The scoop on 'J.L. Hudson, Seedsman'

Feedback History and Summary   131 positives 1 neutral 4 negatives

Comments:

Rating Author Content Positive therica (2 reviews) On May 16, 2008, therica Falling Waters, WV (Zone 7a) wrote: I've ordered from JL Hudson a few times. Their online catalog is difficult to discern or read at times, as I've discussed with them in the past. But they're seed-people and not html-programmers, so I understand. They've always shipped promptly and sent viable seeds. Last year, early summer 2007, I needed some creeping thyme. I went through about 2 weeks of go-rounds in emails with them, and they were fantastic and very patient. We finally sorted out what plant-seeds I actually wanted, and what they still had in stock. They had only one packet left. So-- their whole gross-income for all of that was $4.50 plus the cost of a postage stamp to send it to me. Try to find that kind of dedication and customer-service anywhere else, these days! Positive Ammu (3 reviews) On May 2, 2008, Ammu wrote: Simply Amazing!. I ordered seeds via postal mail last week & i received the seeds this afternoon. They have a wide variety of seeds from the very ordinary to the most unusual. Very good prices too!. Positive Dauphin (3 reviews) On April 24, 2008, Dauphin Loganville, GA wrote: J.L. Hudson is a veritable treasure trove of rare and unusual seeds. I have used them before, am using them this spring, and likely will use them for years to come. The order interface is a bit unusual, but if you can't take the time to write up an email, chances are you do not have the patience or time to be a decent gardener either ;). My personal favorite is the "long standing" cilantro. For those of you who have been frustrated trying to grow your own for garden fresh salsas, (and then watch the plant bolt to seed before you could harvest) this variety is a life saver. I have not seen it offered anywhere else. In a nutshell: Top notch selection, fast and reasonable shipping, great results with fresh, viable seeds. Highly recommended! Positive grimelda (1 review) On April 22, 2008, grimelda Stockholm (Sweden) wrote: I placed an order with them a little over a week ago and it arrived today. You might not think that is remarkable, but they had to travel all the way from California to Sweden! I haven't planted the seeds yet so I can't testify as to their quality, but everything I ordered is present, including the catalogue. Not only that, but the postage on the order is about twice what I actually paid (and that doesn't include the cost of the packaging). On the whole, I can't recommend this company highly enough: their list is extensive and includes many varieties I have not seen elsewhere, the seeds are charmingly packed, the catalogue is great reading, the service fast and the communication excellent. Positive LYNWOODSTUDIO (1 review) On April 15, 2008, LYNWOODSTUDIO Daphne, AL wrote: I have been ordering seeds from JL HUDSON for about 8 years. Wonderful people and excellent service! The best thing I can say is that the germination rate of the seeds is outstanding even for the difficult ones!! I am a novice gardener and have always had outstanding luck. The people below that left negatives really need to get a new life. If you can't read the instructions or fill out forms properly, please go to the garden center at Home Depot, they have people there in red vests that can read you all the instructions. When I order from JL HUDSON, I list alternatives for items that could be sold out or items that will not be appropriate for my area and have NEVER been disappointed with any order I have ever received. I have several show dogs that run in my back yard and so on every order I note if any of the selections I choose could be poisonous to the dogs to please advise. Wow.. and they do the extra research each and every time without charge or argument and let me know. How can one get better service??? I gladly pay for the seeds and always add a couple dollars to have them make additional additions of wonderful new items they like in particular. They are a wealth of knowledge! So to the people looking for hard to find… if ever… seeds, want great germination, information and excellent service, I can tell you that the people at JL HUDSON is where you want to shop. My average purchases are about $50.00 per year and I receive free of charge 1 catalogue in the winter and a couple supplements during the year. The catalogue by the way is OUTSTANDING!!! LYNWOOD STUDIO Positive luannewolf (1 review) On April 1, 2008, luannewolf Fayetteville, AR wrote: I give JL Hudson a gold star for customer service. I ordered some vegetable and flower seeds, planted most of them in flats on my heat mats, and then realized that one flower packet was missing. I don't really know if I lost it or if it was not in the order in the first place. So, I emailed JL Hudson and told them I couldn't find my Valerian seed, and even though they were correct that it was listed on the packing list, they immediately sent me another packet of seed. That's what I call customer service! Positive trioadastra (3 reviews) On March 22, 2008, trioadastra Ellsworth, WI (Zone 4a) wrote: Very good selection, very reasonable prices. Fast and inexpensive shipping. The ordering process was a bit more difficult than cart shopping; I printed the instructions and referenced them to make sure I didn't screw anything up. No, The seeds do not come with germination instructions, but if you need help germinating seeds, you probably shouldn't be ordering unusual seeds from a seed bank anyway. I'll definately come back for more seeds from JL Hudson. Positive Helios (6 reviews) On March 11, 2008, Helios Louisville, KY wrote: I received my order extremely quickly... faster than some other online retailers. J.L Hudson has seeds that are quite hard to find (they are the only place I could find Sweet Woodruff seeds), and the quantities and prices are good. Positive faerygardener (6 reviews) On February 12, 2008, faerygardener Angels Camp, CA (Zone 7a) wrote: JL Hudson has a fantastic selection of seeds at VERY reasonable prices with the lowest shipping I've seen. I placed a good size order on the internet on Thursday evening and received it the