marigolds
NOID Marigold (Small, looks like a miniature French)
Indian corn
Annual Purple Salvia
Annual Red Salvia
Annual White Salvia
Perennial Red Salvia (Will have to look up records to see name)
Guardian Blue Delphinium
Popsickle (short) Lupine
Mexican Feather grass (Ponytails)
Rudbeckia
several peppers
Rose colored double Hollyhocks
Pink and white single HH (have not gathered their seeds yet, though)
Marble Arch Rose Salvia
Great Blue Lobelia

I know there are more, just can't remember off the top of my head.

Here is my driveway this spring, before I planted.

Thumbnail by LynnPhillips
Click the image for an enlarged view.

LynnPhillips
Buckley, WA
(Zone 7b)

October 21, 2009
5:17 AM

Post #7192536

Here is the same driveway, pic taken this month.

Thumbnail by LynnPhillips
Click the image for an enlarged view.

Debbie2007
Port Vincent, LA
(Zone 8b)

October 21, 2009
5:21 AM

Post #7192545

Just awesome Lynn. It's so beautiful now. Great job.
Oh by the way, have you ever been to Butchart Gardens?
LynnPhillips
Buckley, WA
(Zone 7b)

October 21, 2009
5:30 AM

Post #7192554

Thank you for the compliment. I have been one planting fool!! That is just one of many that I did this past year. I had a DG member over here in March, and then she was here end of Aug (Ico- hosted the PNW Roundup at our house), and she could not believe the difference. I can't believe it, either.

No, I have never been to Butchart Gardens, but have always wanted to go.

stormyla
Norristown, PA
(Zone 6b)

October 21, 2009
11:41 AM

Post #7192792

Lynn, You've really done a magnificent job there. Thanks for the list.
klstuart
Simpsonville, SC
(Zone 7b)

October 21, 2009
11:59 AM

Post #7192832

Gorgeous Lynn! Very inspirational. I wintersowed last year for the first time too, but not nearly so many! I was overwhelmed with about 100 jugs...
Steve812
Prescott, AZ
(Zone 7a)

October 23, 2009
1:27 PM

Post #7200019

I just wanted to thank everyone who has contributed to this thread so far. I love the spreadsheet and the photos. Highly informative and inspirational. I keep failing with seeds (they mostly die right after being transplanted); but it's encouraging to find that some people have great success.
klstuart
Simpsonville, SC
(Zone 7b)

October 23, 2009
1:45 PM

Post #7200065

Steve, hang in there! I had a few that did that last year too. Extremely frustrating. But, I had planted so many different things, that something was bound to work :) Pick something that you know does really well in your area, and try that first! Here I'd say Zinnias and Sunflowers are probably the easiest. Also had great luck with Salvia, Ageratum and Portulaca this year. Oh, and Nicotiana too. Of course, the nicotiana was so easy I now have about 100 seedlings sprouting in my brick patio cracks... :) Oh well, they sure were pretty! If Columbine work where you are, they wintersowed beautifully.
Steve812
Prescott, AZ
(Zone 7a)

October 23, 2009
2:12 PM

Post #7200153

Kelly, thanks for the encouragement and the suggestions! I am trying Hollyhocks - I succeeded with them once. I definitely need to try sunflowers. Columbine are a great idea; I know there are species that grow wild in alpine AZ, places similar to this one. The perennial salvias I have now are spectacular (bought as plants.) I'll have to look into Ageratum and Portulaca. I could just barely keep nicotiana alive in NJ; not sure I'd do better here. Maybe I'll try it in part shade. I love the smell.
jjrogers68
Layton, UT

February 1, 2010
1:00 AM

Post #7516864

I've been trying to make a germination chart just like the one you have here, so I am quite excited to have stumbled upon this. One question I have, what does WS stand for? I don't want to make assumptions and end up killing some innocent seedling. Thanks for your hard work!
Joan
Belfield, ND
(Zone 4a)



February 1, 2010
1:01 AM

Post #7516867

WS stands for Winter Sow.
valleylynn
Dallas, OR
(Zone 8b)

February 1, 2010
1:16 AM

Post #7516907

What an excellent data base. Thank you for creating it. I just found this thread. I love the fact that it tells you whether you should cover the seed or not and all the other info included. Someone has put a lot of work into this. Again thank you.
klstuart
Simpsonville, SC
(Zone 7b)

February 1, 2010
1:18 AM

Post #7516913

Thanks! I just got back to looking it over again this year. Hoping to add some more as I work on this season's seeds... so much to learn, and so many great sources!
valleylynn
Dallas, OR
(Zone 8b)

February 1, 2010
1:28 AM

Post #7516954

This data base is very helpful. I am Winter Sowing for the first time this year. Lots of info in your data base. I have saved it to my Favorites for reference. Again, thank you so much for all your hard work.
jjrogers68
Layton, UT

