Posted by Fitsy (from Hayesville, NC) on November 28, 2008 at 09:45 AM:Hooray for you!!!
My husband worked from a truck, and daily he would fetch home
bags of leaves that people set out on the street. We dumped
them against an old building, and the pile reached onto the roof.
It got toasty warm inside in winter! (Great place to play!)
Don't have a shredder, so things work slower, but benefits are
enormous, as you know.
Fitsy
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Posted by Sundownr (from (Bev) Wytheville, VA) on November 28, 2008 at 10:49 AM:
Fitsy, Sounds like you folks work just as hard gathering leaves as we do, hauling them to your property! How resourceful!!
Someone shoved a 10' length of PVC pipe (2" dia.) into the center of our community compost pile and it heated up enough to bend it over quite a bit. That's pretty hot stuff! I believe the wild critters use the composting leaf pile for warmth in the winter, too.
Thanks for reading and sharing your leaf composting experience. Hope you have continued success with your leaves (and can find a way to shred them).
Bev
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Posted by kathy65468 (from Eunice, MO) on November 28, 2008 at 03:21 PM:
I do not spend time and energy dealing with the leaves. I have many oak, hickory, and maple trees. I discovered that even if I leave them lay where they fall, They are not there when summer comes and we are using the yard for barbecues and fun with the grandkids. Nature takes care of them just fine. The lawn mower chops them up with the last cutting of the season and all is good. The grass does not seem to mind that the leaves are there and I do not have all of that extra work to do.
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Posted by Sundownr (from (Bev) Wytheville, VA) on November 28, 2008 at 03:52 PM:
kathy65468, With your having fewer leaves, and shredding them with the mower, your solution seems perfect for natural decomposition. I bet your grass does very well with the natural amendments, too!
Thanks for the input and reading!
Bev
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Posted by carrielamont (from Milton, MA) on November 28, 2008 at 03:53 PM:
Maybe I will show this article to DH, who feels tremendous pressure from the neighbors because everyone else uses a lawn fertilizing service, a lawn-mowing service, a weed-killing service, a grass-clippings hauling service, a leaf-raking service, a leaf hauling service, etc., etc., etc.! That's OUR STUFF! We paid for the water and potting soil etc., why throw away our crop of leaves and grass? Sorry for sounding hysterical. The home insurance company says the enormous pile of leaves and brush in the back yard is a fire hazard!
Great article! Did I mention that? Hooray!
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Posted by Kelli (from Los Angeles (Canoga , CA) on November 28, 2008 at 05:31 PM:
MIL saw the leaves laying in our back yard and on the patio and said, "It's a shame you can't burn them." I'm thinking, "Why???" We save them and use them as mulch all year. She doesn't understand that. She's old school. For the past 45 years, she's been raking up the leaves and grass clippings in her yard and throwing them away. And she wonders why her soil is no good.
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Posted by kathy65468 (from Eunice, MO) on November 28, 2008 at 05:59 PM:
It is difficult sometimes to remind folks that nature has her own circle/cycle of life. If she didn't we would be up to our eyeballs in dead everything.
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Posted by Sundownr (from (Bev) Wytheville, VA) on November 28, 2008 at 09:34 PM:
People are so used to the chemical approach to tending their yards it's hard to convince them of another, better, or natural way of doing things.
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Posted by pajaritomt (from Los Alamos, NM) on November 28, 2008 at 10:25 PM:
Great article. I live in the semi-arid high desert and my soil is alkaline and sandy. It also has almost no organic matter in it because there is so little rain here. People in town have planted shade trees, but there aren't all that many. I go around begging the neighbors for their leaves and pine needles for making compost each fall. I also get a truckload or two of manure from a friend who has 3 horses and make my compost of the two ingredients, layered and watered layer by layer in a pile. It heats up and if I have time before it gets too cold I turn it. Or I turn it in the spring.
One way or the other I produce wonderful compost, but it is never enough. Composted leaves make the best compost I am aware of. ( Oh and I do mix my grass clippings in, but my lawn is so tiny, that doesn't amount to much. Here in the west we avoid lawns for the most part because they require so much water.)
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Posted by Sundownr (from (Bev) Wytheville, VA) on November 28, 2008 at 11:48 PM:
pajaritomt, You're smart to have discovered the resources available for composting in your area! If folks didn't get rid of their waste, the rest of us wouldn't have anything to work with.
I once lived in the middle of a huge cow pasture and thought cow manure, spent hay, and kitchen waste was all there was to compost. Then I lived in an area where horse manure, sawdust, and shredded paper were the only materials available for successful composting. After all the negative info I had originally heard from others here, I never dreamed we could get such great compost from leaves and grass clippings.
Thanks for your information, and comments on the article.
Happy composting!
