SOLVED: mystery flower

Port Harcourt, Nigeria

can anyone recognise this?

Thumbnail by portharcourt
St. John's, NL(Zone 5b)

Looks like a member of the Liliaceae to me...6 petals, thick substance.

Port Harcourt, Nigeria

It is tropical, (I'm in Nigeria), about 4-5" ovate-ish leaves about 6". Forms long green buds, swollen at end which open out into the flower. don't think it's Schizanthus or Mimulus. Shrub currently about 2-3m high. will check out Liliacaceae

Moab, UT(Zone 6b)

Wow, that is one gorgeous, huge flower. We're gonna be glad you joined and WELCOME to DG - glad to have you here. ~Blooms

Santiago, Chile(Zone 9b)

Welcome to DG!!!!

Beautiful flower, please keep posting.

Tellico Plains, TN(Zone 7b)

Georgous huge flower ! Thanks for sharing.

More , more , more photos !............ lol

Welcome to DG , looking forward to more of your posts.

Shirley

Deep South Coastal, TX(Zone 10a)

It sure is pretty. I hope someone comes along that knows what it is.

Millersburg, PA(Zone 6b)

The calyx/style is unusual. Please let us know if it is ID'd.

(Zone 9b)

I not only want to know what it is, but where can get one! LOL

Northern, IN

Me too, kell.

Fremont, CA(Zone 9a)

Just got a very nice new Wayside Gardens catalog. It shows Lilium majoense. Check [[email protected]] and see if it looks like a match.
I also just ran across this site with some very nice Lily photos. My German is more than a bit rusty, but by clicking around you will find a very nice assortment of lily photos and scientific names. http://members.surfeu.de/fuliro/ga.htm click on "lilien" below the main photo

Welcome to DG, PortHarcourt.

Moab, UT(Zone 6b)

This is no lily... doesn't 2-3m translate to 6-9ft???

I agree it's not a Lily, a friend pointed out that the stamen and stigma arrangement is similar to Gardenia, which is in the Rubiaceae. Unfortunately Rubiaceae is very variable and many plants are little written about but I think that they are right on the family.

Port Harcourt, Nigeria

Thank you so much for your suggestions. I thought it came closest to looking like a lily but It is too pink to be the Lilium Majoense. Now realise it probably isn't a lily, being so tall and as veins are not parallel, ( I'm a novice) will try & get a photo of the leaf. Will check out Rubiaceae

Santa Ana, CA(Zone 9b)

I found a little introduction to botanical nomenclature that I thought interesting:
[[* Choripetalae are plants having flowers with their petals (or comparable flower leaves) not joined. Except for the Juniper (and other introduced pine family members) all larger woody species (willows, birches) on Iceland belong to this group. But also many others, like Rose family, Buttercup family, Primrose family, Pink family, Saxifrage family and many others.
* Sympetalae have petals fused at the base or even much upward. Example: Gentian family, Mint family, Bellflower family, Figwort family, Heather family, Daisy family, etc.]]

There was not an inclusive list of all the families belonging to the two groups. But I believe that lilies (Lilium family) would fall in the first mentioned category and portharcourt's flower obviously Sympetalae. And yes, Rubiaceae is within the second group, but it seems quite a number of familes are.

But tell me, are the stamens (pollen bearing heads) actually ATTACHED to the corolla (petals) as they appear to be, or are there thin weak filaments I am not seeing? If attached -- surely this must be characteristic of a rather limited number of families, genera, species....

PortH -- in addition to the leaf: a flower from the side, a branch showing positioning of the leaves (and buds), and a long shot of the shrub showing general shape/spread -- would all be useful.

~'spin!~
The quote is from this Dutch site, giving forematter for a treatment of the flora of Iceland.
http://www1.bos.nl/~dvuijk/plants/taxonomy1.html

Santa Ana, CA(Zone 9b)

P.S.
Also, does this plant occur in a cultivated area, or does it appear to be native to Nigeria?

~'spin!~

Port Harcourt, Nigeria

The stamens are attached to the corolla

Thumbnail by portharcourt
Port Harcourt, Nigeria

and this is the whole shrub, a bit straggly as it isn't in a very sunny position

Thumbnail by portharcourt
Port Harcourt, Nigeria

and the leaves

Thumbnail by portharcourt
San Antonio, TX(Zone 8b)

Thanks for the additional photos (Really great ones, I might add) and information. They will be very helpful as we search for its ID. I have been searching and searching for it. The blooms are sooo beautiful.

Port Harcourt, Nigeria

Will have to wait for the next bud, it is not a native plant, of the 89 plants I've so far identified in the garden (nearly all of them) only 3 are native to West Africa, so I am sure this isn't especially as I haven't seen it in any of the other gardens here.

Thumbnail by portharcourt
Lake Toxaway, NC(Zone 7a)

How large is that flower?

Port Harcourt, Nigeria

about 4 - 5" across

Lake Toxaway, NC(Zone 7a)

Drooling here.

Frederick, MD(Zone 6a)

This has been a real mystery! It's also been educational - learned so much in searching for this one. While doing so stumbled on to this site that let me look by photos - nope, didn't find yours there, but some of you may want to bookmark it. Someone let me know if it should not be posted and I will edit asap.

http://farrer.riv.csu.edu.au/ASGAP/gallery.html#list

The hunt continues :)

Port Harcourt, Nigeria

brilliant web site... still hunting here..

Lake Toxaway, NC(Zone 7a)

wow, what eye candy. And the names are funny, i.e. kangaroo paw

Northern, IN

How about some special prize for the person who finally IDs this beauty?

San Antonio, TX(Zone 8b)

This one is a real challenge!