following Monday. I simply read and followed their instructions for ordering and found working with them a breeze. Highly recommend this company. Positive Atropanthe (1 review) On January 30, 2008, Atropanthe Memphis, TN wrote: "Preservation Through Dissemination" I have been a 100% satisfied customer of JL Hudson since the early 90's. A truly outstanding selection of rare and obscure species, good germination rates and promotion of GA-3 experimentation combined with accurate, prompt and courteous service. I look forward to many more years of being a loyal customer. Positive jnbgregg (2 reviews) On January 6, 2008, jnbgregg Baltimore, MD wrote: Just received this year's order. All items ordered were delivered. Thank you. Have been dealing with JL Hudson since the early 90s and will continue to do so. Selection runs from the commonplace to the unique and unusual. Seed germination has always been high. Live plant material has always arrived in good condition. I've written with questions over the years, and have always received a courteous, prompt reply. For anyone interested in biodiversity and what is happening politically in the United States and abroad, the books Ecofascism: Lessons from the German Experience, and Invasion Biology: Critique of a Pseudoscience, available through JLH are worth reading. Positive ryanlath (2 reviews) On December 6, 2007, ryanlath San Francisco, CA wrote: Seeds arrived promptly. Lots of seeds per packet, cheap prices. High germination rate. Everything I bought sprouted in the first week! How exciting! Positive LariAnn (5 reviews) On November 26, 2007, LariAnn Miami, FL (Zone 10a) wrote: I'm very pleased in doing business with J. L. Hudson, Seedsman. I ordered 4 packets of Eucalyptus seeds on 11/5/2007; the order was filled promptly and I received them about a week after I ordered them. On planting, most of them had germinated after only one week! Very good viability and fine service. I just placed another, larger, order for more Eucalyptus seeds on 11/26/07. On November 30th, 2007, LariAnn added the following: Update: My second order arrived today, 11/30/07, much faster than the first one! I'm very excited now to grow all the new Eucalyptus seeds I just received. Another great experience with J. L. Hudson, Seedsman. Thanks Much! Positive majuscule (2 reviews) On November 2, 2007, majuscule Bloomfield, CT wrote: I like this company! Though they are more of a seed bank, with lots of interesting hard to find items, than your usual commercial catalog. The black and white catalog is filled with small print but many many many varieties of seeds to to choose from. These folks must spend their time tending to business rather than looking for cute garden ornaments and garden equipment to sell. If you're into the scientific side of gardening, don't miss their GA-3 (gibberelic acid) kits for difficult to sprout seeds. It had been my dream from high school to use this and now I have a source. I have never had a problem with them, but once when I sent a note along with my order (about a success with a difficult seed) I got back a short hand written note! Good folks at J. L. Hudson! Positive jenf (4 reviews) On October 24, 2007, jenf Qualicum, BC (Zone 7b) wrote: Been looking at the web site for a few years now. Thought I would give it a try, although I tend to avoid cross border shopping. The prices and shipping to Canada were very reasonable, communication was great. And the seeds arrived quickly and as ordered. Thanks, I'll be back for more. Positive suellaf (1 review) On October 18, 2007, suellaf Tahlequah, OK wrote: First time to visit Dave's Garden and had to make a quick comment about my experience with, JL HUDSON... I have been ordering from you for over 17 years. We first moved to our "homestead" 18 years ago. I have had only positive results and customer service from your company has been wonderful. We still "farm" on a small scale, and I still order my seeds from your company. You have always been fair, courteous and helpful. But the best are your seeds the quality is great and I appreciate the credits when a seed is not available... I have always had excellent results from you. Keep up the good work and Philosophy... Positive katiebear (3 reviews) On October 5, 2007, katiebear mulege (Mexico) wrote: First, I love their catalog. It is informative, opinionated and entertaining. Second, their service has been excellent. In one instance my seeds were returned to them from the address I gave them (entirely my fault) and they remailed them to me in Mexico AT THEIR EXPENSE. Third, I like their philosophy and the way they put it into practice. This is a good company to support. Positive soilserf (9 reviews) On August 26, 2007, soilserf douglasville, GA (Zone 7a) wrote: I purchase seeds from J.L. Hudson from time to time and find their products and customer service to outstanding. Their shipping charges are in line with other companies, and their products are received in good order. Positive cocoa_lulu (1 review) On August 25, 2007, cocoa_lulu Grand Saline, TX (Zone 7b) wrote: I placed my first order this week with J.L.Hudson Seedman. I even managed to make a mistake in not adding my mailing address to my order (it was given through paypal which makes it harder for them to fill the order). I'm sorry for the mistake. That being said, no one with J.L.Hudson treated me like a second rate citizen or berated me for my mistake. I received my order quickly and I'm very pleased, will order again. Positive odinthor (1 review) On July 25, 2007, odinthor Los Alamitos, CA wrote: I have purchased seed from J.L. Hudson, Seedsman, for decades (since the 1970s, I believe). I wish all seed companies--indeed, all vendors--were as dependable and straightforward as this one. The amount of seed supplied is generous; the seed is of high quality; and you find here many a thing which you will not find elsewhere. It can't be easy to make a profit with, on the one hand, seeds of obscure plants which are not in high demand, and, on the other, the likely quick-selling-out of such sorts as *are* in high demand; this company is to be congratulated for persevering in its business. If seed of the same particular variety were being offered by, say, Burpee, Park, Thompson & Morgan, Johnny's Seeds, and J.L. Hudson, I would without hesitation choose to buy the seed packet from Hudson rather than the others. The customer owes it to himself and to the company to read, understand, and act in accordance with the stated terms of business; if this is done, it's smooth sailing all the way with J.L. Hudson, Seedsman! Company representative comment on July 26, 2007: On Jul 26, 2007 6:41 PM, J.L. Hudson, Seedsman added: Hey, thanks! After the last two ratings, its nice to hear from someone who appreciates us! We really do try hard to do a good job, and hope we succeed. We like to please our customers, and its really nice to know when we do. Negative gsteinbe (8 reviews) On July 18, 2007, gsteinbe Trenton, NJ wrote: I placed an order from J. L. Hudson's print catalogue. On the order form, I had to mark whether, for out-of-stock seeds, I wanted substitute seeds or a voucher. I didn't really see an option to request a refund. So, I marked "voucher." My order arrived with a voucher for several seeds that were apparently out of stock. I immediately placed another replacement order and used the voucher. On the order form, I once again marked "voucher" for out-of-stock seeds. When my order arrived, once again some seeds were out of stock, and I got another voucher. But at this point, I realized something. Every time I placed an order to replace the out-of-stock seeds from my last order, I was repaying the shipping and handling charge. If I had gotten all the seeds I'd ordered the first time, I wouldn't have had to pay shipping and handling again and again. And why were so many seeds out of stock? I placed three orders, and in every single order, some seeds were unavailable. Either I was *very* unlucky, or J. L. Hudson lists a lot of seeds in its print catalogue that aren't really available. So, I emailed J. L. Hudson to say that I wasn't overly happy with this situation. Given the high ratings here, I fully expected to get a nice email back and maybe even a refund for some of the shipping and handling charges that I had paid. It wasn't *that* much money, so I wasn't set on a refund. I mostly just wanted to hear from J. L. Hudson that they appreciate my business and sympathize with my feelings. Instead, I got an extremely snotty message that essentially told me never to order from J. L. Hudson again. The message basically said that I was the idiot who marked "voucher" on the order form and didn't check the website for availability of seeds, so I got what I deserved. Clearly, J. L. Hudson doesn't appreciate my business or sympathize with my feelings at all. J. L. Hudson's email went on and on and on too, such that I began to think, "The lady doth protest too much." I laughed out loud when I got to the part of the message where I was told that J. L. Hudson sells only the finest seed after meticulously testing its germination rate (as if I had complained in any way about their seed's quality). And I can't help but note that every negative rating here has a very long, defensive diatribe from J. L. Hudson accompanying it. In every case, it seems, if someone is dissatisfied with J. L. Hudson, the dissatisfaction can't possibly be J. L. Hudson's fault in any way; the dissatisfaction is the result of the complainer's being an idiot or a liar or a baby. I don't like defensive, arrogant people, so why on earth would I do business with a defensive, arrogant company? There are too many good businesses out there to waste my time on J. L. Hudson. For those of you who have positive experiences with J. L. Hudson, I hope you never have reason to complain about anything in any way, because if you ever do, you'll probably see a very different side of J. L. Hudson. On July 31st, 2007, gsteinbe added the following: I want to thank J. L. Hudson for posting the partial scans of my order forms. Now I remember why I had the impression that there wasn't a refund option on the form. The form says, "REFUND (Small Amounts in Stamps)." Now, I'm a college English professor, so maybe I read too much into things, but I was a little unsure what "Small Amounts in Stamps" meant. Did it mean that one could only get a refund if the amount to be refunded was small (and it would come in stamps)? Did it mean that one could get a refund for any amount, but if the amount was small (as determined by J. L. Hudson), one would get it in stamps? How small is small? What kind of stamps? Postage stamps, food stamps, grocery stamps, what? I thought marking "CREDIT MEMO" was at least less fraught with uncertainty. And besides, I didn't expect a lot of things to be out of stock, since I was ordering in January 2007 from a January 2007 catalogue. Only after I had gotten two or three credit memos did it occur to me that, each time I redeemed a credit memo, I was paying postage all over again (as was J. L. Hudson, of course, when sending my orders to me). But the real problem here wasn't the order form, the credit memos, the postage, or any of that. The real problem was that J. L. Hudson was (is?) snotty and holier-than-thou: "We filled both of your requests for seed promptly, accurately, and followed your instructions to the letter." That phrase "to the letter" there seems to sum it all up. I admit it openly. J. L. Hudson was technically, according to the letter, proper in all that they did in their dealings with me, and they apparently take *tremendous* pride in that fact. As another dissatisfied customer posted here, J. L. Hudson is "clearly more committed to being right than they are to customer service." To quote J. L. Hudson again, "I'm sorry if I do not apologise to people for filling their orders exactly as they instruct." Who *asked* you to apologize for that? Are you not sorry at all that I found the process of ordering from you frustrating because of the number of out-of-stock seeds listed in your print catalogue and the ambiguity of your order form's "REFUND (Small Amounts in Stamps)"? I wanted to hear that you were sorry about that kind of thing; I never expected or wanted or asked you to apologize for filling my order "to the letter." But you seem too busy justifying yourself to empathize with your customers. If I were an elderly person or a child who filled out