February 1, 2010
1:35 AM

Post #7516970

Thanks for the info. I kind of figured it meant winter sow but just wanted to make sure!

greenthumb99

greenthumb99
Lucketts, VA
(Zone 7a)

February 7, 2010
2:56 AM

Post #7537170

kistuart, would you please explain the wintersow spreadsheet at the link for the when to sow spreadsheet? It has a lot of plants listed but columns without heading and no visable data. Thanks

blomma

blomma
Wyoming, WY
(Zone 4a)

February 7, 2010
4:51 AM

Post #7537448

Reading the data base, I noticed that it recommended freezing Daylily seeds prior to seeding. That is incorrect. Freezing alone does nothing. What is needed is cold and moisture to mimic nature and force it out of dormancy when exposed to warmer temp.

What I do is soak Daylily seeds overnight in hand hot water. Then, place in a moist kitchen paper towel and insert in a zip lock baggie. Store in fridge for 3 weeks. Often the seeds will sprout in the fridge. Remove to germinate at room temp. When the seeds have sprouted, plant them in a sowing mix to continue growing. They can also be WS to sprout in the spring.

Although in the same genus, all varieties of Penstemon don't require the same germination technique. Some varieties are difficult and require warmth before stratification. Others need the opposite.

Bearded Iris is a great candidate for WS. Soak in water for 3 weeks to remove sprouting inhibitors. Change the water every day. Once done, sow using your favorite WS method. Iris seeds will sprout when the outdoor temp remains at 50 to 55 degrees.

Asclepias require stratification to germinate (moist cold).

Here are two good germination data bases.

http://www.backyardgardener.com/tm.html

http://www.robsplants.com/seed/germination.php

Below is daylily seeds sprouting in a paper towel just prior to potting up. I sowed these in October 09. They are now 3" tall growing in a 3" pot under plant light.



This message was edited Feb 6, 2010 10:17 PM

Thumbnail by blomma
Click the image for an enlarged view.

klstuart
Simpsonville, SC
(Zone 7b)

February 7, 2010
10:03 PM

Post #7539440

Thanks blomma! I'll get this info in the spreadsheet tomorrow a.m.! Greenthumb, have to check on that, back with you tomorrow too... just checking real quick today!

evelyn_inthegarden
Sierra Foothills, CA
(Zone 8a)

February 8, 2010
7:20 PM

Post #7542208

Joanna, do you sow poppy seeds into individual pots, or the regular cell packs then shift them when small?

Thanks, Evelyn
klstuart
Simpsonville, SC
(Zone 7b)

February 8, 2010
8:23 PM

Post #7542360

Ah Greenthumb, now I see what you mean. Someone else who was helping me last year wanted to do the wintersow sheet, but never got to it. I'll remove that sheet, as I'm unlikely to be able to do it myself... still too new to wintersowing.

greenthumb99

greenthumb99
Lucketts, VA
(Zone 7a)

February 9, 2010
2:38 AM

Post #7543424

kistuart, perhaps someone in the wintersowing forum would be willing to bring it to life? I'm just getting into winter sowing myself and would love some place to share my results and see those of others in an organized format. Thought that I was too tech unsavy to get it to display data. duh!
klstuart
Simpsonville, SC
(Zone 7b)

February 9, 2010
1:04 PM

Post #7544196

There is a wintersowing database on Daves. It's challenging to find, but there. It's a work in progress too, but you can certainly share there. I've been meaning to add my limited info to it!

http://davesgarden.com/guides/pf/ws/
bsavage
Dolores, CO
(Zone 5b)

March 24, 2010
8:34 AM

Post #7652489

I am excited to find this thread and all of the info in it! I have not been particularly successful with seeds in the past, but I am determined to do it right this year. I have learned from reading this that I know nothing about seed starting! I'm sure I will be re-reading multiple times. Thanks to all of you who have contributed!

Brenda
evelyn_inthegarden
Sierra Foothills, CA
(Zone 8a)

March 28, 2010
6:57 PM

Post #7663160

Great job, klstuart!