Port Harcourt, Nigeria

Well there is this web site to identify plants http://www.colby.edu/info.tech/BI211/PlantFamilyID.html and then a botanical dictionary to translate all the botanical terminolgy, http://www.calflora.net/botanicalnames/botanicalterms.html but I am not getting very far. Need a fully fledged botanist. Even more worrying no more buds. This is the last flower for now. We are into the Harmattan season, a wind laden with sand from the Sahara reduces the sunlight , so I don't think it will flower for a couple of months

Thumbnail by portharcourt
Floresville, TX(Zone 9a)

That's a beautiful flower, I'll definitely be watching this thread to see if it's identified.

Santa Ana, CA(Zone 9b)

Well, keep us updated on what the flower "becomes" as it fades -- a seed pod or seed at all might turn on someone's lightbulb!
~'spin!~

Castro Valley, CA(Zone 9a)

Absolutely gorgeous!!!!!!! Hope someone figures it out, I'd grow one too!
Porthacourt, a warm welcome to DG, and we hope many more flowers, Annie

Port Harcourt, Nigeria

The flower looks similar in shape colour & texture, but that one has just 5 petals and I cannot see if the stamens are attached to the petals like my flower. Also those leaves are shinier, longer and thinner, my flower did have a slight scent, a bit gardenia ish, and initially I looked at this picture & thought it must be a close relative, but now i'm not so sure. I will keep looking.

Port Harcourt, Nigeria

p.s. I see the first photo does have six petals, and when you open the others they all have 5!! so must have been taking photos of two species. or can flowers of the same species have different numbers of petals?

Santa Ana, CA(Zone 9b)

Boot! I think it *is* getting closer! You know, it crossed my mind to wonder if the flower ALWAYS had six parts/petals... the pic you link to shows mostly five petals, with one four and one six! And, appears white or mostly white to my eye... As was the one at
http://members.aol.com/jstgerlach/plants.htm
where I learned that Rothmannia annae is an endangered species endemic to the Seychelles Islands...

So I searched on the genus and found some that are native to Africa and, PortH -- this may be number 4 for natives, as I have this quote from the Botanical Dermatology Database (u.k.):
"Rothmannia -- 20 species are found in tropical and southern Africa. Rothmannia longiflora -- The fruits yield a black dye which is used in Nigeria for making blue-black markings on the face or body (Oliver 1961)."
http://bodd.cf.ac.uk/BotDermFolder/BotDermR/RUBI.html

Other species names I found for Zambia, Zimbabwe, Tanzania, Uganda, and unspecified: englerana, fischerii (subsp. fischeri & subsp. moramballae), whitfieldii, capensis, globosa, longiflora, urcelliformis, manganjae. I.e. about 8 out of the 20 cited.

Now, flowers in these three pics all appear predominately white,
R.capensis:
http://www.plantzafrica.com/plantqrs/rothmancapen.htm
R.globosa:
http://www.nbi.ac.za/pretoria/pretoria%20images/sprothmani.jpg
R.longiflora:
http://www.geocities.co.jp/HeartLand-Keyaki/3447/E_r_l.html

However! I was quite excited to see the last one, as it showed the adnate-to-embedded stamens like portH's! I'd hate to say how long I spent looking for ANY flower with this feature! AND, although this specimen is identified as R.longiflora I'm wondering if it is (or if the coloration of R.longi is variable?) -- because! here is a drawing (on a Gambia postage stamp) of R.longiflora showing SIGNIFICANT dark red streaks on a cream background. The stamens are rather artistically drawn and not conclusive, and the large style/stigma/pistil is missing from the drawing, but it IS "just" a drawing.
http://lvgira.narod.ru/africa/rothmannia.htm

I would bet money that it is FOR SURE a Rothmannia which is (naturally) a RUBIACEAE -- and as Baa noted, many members thereof are not well documented. So the species may or may not even be mentioned here... although longiflora is linked to Nigeria by the one reference...
~'spin!~
I will tell you, Baa, the similarity of this FLOWER to my garden gardenia was *lost* on me... altho' the *leaves* did sway me to focus my (unsuccessful) search on the Rubiaceae... a final quote -- from the Journal of the Tree Society of Zimbabwe: "BOTANIC GARDEN WALK: 4 MAY 2002 -- The subject was, for the last time, the difficult family, Rubiaceae. " Huh!

This message was edited Dec 8, 2004 10:46 PM

Santa Ana, CA(Zone 9b)

PortH:
SOME plants' flowers can vary in number of petals -- a recent reference photo of a clematis in this forum for example, also had 4, 5, or 6 petals like boot's Rothmannia link.

kell and others: while I suspect that the Rothmannia's offered are likely to be white, maybe white with *some* dots or streaks, there is a source (in Hawaii) for R.globosa
http://www.pctgardens.com/xcart/customer/product.php?productid=178&cat=1&page=1
however, because it is a plant in SOIL, it cannot be shipped to California, Texas, Louisiana, or Arizona.

Sandeman Seeds in France has seeds (9 euro for 100) for R.globosa and R.capensis... plus, no doubt, shipping from France! So, how much does anyone want, not actually THIS plant, but a related one? (R.capensis is also quite exotic looking, with longer petals/more of the petals longer beyond the funnel-form connate/attached part.)
~'spin!~
Forgot the second link
http://www.sandemanseeds.com/acatalog/General_R.html

This message was edited Dec 8, 2004 10:59 PM

Port Harcourt, Nigeria

Thanks so much to everyone, i am learning so much about flowers through this one. it must be a Rothmannia of somekind, and as suggested above, native which is why it doesn't feature any where as so little research of flora has been done in this area. I've emailed the pics to a reseach place in Calabar, hope to get a reply. Have just taken photo of dead flower which I'll post later.

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