the order form wrong and got charged for a bunch of seed that I didn't want, that'd be just what I deserved, right? As long as you filled my order "to the letter," you wouldn't care if I ended up with a bunch of seed that I didn't want for a bunch of money I didn't intend to spend? Hey, you filled my order exactly as I instructed. You did nothing wrong. If I'm too lazy and stupid (OR too old and senile OR too young and innocent) to get the order form right, that's *my* problem, right? Good luck with that attitude. On August 1st, 2007, gsteinbe added the following: One last note (which I forgot in my last posting): J. L. Hudson suggested that every negative rating they've received here was libellous and that their responses are just "set[ting] the record straight," but I find interesting the fact that, so far, I've posted two negative, two neutral, and four positive ratings on this website. Of those, no one but J. L. Hudson felt obliged "to set the record straight," and in fact, Burpee, to whom I gave a neutral rating, emailed me privately to apologize for the way I was treated by their customer service people -- even though the incident I mentioned in my rating happened more than a year ago and they only have my word that it happened at all. Interesting how people's attitudes can be so different from one another, isn't it? Company representative comment on July 26, 2007: On Jul 26, 2007 6:37 PM, J.L. Hudson, Seedsman added: Here we go again! Mr. Steinberg wrote: "I placed an order from J. L. Hudson's print catalogue. On the order form, I had to mark whether, for out-of-stock seeds, I wanted substitute seeds or a voucher. I didn't really see an option to request a refund. So, I marked "voucher." In fact, in his email to us dated February 8, 2007 he stated: "I would say that this was all my own fault for checking "CREDIT MEMO" on my order forms instead of "REFUND," but I didn't really expect to have so much trouble with out-of-stock items when I ordered from a January 2007 catalog *in* January 2007." Go to [HYPERLINK@www.jlhudsonseeds.net] to see scans of his order forms - you can see that the "REFUND" option is quite visible right below the "CREDIT MEMO" option he clearly marked - there is ABSOLUTELY no way he could not have seen a refund option, and besides that, he admits in his email to us that he could have checked "Refund". Yet now he claims "I didn't really see an option to request a refund." This is very interesting. Mr. Steinberg wrote: "I placed three orders, and in every single order, some seeds were unavailable." Incorrect - on his order dated July 14th 2006, which was mailed to him July 18th - nothing was out of stock. There were out-of-stock items on his two subsequent orders: He ordered Jan 16 2007, it was mailed Jan 19th - 1 packet of Rosa eglanteria and 1 oz Allium tuberosum were out of stock - he asked for credit, we sent credit of $8.45 - $8 for seed, 45c for the postage he paid for the ounce. You can clearly see in the scans of his order forms that he checked the "Credit" option, and that we credited him the postage on the out-of-stock ounce. He ordered Jan 26, it was mailed Jan 30 - he returned his credit memo plus a check for $4.50 - 1 oz Elaeagnus multiflora out of stock. Again he asked for credit, we credited $6.45 - $6 for the seed, plus 45c for the postage he paid for he ounce. He states that: "But at this point, I realized something. Every time I placed an order to replace the out-of-stock seeds from my last order, I was repaying the shipping and handling charge." Again, you can see from the scans that we credited him every cent of the postage he paid for the out-of-stock ounces he ordered. He did have to pay for the postage on the packets he ordered, and which he received - why we should have to refund him postage and packing which we already spent on mailing his seeds, I do not know. Our policy is to refund or credit any postage paid for bulk quantities when those are out of stock, and refund or credit any excess postage paid. However, we do not give free postage on orders returning a credit memo. Our postage rates are at cost as it is -- unlike some companies, we do not make money on postage charges. Mr. Steinberg wrote: "I placed three orders, and in every single order, some seeds were unavailable. Either I was *very* unlucky, or J. L. Hudson lists a lot of seeds in its print catalogue that aren't really available." He has implied that we have no refund option, and further that we list a lot of items we do not in fact carry - the implication is that we gain money by not having to refund for a bunch of things that we don't carry. Actually, the costs of printing and mailing a catalog are such that we do everything possible to minimize out-of-stock items - why spend money on printing the descriptions and mailing a catalog of things we do not carry? In fact our TOTAL for out of stock items in 2006 was a mere 2.8%. The 2007 total out of stock is running about 2%. He wrote: "Instead, I got an extremely snotty message that essentially told me never to order from J. L. Hudson again. The message basically said that I was the idiot who marked "voucher" on the order form and didn't check the website for availability of seeds, so I got what I deserved." What I replied was: "I am very surprised to hear that you are 'annoyed at the service I have received this year.' We filled both of your requests for seed promptly, accurately, and followed your instructions to the letter ('Credit Memo for out-of-stock items')." Strange that he thinks this is "extremely snotty". At no time did I ever call him an "idiot", or say that "he got what he deserved". And to answer his question about why there are out-of-stock items in January, ("Why are you advertising so many items that are already out of stock in the very month that you published your catalog?") I replied: "As for having so many items out of stock the first month the catalog goes out - first, we have to get the catalog final format to the printer in late November (it takes some weeks to print), and we don't always have confirmations of what our collectors/growers will not be able to supply. Some species inevitably come in late, so are out of stock the first few weeks of the year. Then