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Tomatoes: Looking for a list of Potato Leaf Tomato Varieties

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texasrockgarden
Canyon Lake, TX
(Zone 8b)

February 7, 2009
7:20 PM

Post #6106822

Has any body compiled a list of potato leaf tomato varieties?

Thanks

Jerry
sanpedro
Espanola, NM
(Zone 6b)

February 7, 2009
10:11 PM

Post #6107268

Tatiana has
http://t-garden.homeip.net/mwiki/index.php/Category:Potato_Leaf_Tomatoes
texasrockgarden
Canyon Lake, TX
(Zone 8b)

February 7, 2009
10:17 PM

Post #6107284

Thanks. Looks like I have only one that is on this list.

Jerry
Sequee
Carmel, NY
(Zone 6b)

February 7, 2009
10:38 PM

Post #6107362

Great link! I had no idea there was a compiled list like that.
JoParrott
Richland, WA
(Zone 7b)

February 7, 2009
10:49 PM

Post #6107397

Just curious- what is the difference of a potato leaf and a "regular" leaf tomato? Just leaf appearance, or does the leaf indicate a different type of tomato?
Farmerdill
Augusta, GA
(Zone 8a)


February 7, 2009
10:50 PM

Post #6107401

Here is the Plantfiles list. http://davesgarden.com/guides/pf/advanced.php?nn%5B1%5D=0&nn%5B2%5D=0&nn%5B4%5D=0&nn%5B5%5D=0&nn%5B12%5D=0&nn%5B17%5D=0&nn%5B13%5D=0&nn%5B14%5D=0&nn%5B18%5D=0&nn%5B15%5D=0&nn%5B19%5D=0&nn%5B21%5D=0&nn%5B22%5D=0&nn%5B24%5D=2&sname=Tomatoes&Search=Search
Sequee
Carmel, NY
(Zone 6b)

February 8, 2009
12:15 AM

Post #6107737

I will have to learn to do that!!!
Suze_

(Zone 7b)

February 8, 2009
1:26 AM

Post #6107967

>>I will have to learn to do that!!!

http://davesgarden.com/guides/pf/advanced.php

Just for tomatoes:
http://davesgarden.com/guides/pf/advanced.php?sname=Tomatoes



This message was edited Feb 7, 2009 7:27 PM
Carolyn
Salem, NY
(Zone 4b)

February 8, 2009
1:35 AM

Post #6107996

Just curious- what is the difference of a potato leaf and a "regular" leaf tomato? Just leaf appearance, or does the leaf indicate a different type of tomato?

******

If you've grown tomatoes before you're familiar with the type of foliage that most of them have where individual leaves have serrated edges, and most of us call that RL foliage, meaning Regular Leaf.

Some varieties have leaves that have smooth edges and the leaves look just like potato leaves so they're called PL, or potato leaf foliaged varieties.

All of our garden tomatoes are in the genus and species Solanum lycopersicon and so some of them have RL and some have PL foliage.

There are other kinds of foliage as well.

Angora foliage is grey and fuzzy while Rugose foliage is a deep green and the leaf surface is puckered.

Carolyn
texasrockgarden
Canyon Lake, TX
(Zone 8b)

February 8, 2009
2:22 AM

Post #6108153

Wow! this thread has brought me more valuable information than I ever expected. Thanks

On one of the vendors' websites I read about Opalka's having a wispy vine. In a flat of 72 peat pellets, I have a few Opalkas growing, so I now know what a leaf looks like on what should be a wispy vine. This is fun.

Actually on the flat there are 16 different varieties so I am getting to see quite a few different leaf formations ... very interesting. There is only one PL, however, Brandysweet Plumb.

Jerry

Carolyn
Salem, NY
(Zone 4b)

February 8, 2009
2:52 AM

Post #6108268

On one of the vendors' websites I read about Opalka's having a wispy vine. In a flat of 72 peat pellets, I have a few Opalkas growing, so I now know what a leaf looks like on what should be a wispy vine. This is fun.
*****

Umm, err Jerry, Opalka does not have leaves that I would call narrow and highly serrated and droopy as do most but not all of the heart shaped varieties. ( smile)

And I know Opalka quite well since I'm the one who introduced it initially, seeds from a colleague where I used to teach. ( smile)

As you continue to grow more and more tomato varieties I think you'll be very surprised to see the variation in leaf shapes, even amongst the PL's as well as the RL's, and wait until you grow your first angora foliaged variety and your first rugose leaved variety. LOL

Carolyn, who really does appreciate your excitement about your tomatoes.
texasrockgarden
Canyon Lake, TX
(Zone 8b)

February 8, 2009
3:51 AM

Post #6108502

Oops! Hey, don't get me to lying. Here are some places that describe the Opalka as having wispy vines. I dunno.

http://www.seedsavers.org/Details.aspx?itemNo=447

http://www.tomatogrowers.com/processing.htm

http://www.dianeseeds.com/tomato-opalka.html

http://www.heirloomtomatoes.com/main/index.html

Got any pictures of what a wispy vine should look like, anybody?