Some of us "newbies" need all the help we can get. I have sown limited amounts of plants from seed, most of it direct sown, though I once started 100 tomato plants from seed...there are so many, and I have been disabled from the time I was working full time until about now, though I have been doing maintenance, weeding, watering, and planting a few things already grown by others, and now it is time for me to get my tote of seeds planted. It may take a few seasons, and I am old...but determined, as I cannot afford to:
#1. Waste the seeds I already bought or got in trades,
#2. I cannot buy the number of plants one can produce from all the seed packets that I have...so it's TIME!
klstuart
Simpsonville, SC
(Zone 7b)

March 29, 2010
3:01 PM

Post #7664984

I have recently found a book that has everything we might ever need to know on annual and perennial flowers. It is "The Gardener's A-Z Guide to Growing flowers from Seed to Bloom" by Eileen Powell. Literally every seed I have looked up has been in there with the exception of a few that were actually considered shrubs. I'm so thrilled with this book! It tells about temperature to sow seed, weeks before last frost, any special requirements, etc. The only thing it's missing is whether or not it can be wintersown... though that can sometimes be inferred if it germinates at a cool temperature. It also talks about other propagating methods, dividing, cuttings, growing ferns from spores and more!
evelyn_inthegarden
Sierra Foothills, CA
(Zone 8a)

March 29, 2010
6:56 PM

Post #7665649

Joanna...I have a new respect for those who grow annuals, as I have only grown easy, large, sow in ground, or sow on ground...nothing like these petunias...I don't know how you do it.

Do you have smaller plugs in your cell-packs, or the standard retail nursery cell-packs? They are so fine. I might have killed quite a few in the last transplant, as I started the first batch in cell packs, the large kind. I did, however, put more than one seed per cell. (Poor babies...) though quite a few have survived, in spite of my clumsiness. ARRRGH!
mcalpin1
Tacoma, WA

August 4, 2010
8:36 AM

Post #8017756

Backyardgardener website still host a great seed germination database. http://www.backyardgardener.com/tm.html
carnolian
Port Hadlock, WA

September 20, 2010
2:28 PM

Post #8110211

Does anyone know about Dogwood seed pods? Red, 1" diameter, rough skin,????
dahlianut
Calgary, AB
(Zone 3a)

September 27, 2010
2:18 PM

Post #8124307

It looks like the germination method is similar for all the cornus:
Cornus alba , Tatarian dogwood ,zone= 2 , sow 3m @ 39F, move to 70F for germ.
Cornus alternifolia , Pagoda Dogwood ,zone= 3 , sow 2-5m @ 70F, 2-3m @ 39F, move to 70F for germ.
Cornus amomum , Silky dogwood ,zone= 5 , sow 4m @ 39F, move to 70F for germ.
Cornus canadensis , Bunchberry ,zone= 2 , scarify, sow 3m @ 70F, 3m @ 39F, move to 70F for germ.
Cornus florida , Flowering Dogwood ,zone= 5 , wash seeds, sow 5m @ 39F, move to 70F for germ.
Cornus kousa , Kousa Dogwood ,zone= 5 , sow 3m @ 39F, move to 70F for germ.
Cornus mas , Cornelian Cherry ,zone= 5 , wash seeds, sow 4m @ 70F, then 3m @ 39F, move to 70F for germ.
Cornus nuttallii , Mountain Dogwood ,zone= 7 , sow 3m @ 39F, move to 70F for germ.
Cornus officinalis (shan zhu yu) , Japanese Cornel ,zone= 6 , see C. mas
Cornus racemosa , Gray dogwood ,zone= 4 , scarify, sow 4m @ 39F, move to 70F for germ.
Cornus sanguinea , Common Dogwood ,zone= 5 , sow 3-5m @ 70F, 3m @ 39F, move to 70F for germ.
Cornus sericea (C. stolonifera) , Red osier dogwood ,zone= 2 , see C. alba

RickCorey_WA

RickCorey_WA
Everett, WA
(Zone 8a)

October 14, 2010
1:27 PM

Post #8155980

"Virtual Seeds" has a great seed germination database. You can even downbload it as a text file. Lots of advice on types of stratification.

http://www.virtualseeds.com/Germination.html

Each species they document has these fioelds:
Species Type Germ Days Germ Temp Media Sow Depth Comments

"Type" is things like "Half-hardy Annual" or "Hardy Biennial"

"Comments" includes things like type of stratification reccomended .

The main Virtual Seeds website does sell seeds, but they seem to mostly re-sell other people's seeds (?)
evelyn_inthegarden
Sierra Foothills, CA
(Zone 8a)

October 15, 2010
5:56 PM

Post #8158130

Thanks, Rick. We can always use another seed germination chart, as many experts do not always agree on the "ideal" conditions for growing everything. Even my books do not agree. So what I do is just try to adapt to the conditions that I already have instead of standing on my head...well, I think you know what I mean. All those that need soaking scarifying, stratifying...etc may not actually require all these things if the seeds are fresh. It is good to be able to determine for oneself the actual requirements of the seeds under what can be easily provided. (Just my 2 cents worth.)

~ Evelyn
klstuart
Simpsonville, SC
(Zone 7b)

October 16, 2010
6:54 AM

Post #8158745

Hey All. I may ask the powers that be to take this off 'sticky', as I am no longer actively maintaining/adding to it. If you disagree, speak up, but I think there have been plenty of other options mentioned that sound like everyone finds useful.
Pfg
(Pam) Warren, CT
(Zone 5b)

February 23, 2011
2:30 AM

Post #8387679

Oh please don't!! I've just recently found it and keep referring back to it as I try to decide what to do with the plethora of seed packets I need to deal with!