there may be a few items that come in, but our germination test shows the seed to be inadequate, so we do not distribute that seed, and have to try and hunt down another source of supply (if any)." My reply, simply trying to explain why there may be out of stock seeds at any time of year, even though they are listed in our print catalog, seemed to make him even more angry. Also, we do provide continuously updated sold out information on our website - anyone with internet access who wishes to avoid ordering out-of-stock items can check the website. We can't do this in the print catalog for obvious reasons. "I laughed out loud when I got to the part of the message where I was told that J. L. Hudson sells only the finest seed after meticulously testing its germination rate (as if I had complained in any way about their seed's quality)." As you can see from my reply, I merely mentioned that sometimes things are out of stock because if germination is low, we do not distribute them. I certainly did not use the phrase "the finest seed after meticulously testing its germination rate" as he claims. As for telling him "never to order from J. L. Hudson again", I explained: "We are a seed bank, not a commercial enterprise... We invite you to obtain the seeds you need from a commercial enterprise, and hope you find a source of supply that meets your satisfaction." He states in his rating of us: "And I can't help but note that every negative rating here has a very long, defensive diatribe from J. L. Hudson accompanying it. In every case, it seems, if someone is dissatisfied with J. L. Hudson, the dissatisfaction can't possibly be J. L. Hudson's fault in any way; the dissatisfaction is the result of the complainer's being an idiot or a liar or a baby. I don't like defensive, arrogant people, so why on earth would I do business with a defensive, arrogant company?" This is actually kind of a neat trick - if we take the time to try to set the record straight after being libeled online, we are posting a "very long, defensive diatribe". If we show that the problem was not actually our fault, but because of customer error [they gave us the wrong address (Heimler and Lamb Abbey), the seed that failed actually tested out with high germination (Shirer), or this guy, who checked "Credit" and got credit] then we are "defensive and arrogant". Neat trick - if we respond in any way other than apologizing to people for their own mistakes, we are bad guys. This guy just won't take any responsibility. Check his neutral review of Logee's - one of the most respected nurseries in the country - and his complaint that their plants don't live long. I guess it must be their fault that plants in his care do not live a long time - it can't have anything to do with him. He states: "For those of you who have positive experiences with J. L. Hudson, I hope you never have reason to complain about anything in any way, because if you ever do, you'll probably see a very different side of J. L. Hudson." Again, untrue. We absolutely will admit it whenever we make a mistake. If we make a mistake, we always "own up" to it and correct the problem - check these ratings of us: Windy (March 26 2005 - on next page of reviews) - we sent the wrong packet on an order, and immediately replaced it. airren (20 July 2003) - "... one packet was missed in shipping - customer service answered my email immediately and sent the missing packet." corbus (Nov 24 2006) - he describes getting zero germination from a packet and our helpful response - "The one time (years ago) we had zero germination we wrote for advice, and received a reply with detailed instructions as well as a free packet of seed." As for being "snotty" or arrogant: dirtdiver (23 Feb 2005) - "fast and polite". As for overcharging for postage and packing: Audrey (Jan 20 2007) - "Their charge for shipping is the lowest I've seen, which allows me to get even more seeds." We stand by our high reputation, and would urge readers of Garden Watchdog to look over the many positive ratings we have received. And do check out the negative reviews we have received, and our replies - judge for yourself whether they are "diatribes" or whether they are honest explanations of the facts. I'm sorry if I do not apologise to people for filling their orders exactly as they instruct. Negative Lamb_Abbey (2 reviews) On July 5, 2007, Lamb_Abbey Union, ME wrote: I had such high hopes with these folks. They've got a really interesting selection of seeds and I very much like their philosophy. My recent experience with them however was deplorable. I ordered 2 ounces of Amaranth seeds from them, paid for the order via Paypal (an option they strongly urge people to use), and provided to them within my Paypal transaction the specifics of the seed request in lucid detail, including the item ordered, qty, cost, shipping address, etc. I shortly thereafter received a quick e-mail that my order had shipped. All good stuff. Weeks later I learned that they never bothered to read the confirmation e-mail that Paypal had provided to them with all of my order information and that my order was simply shipped to a name, city and state (no street address) that was part of a signature file in a subsequent e-mail I'd sent to them after processing my Paypal payment. Most people who use Paypal, not to mention vendors who urge their customers to use it, know that a Paypal transaction is set up to relay all of the information that they may need to process your order. JL Hudson never bothered to read the Paypal e-mail sent to them with my payment. They apparently saw an incomplete address in a follow up e-mail I'd sent to them and figured "oh, what the hell. . . let's mail it to this black hole. . . .it'll get there eventually." A company committed to good service wouldn't have this slipshod attitude. One, they'd have read the Paypal confirmation and noticed the full address and order details provided to them there. Two, if they'd not bothered reading the Paypal confirmation, they'd at least have noticed the lack of a complete address in the customers follow-up e-mail and would've contacted the customer asking for clarification. Moreover, upon having a disappointed customer point out their oversight which