Jerry

Carolyn
Salem, NY
(Zone 4b)

February 8, 2009
1:03 PM

Post #6109180

Oops! Hey, don't get me to lying. Here are some places that describe the Opalka as having wispy vines. I dunno.

*****

I don't doubt you for one minute that some places call the foliage wispy, etc, b'c quite a few paste types do have wispy droopy foliage.

In my book I referred to the variety as being indeterminate with a medium cover of reular foliage, and no mention of wispiness, etc. And a picture is shown.

Contrast that with my description of Anna Russian, a pink heart:

Indeterminate plant habit with sparse to medium cover of wispy droopy regular leaf foliage. And a picture is shown.

With the droopy part you have to see a picture of a whole plant in order to tell how the foliage hangs down and droops.

So one person's wispy droopy, sparse foliage is not necessarily the same as another person's wispy, droopy sparse foliage. ( smile)

But do enjoy those Opalka fruits.

Carolyn
critterologist
Frederick, MD
(Zone 6b)

February 8, 2009
1:28 PM

Post #6109237

:-)

Thumbnail by critterologist
Click the image for an enlarged view.

Tplant
Pembroke Pines, FL
(Zone 10a)

February 8, 2009
5:25 PM

Post #6110200

My PL tomatos seem to be always healthier than the RL? I don't know why but it seems that way. I am not the one for scientific facts as since my retirement from a very stressful occupation I just enjoy and let it go at that as most of you know me to be so! Right Farmerdill & Carolyn???
feldon30
Houston, TX
(Zone 9a)

February 11, 2009
3:51 PM

Post #6123950

Some folks have postulated that Potato Leaf tomatoes are slightly more resilient against foliage diseases such as Early Blight and Septoria Leaf Spot.

I don't really have any scientific proof about Regular Leaf vs. Potato Leave, but whenever I find a new tomato that I love the flavor, it almost always turns out to be a pink variety that grows on a potato leaved plant.
Tplant
Pembroke Pines, FL
(Zone 10a)

February 11, 2009
9:42 PM

Post #6125441

I feel the same way. My choice is PL plants. They do seem to be more resilient then RL?
a_night_owl
San Diego, CA

May 7, 2009
5:13 AM

Post #6515718

Excellent! Once again Dave's Garden to the rescue! :-)

According to "Seed to Seed" you can only grow one Potato Leaf variety at a time if you want to save seeds. Apparently the regular leaf ones (usually) don't outbreed, and it's only the Potato Leaf, currants and beefsteaks you need to worry about.

I wanted a quick and dirty way to find out what kind of leaves all my varieties I have seeds for have so I can avoid crosses.

Thanks! :-)

Carolyn
Salem, NY
(Zone 4b)

May 7, 2009
10:46 AM

Post #6516005

According to "Seed to Seed" you can only grow one Potato Leaf variety at a time if you want to save seeds. Apparently the regular leaf ones (usually) don't outbreed, and it's only the Potato Leaf, currants and beefsteaks you need to worry about.

******

With this I strongly disagree.

It used to be said in the older tomato literature that PL varieties cross more easily than RL varieties, but I've now grown about 2500 different varieties and have not found that to be true at all.

If you aren't going to save seed it doesn't matter at all if any Cross pollination occurs in a given season b/c the fruits of what you grow will be correct as to size and shape and taste.

It's only if you save seeds from fruits that may have X pollinated seeds in them and then plant those seeds the next year that you might find wrong plants and fruits for a variety.

So if you want to save seeds that will be pure, then you have to either grow varieties separated by geographic distance or bag bloossoms.

The only PL variety that was once said to cross easily is Brandywine b/c it apparently has split calyces, but the person who told a garden writer that was surprised when it got around that b;c of the split calyces there could be a greater degree of X polination when, as he has said, such a situation would facilitate self pollenization.

My own experience and opinion is that any variety that tends to have stigmas that are exherted, that is, stick up above the pollen bearing anthers, are more apt to be X pollinated by insects,

Normally our garden tomato has the normal retracted stigmas, but weather, not specified, can cause those stigmas to exhert.

If I grow a specific variety many times and tend to get X pollination then I concluide it's apt to have exerted stigmas sometimes, and for me that would include the varieties Aunt Ruby's German Green, White Queen and sometimes Cherokee Green.

Carolyn, who notes that she isn't the only one who finds that PL varieties do not cross more easily.
pennyrile
Evansville, IN
(Zone 6b)

May 7, 2009
1:11 PM

Post #6516419

In 2006, I grew Brandywine, a potato leaf variety. On one side of it was Earl's Faux, another PL variety that strongly resembled the Brandywine in every respect. On the other side grew Big Beef, a regular leaf variety. Every other tomato plant in that particular raised bed was regular leaf as well and I noticed frequent visits by bumble bees that summer.

I don't bag my tomato blossoms or use any sort of "geographic isolation." But I do save a lot of seeds.

This spring I started about 100 Brandywine seeds from those 2006 saved seeds to donate to the Master Gardener's plant sale. I got 100% potato leaf seedlings from those 2006 unbagged seeds. Does that mean that the plants are not crossed? No. But if they are, they were crossed by Earl's Faux pollen (which I find just as likely or unlikely as if they were crossed with Big Beef pollen), and no one is gonna tell one wit's difference between any of the vines ... I guarantee.