Thanks, Pam
Debsroots
Northwest, MO
(Zone 5a)

February 23, 2011
5:31 AM

Post #8387841

Please leave it up...I find it very useful
evelyn_inthegarden
Sierra Foothills, CA
(Zone 8a)

February 24, 2011
4:18 PM

Post #8390859

I use it a lot, too...it would be in the interest of all to leave it up, at least for this growing season, OK?
klstuart
Simpsonville, SC
(Zone 7b)

February 25, 2011
10:26 AM

Post #8392154

Sure, just realize that it's not being updated!
evelyn_inthegarden
Sierra Foothills, CA
(Zone 8a)

February 25, 2011
4:09 PM

Post #8392804

That's fine. At least it is a starting point. Thanks for doing it!
SoFlaCommercial
West Palm Beach, FL
(Zone 10b)

July 30, 2011
10:13 AM

Post #8725287

i just found this and it is helpful - please keep it up.
evelyn_inthegarden
Sierra Foothills, CA
(Zone 8a)

August 5, 2011
5:06 PM

Post #8739160

Will you start a new thread on this or would it be too difficult with the spreadsheet, as I imagine there are more than ever new seed sowers coming on board?
DonShirer
Westbrook, CT
(Zone 6a)

February 20, 2012
6:03 AM

Post #9012947

I had just done a similar spreadsheet for veggies, and was about to start one for flowers when I ran across this thread. You've just saved me hours of work. Thanks!!! Sorry I didn't know about this two years ago.

Only comment from a quick scan...Queen Anne's Lace has a funny entry in time to start seeds column. Looks like your spreadsheet interpreted a pure number as a date.

Also, my browser (not Chrome) wouldn't change the printout parameters, so I transferred the content to Excel to print a hard copy.
BloomBrat
Minneapolis, MN

March 11, 2013
2:04 PM

Post #9446074

This is AWESOME! Thanks so much!

Justin

OutlawHeart81

OutlawHeart81
Syracuse, NY
(Zone 5a)

May 17, 2013
10:15 PM

Post #9524514

well this explains why our poppies aren't sprouting! i always thought they needed light! hahaha i guess i will try to cover them? maybe too late?
monag5341
Denver, CO

July 5, 2013
8:32 AM

Post #9587638

Check the spreadsheet at Johnny's Seeds. Already done and pretty good I think.
evelyn_inthegarden
Sierra Foothills, CA
(Zone 8a)

September 10, 2013
7:33 PM

Post #9656647


I have just collected at least 100 seeds from my hardy hibiscus 'Summer Storm'. Has anyone grown hibiscus from seed? Will it come true. I do not know if this is a hybrid, or just a named variety gleaned from selected seed.

I am still going to start a few and see what happens. I would still gain from your experience, if you have grown this or a similar one from seed. Thank you.

Evelyn

Thumbnail by evelyn_inthegarden
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Pfg
(Pam) Warren, CT
(Zone 5b)

November 8, 2013
9:21 PM

Post #9705078

I copied it to a file on my PC, still find it very useful. Thanks again for the initial effort, lots of good info there.

Pam

ROSES_R_RED

ROSES_R_RED
Mount Bethel, PA
(Zone 6a)

November 10, 2013
3:39 AM

Post #9705760

The spreadsheet really confirms the lengthy time needed to start the lisianthus. I still think that they are the ones that are most worth growing...so beautiful and long lasting on the stem. I grow the double cinderellas and start enough to give away.
evelyn_inthegarden
Sierra Foothills, CA
(Zone 8a)

November 11, 2013
9:32 PM

Post #9707172

Roses ~ Do you have enough to spare right now? Maybe you could also tell me the secret to growing them. I have purchased them from the local garden center and they did not last at all. Some I planted in the ground and others I put into containers. I am willing to try them again from seed.

Is there some seed that you would like in exchange? You can look on Amanda's Round Robin to see what I have available, but I do have more seeds as well.

ROSES_R_RED

ROSES_R_RED
Mount Bethel, PA
(Zone 6a)

November 15, 2013
12:42 PM

Post #9709711

I haven't made my purchases for the Lisianthus yet. I usually get them from Swallowtail Garden Seeds. They are not difficult to grow. It's just that they take a long time to grow the seedlings big enough to go outside.

I will be ordering from here:

http://www.swallowtailgardenseeds.com/annuals/lisianthus.html#gsc.tab=0

13Turtles

13Turtles
Springfield, OR
(Zone 8a)

April 22, 2014
4:52 AM

Post #9818532

Just found this. Very glad it's still up.

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