caused the order to be shipped to an erroneous address, they'd have resisted the urge to send off a histrionic e-mail to the customer attempting to make them wrong for their own poor service, lack of attention to detail, and sloppy business practices. The money for the order has been refunded and I shall not be doing business with JL Hudson again. It's such a shame to stumble across a business clearly more committed to being right than they are to customer service. Any business that understands the true concept of service would've taken ownership for the oversight and focused on what they could've done to end up with a satisfied customer. Unfortunately, these same folks eventually will read this feedback and expend 10 times the effort responding to it than they actually spent on my order. That's what's really sad. J A Gasbarre Vinalhaven, Maine Company representative comment on July 10, 2007: On Jul 10, 2007 7:25 PM, J.L. Hudson, Seedsman added: Sigh. This guy is so completely wrong. Reviewing his emails, from the very first he approached us with an attitude - a chip on his shoulder. Absolutely nothing we could ever do could possibly satisfy him, he was just looking for a fight. He requested seed, and gave us the wrong address - simple as that. We filled his seed request exactly as he wrote it, and mailed it to exactly the shipping address he gave us. He claims he followed our instructions for requesting seed - he did exactly the OPPOSITE. We sent him a FULL REFUND, because he claimed it was now too late to plant. What else could we do? In the "histrionic" email I supposedly sent him, I simply pointed out to him the three places on our "How to request seeds online" page where we ask people to give their mailing address in the seed request e-mail (NOT in the PayPal payment). Also, there are two places where we tell people specifically NOT to put their seed request and address in the PayPal payment, but in a separate e-mail, so of course he buried his correct address only in his PayPal payment, and gave an incorrect shipping address in his seed request. We patiently complied with all of his demands for special treatment (confirming in-stock, confirming that we would notify him when mailed, etc.) Unfortunately, his e-mails became ever more rude and demanding, no matter what we did to try to please him. Finally, I sent the e-mail pointing out that he had refused to follow our clear, simple instructions for requesting seed, and in fact he had placed his request in exactly the opposite way we instruct. I mentioned that I did not appreciate his rudeness, and that I thought he would be happier ordering seed from a corporate seed company that caters to "consumers", rather than requesting seed from a seed bank, and that we would not be supplying him with seeds in the future. This of course triggered his shrill negative review above, in which he refuses to acknowledge any responsibility for giving us the wrong shipping address - it's just all our fault, no matter what. One percent of the public consumes 95% of the customer-service resources of any organization. Every day we patiently answer questions that could easily be answered by looking at our website. We advise people on gardening problems, we refer people to other sources, we may end up answering a half-dozen e-mails for someone, and get a one-packet seed request for our pains. We are glad to do this - it is part of our public service. We will bend over backwards for our clients, but there are limits. Contrary to Mr. Gasbarre, this response is actually only one-tenth the effort we put into trying to make him happy. We stand by our reputation - if anyone takes this shrill, accusitory review seriously, just read the many positive reviews below to get an idea of the quality of our customer service, and how we readily own up to any genuine mistake we may make and correct it. --JLH Positive thistledownfarm (1 review) On June 2, 2007, thistledownfarm North Lakewood, WA (Zone 8b) wrote: I LOVE J.L. Hudson Seeds!!! I have placed some large orders because they offer many things not found anywhere else. I've had very good success with the majority of their seeds. I find the catalog a great reference tool also. I'm already researching and compiling my next order. Keep up the great work!!! Linda Thistledown Farm A very satisfied customer. Positive kattrox (14 reviews) On May 22, 2007, kattrox Floyds Knobs, IN (Zone 6b) wrote: I have been a customer for a few years now and have had much success with seeds from JL Hudson. They have a lot of unique and diverse seeds that cannot be found elsewhere with complete growing instructions. The catalog is priceless that I find myself referring to it again and again. Orders are received quickly and seed quantities are quite generous Thanks! Positive glendalekid (17 reviews) On May 21, 2007, glendalekid Tuscaloosa, AL (Zone 7b) wrote: On May 18, 2007, I ordered two packages of watermelon seeds. On the same day, I received an email that my order had been received. Later the same day, I received another email that my order had been sent. I received the seeds in today's mail, May 21st!! I would definitely order again from them and recommend them to others. Karen Positive Ruth_MI (2 reviews) On April 22, 2007, Ruth_MI South Monroe, MI wrote: Wanted to bulk order some seeds, and found them here for a reasonable price. Arrived in about a week from the time I ordered. Will order from them again. Positive mrhank (1 review) On April 5, 2007, mrhank Chicago, IL wrote: What's not to like about this company? Outstanding in EVERY WAY. Selection. Support. Speed of shipment. Knowledge. Follow up. Price. I'm so thoroughly delighted with this company that I need to buy more land, so I can get more seeds. HIGHEST RECOMENDATION. Positive ara133 (3 reviews) On April 3, 2007, ara133 State College, PA wrote: I ordered seeds March 27 and have them already! I paid by paypal, which went very smoothly, and I'm really excited to plant my new seeds! Also, the packaging was well done - included a new catalog, updates and nice packing slip with my original request on it (which is nice, because now I don't have to check my sent emails to find out which ones I ordered!). Thanks JLH! On April 3rd, 2007, ara133 