Bev
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Posted by Sundownr (from (Bev) Wytheville, VA) on November 28, 2008 at 11:59 PM:
Carrie, I regrettably know first hand the pressure from folks with well-manicured lawns! We tried our best to keep up and it almost beat us. We tried to get on a lawn pro service list after a while, too, with no luck. We tried a lot of things, but found it easier to work with Mother Nature in the end, ...we made lemonade from our lemons, so to speak!
Unless your leaf pile is against a building, or near a source of combustion, how does the insurance company claim it is a fire hazard?
Thanks for your kind comments about the article.
Bev
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Posted by pajaritomt (from Los Alamos, NM) on November 29, 2008 at 01:41 AM:
Bev,
Your article is doing a public service. Many people send their leaves to the land fill. That will probably do some people some good in many years from now, but , how lovely to feed the composted leaves to plants we have now. I talk as many neighbors as possible into giving me their leaves and pine needles. They think I am nuts, but what do I care? My plants grow beautifully with those leaves.
Part of me hopes more people learn this magic to save our land fills, but part of me hopes they don't, so I can get all their leaves.
Sigh. Fall leaves are magic for the garden. Thanks for your article.
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Posted by Sundownr (from (Bev) Wytheville, VA) on November 29, 2008 at 02:22 AM:
pajaritomt, Thanks so much for your kind words!
I've been laughed at a lot over the years for the things I've tried in my garden (the white shredded office paper mulch was a big hoot for a some), but folks usually lighten up when I share my veggies.
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Posted by pajaritomt (from Los Alamos, NM) on November 29, 2008 at 03:09 AM:
Sundownr,
You get the last laugh in this.
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Posted by carrielamont (from Milton, MA) on November 29, 2008 at 07:13 AM:
Bev, I think it has to do with the brush and old Christmas trees that are mixed in, but still. I don't want our house to burn down any more than they do! (Or should I say "melt?")
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Posted by stormyla (from Norristown, PA) on December 02, 2008 at 01:14 PM:
I've recently discovered that the lawn service companies have to pay to have the leaves disposed of. Get this , they deliver them to the commercial mulch making companies and pay for their disposal. Then, they buy them back from the companies as composted leaf mold.
This fall, I talked a landscaper friend into dumping three truckloads, not pickups, large dump trucks, on my property. I shredded them and covered all of the beds with the free mulch which will probably be composted by spring!
Unfortunately I have to send a good bit of my own leaves to the landfill as they are full of black walnut.
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Posted by Sundownr (from (Bev) Wytheville, VA) on December 02, 2008 at 04:41 PM:
stormyla, Good deal for you on the truckloads of free leaves!! That's how we found a free deal on sawdust several years ago, the company gave it away to keep from paying haul and dump fees.
There are herbal remedies for black walnut hulls and green leaves, but nothing that I know of to do with the fallen leaves on a large scale. Tough break. I hope you at least get the use of the shelled nuts!? They're pretty pricey around here.
Thanks for reading and commenting,
Bev
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Posted by marwood0 (from Golden, CO) on December 02, 2008 at 04:52 PM:
That's a good point about the juglone in the black walnut; I worry about other bad things getting in too. Like others have mentioned (or admitted to), I also grab bags of leaves around the neighborhood and haul them back to the yard - usually after dark to avoid unwanted attention. Besides mulch and compost, the kids love to play king of the hill and dive into them. I never grab the neighbors' bags of lawn clippings because of the rampant use of weed-n-feed in my neighborhood. I just don't know much about the toxicidy and would rather be safe than sorry - especially if it's going to grow vegetables that my children eat.
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Posted by Sundownr (from (Bev) Wytheville, VA) on December 02, 2008 at 05:20 PM:
marwood0, I feel the same way about the weed-killers and toxins that might be in the grass clippings. You could probably produce enough kitchen scraps for the nitrogen needed to help compost the leaves anyway.
We loved playing in the leaf piles, too (still do), until a little cousin was accidentally stabbed with a sharp stick that was hidden in the leaves when she jumped into the pile. All was fine a week later, but it really scared the rest of us into finding other games to play with the leaves. Don't mean to rain on your little ones play, but have them be careful.
Thanks for input and reading,
Bev
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Posted by stormyla (from Norristown, PA) on December 02, 2008 at 05:30 PM:
Bev, I questioned the landscaper about the leaves before he brought them. His company only services office complexes and the leaves were almost all Maple.
I don't steal bagged leaves, but my neighbor has seven hugh Maples and after she rakes them all out to the curb, I go out with my vacumn mulcher and pick them up and grind them. If she were a nice and cooperative person, I'd save her the raking, but alas, she is not. She loves growing garlic mustard!
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Posted by pajaritomt (from Los Alamos, NM) on December 02, 2008 at 06:56 PM:
What is garlic mustard? Sounds kind of tasty.