In fact, for the past 5 years of saving seeds, I haven't personally experienced a single case of noticeable cross pollination in any subsequent grow-out except those I intentionally cross pollinated by hand, which so far has been 100% too. And I plant a pretty crowded bed and have a small resident population of bumble bees and sweat bees. Also, I haven't heard back from anyone that they've gotten unintentional crosses from the thousands of seeds I've shared. If they do, I'd like to hear about it, but nothing in my experience backs up the 5 - 10% natural cross pollination rate, although if it did, that wouldn't bother me or cause me to change my methods either.

The individual grower has the opportunity to cull or grow obvious cross pollinations. Some will be very obvious and some not so obvious at the transplant stage. I usually plant enough seeds of each type to be able to detect the differences. Some folks who plant only one, 2, 3 or 4 seeds of each variety may have a little more difficulty detecting obvious crosses.

You know, now that I've said that, let me tell you which obvious crosses or strays I found so far this spring:

Two individual potato leaf seedlings out of 12 seeds sprouted from Sweet Quartz "F1" seeds purchased from Tomato Growers Supply.

Three potato leaf seedlings out of 25 seeds sprouted from Golden Cherokee obtained from an SSE listing member.

That's it out of approximately 400 - 500 seedlings so far this spring.

Now, there are some obvious variations among the seedling population that I'm watching very closely. But most of those are among the F2, F3, F4 seedlings of some still segregating and recombining crosses others and I have made and are growing out. All the other open pollinated or F1 seedlings look uniform between their respective groups.

The one hybrid I continue to find variation in year to year is Early Girl Improved (commercially mass-produced) seeds which seem to always throw a PL seedling or two for me and for local nurseries. I attribute this to sloppy crossing, tagging and harvesting protocol wherever that particular cultivar is produced.

This message was edited May 7, 2009 8:12 AM
LooneyLinda
Mantua, UT
(Zone 4b)

May 7, 2009
2:34 PM

Post #6516924

I have to agree with feldon and Tplant. When I look over the tomatoes I like the best, most of them are pink PL's.

Brandywine Sudduth's
Pink Potato Top
Prudens Purple
Chianti Rose
Carolyn
Salem, NY
(Zone 4b)

May 7, 2009
3:32 PM

Post #6517178

Thanks Bill, for confirming what I wrote above about PL varieties not being any more involved with cross pollinations than others.

As I said above, that bit has been in the old tomato literature for a long time and I think that many times folks just take what's been said before and repeats it without doing some research or from personal experience.

Now I do know that Suzanne Ashworth, author of From Seed To Seed does grow tomatoes, I don't know how many or how long she's been doing that, and I don't want to single her out and of course she may be seeing something different where she lives in CA.

But, as I also said above I don't know any of my SSE tomato friends or non-SSE tomato friends who have had problems with PL varieties and cross pollination.

Carolyn, who notes to Bill that Neil L just called for an update this AM and I found out he isn't just tomato obsessed, he's growing 520 different varieties this year, as I knew from long ago, but also has an orchard of about 150 heirloom apples as well as heirloom peaches and pears and nectarines in other orchards and does a lot of grafting. So what other obsessions my tomato friends have are slowly coming to the front. LOL And yes, I've cut a deal with him for apples this Fall; maybe I'll offer him a seed of a new tomato variety for one apple? LOL
pennyrile
Evansville, IN
(Zone 6b)

May 7, 2009
3:47 PM

Post #6517237

Carolyn said, "thanks Bill, for confirming what I wrote above about PL varieties not being any more involved with cross pollinations than others."

Well, I've closely examined many tomato blossoms looking for those that will be the easiest to emasculate and use for crossing. While doing that, I've seen many diffferent varieties that have ruptured or fragmented anther cones and exserted stigma (the sticky pad at the end of the female pistil projecting beyond the enclosing male organ known as the anther cone).

These varieties would be more susceptible to cross pollination than the varieties where the stigma remains encased by the anther cone until self pollination is completed. They're also the easiest to emasculate green blossoms for use in hand crossing.

Yes, Brandywine does this exserted stigma thing, but the single variety that I notice most often has ruptured or fragmented anther cones and exserted stigma is Cherokee Purple ... consistently for me anyway. Maybe it has to do with climate here. Anyway, it's regular leaf. And I've noticed other regular leaf varieties that do the same thing. Usually the large beefsteak types with a propensity for catfacing, zipper drag and lumpy fruit are the ones that do this regardless of leaf shape.

And then there are the outbred and manmade varieties where some wild tomato genes prevail and lend that natural characteristic for exserted stigma, or in some cases self-infertile male sterility which is very useful for making crosses without emasculating. You see this occasionally in commercial plum and home garden hybrid cherry types.

So, yes, Carolyn, I agree that it's not just potato leaf types and not even predominantly potato leaf types that exsert their stigma. But what would tomato lore be without myth?

This message was edited May 7, 2009 10:51 AM

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