added the following: Edited - I forgot to add that I was going to check my emails to see if what I received matched what I ordered, as I always like to verify. The packing slip was helpful, and I received everything I ordered! Positive mhughes1 (1 review) On March 25, 2007, mhughes1 Auburn, ME wrote: I have been ordering seeds from J.L. Hudson for many years and I have had the most positive experience with this company. The catalogue provides a wealth of information about a wide variety of plants, and the book selection is equally interesting. Service is outstanding--shipments arrive promptly, the orders are accurately filled, and, in the rare cases of out-of-supply, replacement choices are thoughtful & interesting. What a wonderful company! Positive RichoCech (16 reviews) On March 22, 2007, RichoCech Williams, OR wrote: Probably the most experienced seedspeople currently working in the US. JLH tests every lot of seed that comes through their facility and makes sure viable material is being sent out. Their Phalaris seed came up in 4 days--the fastest germinator I tested this year. The several complaints I see against this company at this venue appear to be attributable to the normal realities of seed planting--sometimes you get it right, and sometimes you don't--some seeds are easy, some are highly recalcitrant. I feel sorry for gardeners that get stuck in acrimonous diatribe about their failures. Surely they have been mistreated somewhere along the line, but projecting these difficulties onto well-meaning and dedicated seedspeople is inappropriate. Upset about something? Look to the garden as a salve, not a battleground--give the gentle seedspeople a break, plant a different seed, listen to the birds, and concentrate your attentions on all the things that did grow, and make them beautiful--you will have plenty to do, I expect, and get healthier and happier as you garden away your cares. Positive njcolburn (1 review) On February 26, 2007, njcolburn Richland, WA wrote: EXCELLENT Transaction. Seeds arrived promptly and I am very excited to begin planting. I will definitely order from the Seedsman again. AA+! Positive jawharpqueen (2 reviews) On February 25, 2007, jawharpqueen San Francisco, CA (Zone 10a) wrote: J. L. Hudson's seed catalog is so fantastic -- educational, fun, fascinating, and packed with information and thoughtful quotations. No photos, but then again you can find photos on this site or elsewhere on the internet. I have ordered twice from them so far and was quite happy with everything. The most recent time (Feb. 2007) I placed an order I got the seeds extremely quickly. Their seeds have germinated well, and their packets are hand-typed! They have seeds for such interesting plants, some very rare ones as well as the usual suspects. Such an amazing variety, too. I am going to buy all my seeds from them if I can from now on. I love their outlook as well. Company representative comment on February 27, 2007: On Feb 27, 2007 5:51 PM, J.L. Hudson, Seedsman added: Thanks for your kind comments! But I must correct one thing - we don't hand-type our seed packets - they are printed with an antique machine called an "Addressograph". It uses a stamped metal plate and an inked ribbon, so it does look just like typing, but we can pound out the packets at more than one per second! (For you youngsters out there, ask an old-timer what a "typewriter" is. They were amazing word-processors that needed no electricity, and never crashed!) Addressographs were the technology of choice for mailing lists up through the 1970s, and have only faded away during the last thirty years or so. They could even do complex sorting and selection of addresses through an interesting "mechanical computer" involving pins and tabs. So why do we still use an antique like this? No electricity! Never crashes! When we moved out here to our remote, off-the-grid location back in 1982, we ran the seedbank entirely without electricity for years - we even used kerosine lamps until we got some solar panels and 12 volt lights. Now we have a small bank of panels and have regular 115v AC, but the old Addressograph still works fine, and "if it ain't broke, don't fix it". I even have one of the mechanical platemakers, which stamps the metal plates - it was built in about 1909, and when I got it, it had been sitting in a barn for decades, was covered with hay dust, but I just dusted it with compressed air, shot some WD40 on it, and it worked fine. They don't build things like that anymore. Judging from how fast computers become obsolete, I expect that old antique will still be working long after every computer now in existence has gone to the scrap-heap. Sometimes, like with wine, heirloom vegetables, and antique machines, older is better! Positive valliebeth17 (2 reviews) On February 23, 2007, valliebeth17 Crown Point, NY (Zone 4b) wrote: I have been ordering seeds from them for three years now, and this has become my absolute favorite seed supplier. Only once there was an item out of stock, late in the season, and I was given full credit for it. I also love the catalog for it's wonderful information, I have learned a lot from simply reading it! Positive urbanhick (5 reviews) On February 7, 2007, urbanhick Beverly Hills, CA wrote: The very model of a good seed company: extensive selection, one of the most informative catalogues in the business, low prices, incredibly cheap and fast shipping (orders to Canada have often arrived within 8 days of ordering). Seed is always clean, and germination rates are as listed in the catalogue. Extremely prompt customer service. I have ordered from this company for 5 years, small to large orders, and the seeds have frequently arrived before I have even recieved order acknowledgements from other companies. Vote with you cash, and support companies like this. Positive ricebeagle (2 reviews) On February 3, 2007, ricebeagle Sunbury, OH wrote: Last year I ordered over a dozen packets of seeds, including flowers and vegetables. No ordering or delivery problems, I received everything promptly. Germination was fantastic. Prices are incomparable. The catalog itself is a wonder. It has no pictures, but includes hundreds and hundreds and hundreds of flowers and