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Posted by Sundownr (from (Bev) Wytheville, VA) on December 02, 2008 at 07:05 PM:
stormyla, Good, glad you know there are no big sharp sticks in the leaves to hurt your babies when they play!
Yeah, what is that garlic mustard thing? Sounds good over here, too, unless that's what makes the neighbor cranky, lol.
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Posted by stormyla (from Norristown, PA) on December 03, 2008 at 02:02 AM:
You folks are too funny! Garlic Mustard is a horribly invasive weed. It's on many state's Invasives lists, including mine. It grows about 2' tall and has white flowers and reseeds prolifically. You all must have seen it, just don't know it's name.
It is pretty, but she lets it grow adjacent to my 200' long tree line bed. I have to weed it out of her property when she's not home, so it won't drop seeds in my bed. She never sharpens the blade on her lawn mower, so it just bends the dandelions over and doesn't cut them. I constantly have to dig them out of my bed.
We live in a suburban housing development and she has no trash service. She takes her house trash to her mother's home to save on not having a service. Her Maples lose tons of limbs in every storm and I've caught her adding hugh piles of them to the piles that I make after I pick mine up. Half of the ones on my property come from her trees anyway.
She never trims any of the dead wood out of her trees and 3 times limbs have come down and torn all of the wires and fittings and gutters off of my house. One time we were without power for a week because of it. She refused to let the power company on to her property to recable it until her insurance adjuster could come out and so we went an extra 5 days without power in a 100 degree weather. In short, she is the neigbor from h.......
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Posted by Sundownr (from (Bev) Wytheville, VA) on December 03, 2008 at 09:54 AM:
stormyla, I did a search of the garlic mustard and found it was an edible weed high in vitamins A and C, brought to America by early settlers as a pot herb. And, it's on our state's invasive weed list (VA), too. Thanks for the heads up!
One of the organic methods to rid an area of the weed is repeated early spring pullings to exhaust the site, eventually killing it off (which you already do). There are several recipes available on the 'Net for pesto using the weed. If you can't beat 'em, eat 'em!
Maybe you need to make that cranky neighbor lady some cookies (or mustard weed pesto) and have a heart-to-heart chat with her. There's nothing worse than having a nasty neighbor.
Good luck to you!
Bev
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Posted by stormyla (from Norristown, PA) on December 03, 2008 at 10:56 AM:
Bev, Thanks, I may look into the Pesto. Your cookie suggestion may be good for someone else, but no amount of kindness has worked with this woman. I've done way too many favors for her in the past. She has called the police on every family who lives on our block. Oh well, we all must have some nuisances in our lives!
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Posted by Sundownr (from (Bev) Wytheville, VA) on December 03, 2008 at 11:42 AM:
stormyla, I'm so sorry you have such a pest for a neighbor, but at least you tried to make peace! Seems like every neighborhood has one bad apple.
May you have patience,
Bev
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Posted by pajaritomt (from Los Alamos, NM) on December 03, 2008 at 01:40 PM:
I know the weed -- we call it Oriental garlic chives and I actually started it from seed. I put it in sauces for spaghetti. I does get out of had a bit here, but I guess with our dry weather it isn't so much a problem as where you live.
As for the neighbor -- I can definitely relate. I have one who is a pill. Luckily she doesn't call the police on me but she did call the county to complain about the weeds in my vacant lot. They gave me a ticket. But they supported me in composting which was another of her objections. And I also had a bad neighbor in my previous neighborhood -- only one, though.
I guess there is a law of nature that says every neighbor hood must have at least one curmudgeon.
At least you get her leaves. I have a hard time getting leaves here in New Mexico because our main trees are pine. I wish I had a friend with a maple tree who would let me have the leaves.
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Based on the final numbers (and a few years of other unproductive methods), we mow our yard with a riding lawn mower equipped to shred and vacuum yard waste, then dump the debris on a huge pile in the woods, out of the way, out of sight, and decomposing. What we have now is an accidental community compost pile with the sweetest smelling (to a gardener), richest black dirt that we have ever seen. The wild mushrooms seem to like our mix of compost, too.
As the grass is mowed in the fall, the leaves are shredded, and sucked up together into the collection carts. Along with the mulched leaves, grass, and twigs, there is rotting fruit from two late-bearing apple trees, small piles of manure from the apple-eating deer, and various visiting cats, dogs, and other wildlife. All these carbons (C) and nitrogens (N) are combined into a mixture primed for relatively quick composting (see the C:N Ratios of Yard Waste chart at right).
Other neighbors have various methods of dealing with the leaves. Some rake and blow them onto tarps to be hauled away on trucks and trailers to the landfill. Still others burn them in the drainage ditches along the roadway in front of their homes, or barren spaces among the trees, filling the subdivision with the heavy smoke.