vegetables you will not find anywhere else. I spend months reading and re-reading this catalog just to learn new things. I particularly like that all items are denoted by family, genus, and species. I look forward to purchasing more items from them. Positive cannaqueen (19 reviews) On January 31, 2007, cannaqueen Mantua, OH (Zone 5a) wrote: It pays to order their catalog. One can learn much by reading about all the different kinds of plants one can explore. I have ordered from them for many years and not been disappointed. Germination rates from tobacco, datura, hibiscus and cotton seeds have been great. Prices are very resonable with shipping charges that are minimal..... On January 15th, 2008, cannaqueen added the following: 1/14/08: Just received an order from this company that was well packaged and on time....packets had adequate directions on them....this is a great place to try the unique and varied species of plants...... Positive balvenie (8 reviews) On January 29, 2007, balvenie Marysville, WA (Zone 7a) wrote: I placed my first order with this company, two packets of Gunnera manicata, and received them promptly. A catalog, order form and return envelope was included with my seeds. This is a place I'll surely visit for seeds now. Positive Stevea07 (3 reviews) On January 23, 2007, Stevea07 Florence, AL wrote: I placed an order and got immediate confirmation of my order via e-mail. The next day they notified me my order had shipped. I live on the opposite side of the country from them and received my seeds in five days. Later, I e-mailed them about some other seeds I was interested in and got a prompt informative reply. I would use them again and recommend them to anyone. Positive Audrey (13 reviews) On January 20, 2007, Audrey Hadley, PA (Zone 5a) wrote: I've ordered from the J. L. Hudson company for years, and love the wide selection and very reasonable prices. Their charge for shipping is the lowest I've seen, which allows me to get even more seeds! Neutral DonShirer (13 reviews) On December 29, 2006, DonShirer Westbrook, CT (Zone 6a) wrote: I placed my first order with them last spring with mixed results. Gaura, centaurea, platycodon and lobelia did well. Several other perennials germinated but did poorly after transplanting. This may not be their fault since our soil is generally poor, and I may not have enriched it enough. Their Bulls Blood Beet and (surprisingly) Viola Tricolor did not germinate well. I may order from them again, since their catalog is quite informative, but at present I cannot give them a standing ovation. Company representative comment on February 28, 2007: On Feb 20, 2007 8:04 PM, J.L. Hudson, Seedsman added: Mr. Shirer placed his request January 16th, and his seeds were mailed January 20th, 2006. We heard nothing more from him until seeing his remarks on Garden Watchdog. The seeds supplied were good - the Bull's Blood Beet had germination well over the USDA Federal Standard of 80%, and the Viola had close to its maximum germination of about 25% (see below). When people complain to us, we don't mind - we thank them! I've always said that the rare valid complaint about seed germination is worth $1000 - if a bad lot somehow slips by our quality control program, or particular lot of seed "goes off" in between regular scheduled germination tests, and a client brings this to our attention, we can pull the lot, retest it, and stop distribution if bad. This helps prevent others from having a bad experience, and keeps our reputation intact. Even an invalid complaint about germination is worth $100 - because by replacing the seed and explaining to the client what might have gone wrong in the sowing of the seed, we can both help the client achieve better success with seeds, and show them that the seed was not at fault, and that we take seed quality seriously. But if the client never tells us that they had poor germination, we have no chance of making things right. Unfortunately, Mr. Shirer never contacted us at all about these seeds. We wish he had! If he had, we would have reported that the Bull's Blood Beet that he ordered in January 2006 had given 85% when tested just two months before in November 2005, and gave 92% tested June 2007, and gave 96% tested in December 2006 (yes, many seeds go up in germination for several years before they start to go down). Certainly if he had no germination, something was wrong in the conditions when he sowed them. If he had contacted us, we would have gladly sent him another packet to try, and reported to him the results of our test. The Viola tricolor Sawyer's Black is a tricky one to germinate, and under the best of conditions it usually gives only low germination. Violas can be very tricky, some requiring a prechill, exposure to light, or treatment with GA-3 in order to get germination. Under our description of this seed, we clearly note that it has naturally low germination. Again, we would have sent him another packet with suggestions on how to get better results. His poor results are no reflection on his skill - he got good results from the Gaura, another kind that is often tricky to germinate. Seeds are living things and even the best among us will have unexplained failures of germination. Even in our laboratory tests under controlled conditions we sometimes have unexplainable failures, with the same seed giving good results when retested. As we pros say "Go figure!" So I urge everyone to always, always complain, but be sure you contact the supplier FIRST - don't publicly complain about someone unless you have contacted them first, and given them a chance to fix any problem. All mail-order suppliers are concerned about their reputations, and it is unfair to diminish their reputation without contacting them first. We are glad Mr. Shirer only gave us a "Neutral" rating (rather than Negative), and he also showed his honesty by mentioning that his soil might have been at fault. Rule of thumb - don't publicly complain about someone until you have contacted them and given them a chance to fix whatever the problem - it's only fair. Please, send a friendly report of your results, and you will receive a friendly, helpful reply in return!

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